Wolverine vs Batman

Originally posted by Ize19
🙁 I think you're right. How people can have the evidence laid out right in front of them, and still ignore it is beyond me, but that's definitely what they're doing. Lol. It's like everytime we debate, we have to remind them how the healing factor works. Oh well, I'm off to work soon, so I'll see if it's worth continuing the fight when I get back. Later.

What on earth are you talking about? Do you know there were these alien creatures that were capable of taking bullets and explosives but Captain America was able to take out these aliens with his fists?

Your simply not listening and just trying to spin things the way you want. Just because you can take bullets and explosions doesnt mean you can't get Koed by a top tier martial artist.

Originally posted by Ize19
Wow. That wasn't "plain bullets." Wolverien was cut, he was burned, he was shot, he was blown up, he was pounded on repeatedly by 3 of the most dangerous assassins in the world, I mean, it's not even close.

Earlier in his career, with a much weaker healing factor, up against the master swordsman Shingen, he needed to be poisoned before the fight began, and even then, Shingen, who was using a bokan, not his bare hands, needed to focus exclusively on killing pressure points and weak parts of his body to put Wolverine down in as many blows.

The fact that you think that a Wolverine with a much, MUCH stronger healing factor than he had back then, had a healing factor that was operating at full capacity, and he still went down, in the same number of blows, to somebody who was fighting him bare handed, and even wasted time throwing him, rather than directing all of his attacks to his body's weak points, is ridiculous.

LOOK at the above scans one more time. Look at how much damage is done to Wolverine in his initial fight. Then look at what Mr. X did. It's not even close. Only bias can say otherwise.

I read the comic you putz. You need to look again at how much damage Wolverine actually takes, at the interludes and then try and factor in this healing factor you worship day and night.

From this:
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/478/wolverinev1ch15910.jpg
To this:
http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/4539/wolverinev1ch15913.jpg

Wolverine has hardly been injured at all. He was not in the car when he exploded, and his clothes did not catch fire. We can see that there are no bullet wounds and that his shirt hasn't even been ripped. So by the 9th scan, Wolverine has only taken a couple of bullet wounds to the torso. Mind you, this would do nothing to Batman, who can take machine-gun fire at point blank.

Now when he actually gets into the fight with Mr.X' henchmen, there's not that much damage being dished out either. Wolverine has also got a minute or so to heal whatever damage he took earlier on, and there's the interlude of him making his way up to the sarge. In the fight against those "top assassins" he takes one stab to the throat, a bullet or two in the back, some punches from Blok, and three kicks from those girls. This happens over the course of what? 10-15 minutes? You of any people should understand how much this is to Wolverine, how much it matters that he is given some recovery time. Two punches in rapid succession will naturally do a hell of a lot more damage to him, than one punch 20 second pause and another punch.

And do you realize that we've reached the point of counting punches? Nobody should have a hard time realizing that a kick from those girls, can hardly measure up against a kick from Mr.X. In fact, I would bet that a single kick from Mr.X does more damage than 10 kicks from that one girl.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
No its perfectly logical.

You just said that Wolverine's durability is more supportable to martial artists attacks. How is that logical? The reason that MAs are - on a few rare occasions - able to temporally stun or slow down Bricks, is because the durability doesn't. Most Bricks (most comic characters period), regardless of their durability, still function the same way that a human does and for the most part their internally organs haven't received the same level of near invulnerability as their outer layers; there are a few obviously exceptions to this, but that is generally the case. Because of this MA's are able get a degree of success with nerve strikes, pressure point attacks, and abilities that work on the internal level, and because despite massive durability the recovery time of most Bricks is more or less in line with baseline human, this allows some relative success. None of that applies to Wolverine. He has compartively low durability but a high regenerative factor, something that works on a Brick isn't going to necessarily necessarily work on him.

Originally posted by Ize19
🙁 I think you're right. How people can have the evidence laid out right in front of them, and still ignore it is beyond me, but that's definitely what they're doing. Lol. It's like everytime we debate, we have to remind them how the healing factor works. Oh well, I'm off to work soon, so I'll see if it's worth continuing the fight when I get back. Later.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
You just said that Wolverine's durability is more supportable to martial artists attacks. How is that logical? The reason that MAs are - on a few rare occasions - able to temporally stun or slow down Bricks, is because the durability doesn't. Most Bricks (most comic characters period), regardless of their durability, still function the same way that a human does and for the most part their internally organs haven't received the same level of near invulnerability as their outer layers; there are a few obviously exceptions to this, but that is generally the case. Because of this MA's are able get a degree of success with nerve strikes, pressure point attacks, and abilities that work on the internal level, and because despite massive durability the recovery time of most Bricks is more or less in line with baseline human, this allows some relative success. None of that applies to Wolverine.

Stating that it doesnt apply to Wolverine doesn't make it so. You cant just decide its PIS when numerous martial arts experts have been shown to be able to do it. At the end of the day top tier martial arts can do amazing shit and there are enough showings to indicate its possible.

Besides people sometimes have different resistances to different things. Some people can take massive blunt force trauma but are susceptible to bullets, there are enough showings to indiace a highly skilled MA can Ko Wolverine.

wait, did I get that right? His healing factor has limits in form of recovering time? Means if he would get burned down to the ground let's say 20 times he will die?

Did Wolverine eat or drink before the fight, it didn't show that he did, that explains everything.

First tier martial artists are all potentially extremely deadly. Ogun - for example - was able to kill Water Buffalo with a causal pat, one can imagine what he could do while going all out. I think we all attribute this, as well as examples MA's temporally stunning Bricks to pressure point and nerve strikes.

What a pressure point does is subtlety deliver damage internal that bypasses the inherent outward durability of character. A punch from the Hulk (or Spider-man for that matter) is doing the same sort of damage to Wolverine, only on massive scale all over his body all at once. Wolverine doesn't have any sizable amount of superhuman durability, if he gets punched by the Hulk, its the same as if the Hulk punched you or me, massive organ failure, ruptures and perhaps liquidations, through out Wolverine's body entire body with every blow. The force of Hulk simply swinging his arms, even if he missed would do more damage than a pressure point or nerve strike.

Batman wins 7/10 in a dazzling display of bad-assery which includes sonics, tasers, high-powered explosives, laser cutters, and bat-kicks to the face.

The other 3 wins come from Batman flattening Wolverine in his Batmobile after dancing around Wolverine for 30 minutes.

Originally posted by grimify
Batman wins 7/10 in a dazzling display of bad-assery which includes sonics, tasers, high-powered explosives, laser cutters, and bat-kicks to the face.

The other 3 wins come from Batman flattening Wolverine in his Batmobile after dancing around Wolverine for 30 minutes.

Originally posted by grimify
Batman wins 7/10 in a dazzling display of bad-assery which includes sonics, tasers, high-powered explosives, laser cutters, and bat-kicks to the face.

The other 3 wins come from Batman flattening Wolverine in his Batmobile after dancing around Wolverine for 30 minutes.

It must be nice to be uninhibited by such archaic notions as fact, reason, common sense and reality. Although, I suspect there are unused bottles of prescription medication somewhere your doctors would loved to know about...

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
First tier martial artists are all potentially extremely deadly. Ogun - for example - was able to kill Water Buffalo with a causal pat, one can imagine what he could do while going all out. I think we all attribute this, as well as examples MA's temporally stunning Bricks to pressure point and nerve strikes.

What a pressure point does is subtlety deliver damage internal that bypasses the inherent outward durability of character. A punch from the Hulk (or Spider-man for that matter) is doing the same sort of damage to Wolverine, only on massive scale all over his body all at once. Wolverine doesn't have any sizable amount of superhuman durability, if he gets punched by the Hulk, its the same as if the Hulk punched you or me, massive organ failure, ruptures and perhaps liquidations, through out Wolverine's body entire body with every blow. The force of Hulk simply swinging his arms, even if he missed would do more damage than a pressure point or nerve strike.

Er no. Bullets and explosive should be more effective than an MAs fists but time and time again this hasn't been the case. I know were talking about class 100 punches but im simply pointing out that just because something produces more force doesnt neccsarily mean they are more effective.

Furthermore I could argue that its PIS for Wolverine to take class 100 shots, knives and bullets make him bleed logically a class 100 punch should make all the flash fly off his bones.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Er no. Bullets and explosive should be more effective than an MAs fists but time and time again this hasn't been the case. I know were talking about class 100 punches but im simply pointing out that just because something produces more force doesnt neccsarily mean they are more effective.

Bullets and explosives don't have the force needed to penetrate the outer layer of durability of most Bricks. Nerve strikes and pressure points however are subtle attacks that bypass the external durability all together an do internal damage, seemingly regardless of the amount force behind. It's like comparing a heart attack or a stroke to a missile. The Thing can shrug off a missile but his body still functions like yours or mine, and a heart attack or burst appendix would have the same affect as it would on a normal human, his outward durability just doesn't factor in.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Furthermore I could argue that its PIS for Wolverine to take class 100 shots, knives and bullets make him bleed logically a class 100 punch should make all the flash fly off his bones.

It's been said in the narrative that every blow from the Hulk liquefies Wolverine's organs. Keep in mind that Wolverine isn't in a MAX book, and he isn't in Wildstorm, the majority of Wolverine appearances are in T+ rated books (and some are A or even All Ages), Marvel has two ratings higher than this, so the violence that can be depicted regarding Wolverine is somewhat limited. What is actually happening and what has been drawn isn't always the same thing, you need to use your imagination in some cases.

And since the vast, VAST, majority of Wolverine feats are off him taking class 100 blows, hails of gun fire, explotions and stabbings with little or no effect, if you argued it was PIS, you wouldn't have a leg to stand on.

EDIT: lol I said you wouldnt have a leg to "stab on."

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
It must be nice to be uninhibited by such archaic notions as fact, reason, common sense and reality. Although, I suspect there are unused bottles of prescription medication somewhere your doctors would loved to know about...

It is pretty nice, actually.

It's also funny to hear about common sense coming from a Wolverine fanboy. 🙂

Originally posted by grimify
It is pretty nice, actually.

It's also funny to hear about common sense coming from a Wolverine fanboy. 🙂

I understand the need to call names, since you are surely intimidated by seemingly unsurpassed knowledge of all street level characters, but don't fret friend, it's easy to be like me! You just need be handsome, smart and to base your all your opinions on fact and logic, and a thorough comparison of the both character's and their best feats. Simple! It might seem like foreign notion to you I'm sure, since you apparently to type out your posts using the boner you get from watching The Dark Knight, but its easy to do! I would suggest you get started by reading comics. Then you can be best buds with me and Phantom Zone. 😎

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I understand the need to call names, since you are surely intimidated by seemingly unsurpassed knowledge of all street level characters, but don't fret friend, it's easy to be like me! You just need be handsome, smart and to base your all your opinions on fact and logic, and a thorough comparison of the both character's and their best feats. Simple! It might seem like foreign notion to you I'm sure, since you apparently to type out your posts using the boner you get from watching The Dark Knight, but its easy to do! I would suggest you get started by reading comics. Then you can be best buds with me and Phantom Zone. 😎

Hey, it's a pretty impressive feat to type with my boner. I am proud of that fact. Maybe one day you will have such control over your phallus, but I doubt it.

Originally posted by grimify
Hey, it's a pretty impressive feat to type with my boner. I am proud of that fact. Maybe one day you will have such control over your phallus, but I doubt it.

But I've been doing all sorts of exercises, and everything! 😮

I play banjo with mine.

Well... that explains the calluses.

Or does it? 😉