DC's Hermes vs The Runner

Started by Chopsum6 pages
Chopsum Restricted
Originally posted by Zeuodin
Written feats on their own hold no weight. One has to use applied math principles or the feat means nothing. Superman flew from Vega To earth in seconds. Easily hundreds of thousands of times faster than Light.

Right, lets apply real life principles to justify fictional short stories of characters whose abilities are constantly embellished upon to create grandiose plots for "super" heroes.

Next we need to apply real math principles to characters abilities to see if that makes sense as well...........next month will be alot of dead super heroes if we did that.

Writer's intent is more important then attempting to quantify a power set using math when their powers don't even make sense in rl to begin with.

Zeuodin Restricted

Originally posted by Chopsum
Right, lets apply real life principles to justify fictional short stories of characters whose abilities are constantly embellished upon to create grandiose plots for "super" heroes.

Next we need to apply real math principles to characters abilities to see if that makes sense as well...........next month will be alot of dead super heroes if we did that.

Writer's intent is more important then attempting to quantify a power set using math when their powers don't even make sense in rl to begin with.

Then the writer's intent in the flash case is unknown. He gave the numbers. He gave the math. His intent was very well the speed in which the numbers give. The fact that he didn't know what the speed of light was lends us to believe he was just ignorant. And he thought the speed of light was the fastest you could go. Now as for the Odin example, If the latter writer says all of Odin's power plus two other skyfather's could only shake a planet, then obviously Odin lost a great deal of power. I choose to NOT believe that. Written Hyperbole has no weight with me. Not without context and history to back it up.

King Kandy Senior Member

Originally posted by Zeuodin
We saw dead galaxies. But we also saw Odin with three other Gods put all their Might into a blow that could knock a Planet out of orbit. Written feats on their own hold no weight. One has to use applied math principles or the feat means nothing. Superman flew from Vega To earth in seconds. Easily hundreds of thousands of times faster than Light.

We saw them put their force into a blow that had no effect on a celestial, though it could knock a planet out of orbit. Obviously quite a bit different than actually seeing galaxies and stars reignite, in that this was a written statement comparing something we're seeing to something we aren't seeing.

Written feats may have no weight. But neither does mathematical extrapolation. IMO, only if someone is shown to be capable of something in writing, or you actually see him doing it, should you even consider going with far-out math values.

Zeuodin Restricted

Originally posted by King Kandy
We saw them put their force into a blow that had no effect on a celestial, though it could knock a planet out of orbit. Obviously quite a bit different than actually seeing galaxies and stars reignite, in that this was a written statement comparing something we're seeing to something we aren't seeing.

Written feats may have no weight. But neither does mathematical extrapolation. IMO, only if someone is shown to be capable of something in writing, or you actually see him doing it, should you even consider going with far-out math values.

Superman was shown flying from Vega to earth in seconds. So obviously he canfly far far faster than Light. But yet he couldn't keep up with flash and Zoom. So obviously they were going faster. We've already seen flash beat teleportation. We know he goes way faster than light.

King Kandy Senior Member

Or, the writer had no clue that it took C+ speeds to do that feat. That could be it as well. Seriously though, if you can find me even one instant of it being stated supes has C+ speed, i'll shut up.

In the beating teleportation feat, what he actually did was run faster than the guy could process the though to use teleportation. The guy didn't teleport, and flash took off and got there before he finished.

Juntai Divine Vengeance

Originally posted by Galan007
until more current information contradicts it, i'll stick with jay's factoid.
That was pretty much a throwback to Jack Kirby's run on New Gods, in which Lightray going faster than light foiled Black Racer.

Wally has time-traveled, you go faster than light to do that in DC. Black Flash even raced him across the timestream.

Juntai Divine Vengeance

Originally posted by King Kandy
Or, the writer had no clue that it took C+ speeds to do that feat. That could be it as well. Seriously though, if you can find me even one instant of it being stated supes has C+ speed, i'll shut up.
I love the double-standard in people doing that in Marvel constitutes going ftl, while in DC, the writer simply didn't know better.

seconds later, and lightyears away..

kgkg Vigilante

Is this a race or a fight?

King Kandy Senior Member

Originally posted by Juntai
I love the double-standard in people doing that in Marvel constitutes going ftl, while in DC, the writer simply didn't know better.

seconds later, and lightyears away..


If this is about that sentry feat, in my present state of mind I wouldn't consider that a very valid showing either.

psycho gundam The Nightmare of Solomon

Originally posted by Juntai
I love the double-standard in people doing that in Marvel constitutes going ftl, while in DC, the writer simply didn't know better.

seconds later, and lightyears away..

...don't go there dawg

kevdude The Hooded Man

Originally posted by Juntai
I love the double-standard in people doing that in Marvel constitutes going ftl, while in DC, the writer simply didn't know better.

seconds later, and lightyears away..

👆 Love the way you put it.

About DC Deaths they go as followed.

Black Flash represents the Dark Aspect of the Speed Force.

Black Racer is the "Death as an Inevitability".

Nekron is "Death as the Ultimate Opponent."

Death of The Endless resembles a Death as Release. This version of Death seems to be the most knowledgeable and with Gaimen also denying it she is the ultimate personification of Death.

Batman-Prime Kryptonian Scientist

Originally posted by Juntai
I love the double-standard in people doing that in Marvel constitutes going ftl, while in DC, the writer simply didn't know better.

seconds later, and lightyears away..

😆

Colossus-Big C Restricted

Originally posted by Galan007
👆

here's the feat just for the lulz:
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/3379/flash1k.jpg
http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/1079/flash2c.jpg

flash carried over 500,000 people, 35 miles away (so a 70 mile round trip) in .00001 microseconds.

even if he carried two people every single trip, it still works out to a ludicrous amount beyond c (thousands of times beyond, iirc.)

...yet the writer indicated wally was not even traveling at c. idiot.

if you do the math that should be at least 1000times the speed of light

Colossus-Big C Restricted

Originally posted by Chopsum

How many other feats does the flash have to back up that lvl of speed consistently
he covering every single inch of the planet in 0.01 seconds and superman seemed like a statue to him.
he beat the speed of instant teleportation

Galan007 |Quantum Observer|

Originally posted by King Kandy
All numbers mean is he threw out a bunch of numbers to make Flash seem impressive. He didn't know what they added up to (I think he even admitted it in response to a letter later). He wanted flash to go just under lightspeed, and all the numbers represent is "wow look Flash is really amazing guyz!"
i agree.

while it's true that we as readers can certainly apply real world logic and mathematics to the numbers that were given, allowing us to easily discern the fact that flash was moving FAR in excess of light speed (distance/time = speed.)

however, the writer also gave us the speed he personally intended flash to be moving in that instance (ie. sub-c.) and in the end, defined writer intent is incontrovertible - it trumps all else.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Was there ever a time where superman was ever stated on panel to be faster than light? Just curious.
during "superman/batman" it was stated that superman could travel FTL, but simply chose not to in accordance with the task at hand:
http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/9855/supesjlamx9.jpg

psycho gundam The Nightmare of Solomon

Originally posted by Galan007
during "superman/batman" it was stated that superman could travel FTL, but simply chose not to in accordance with the task at hand:
http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/9855/supesjlamx9.jpg
i kinda like to separate superman/batman away from the core books cause it's kinda stupid at times.

in the scan above the narration makes it seems as if going faster than light is a big deal for him, and beating the shadow moon by superman punching it was almost a kamakazi maneuver. 😬

Philosophía "The devil made me do it"

That's from the JLA book, actually. And we don't need a statement for something that's been blatantly obvious for quite some time now.

Galan007 |Quantum Observer|

Originally posted by psycho gundam
in the scan above the narration makes it seems as if going faster than light is a big deal for him, and beating the shadow moon by superman punching it was almost a kamakazi maneuver. 😬
he asked for a statement, so i gave him a statement.

stop nitpicking. ermm

Tazer Senior Member

Yo.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
This isn't flash. This is the God Hermes.

right, but see thats my point: Hermes IIRC *was* faster than Wally-Flash, and Wally (at the time) was as fast as Barry.

Tazer

K Von Doom Second fiddle
Originally posted by Galan007

flash carried over 500,000 people, 35 miles away (so a 70 mile round trip) in .00001 microseconds.

Shouldn't that have killed the person being moved? If I grabbed or ran into someone and moved them 5 meters in 0.25 seconds, they'd have a pretty bad whiplash, bruised or their arm would be dislocated.