X-Man vs Sentry

Originally posted by TheKahn
If you think Nate is a herald level character or above, you are certainly welcomed to that opinion. Personally I've never seen Nate actually [b]fight and win against a character of that power. As for the Harvester, Nate didn't actually beat the villain in physical terms. He merged his body with the Harvester in order to poison the creature - which is slightly different that simply kicking someone's ass.
[/B]

Your partially correct about how Nate came to best the Harvester. But your not acknowledging what I stated. And that is the Harvester admitted he would lose to Nate in a physical confrontation, at the cost of the Earth. Or all life on Earth.

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/1021/hr31.jpg

You can fight me. I’m sure you’d win. But I’m part of everyone now. You hurt me, and you hurt them. Kill me, and you kill them. - The Harvester.

Originally posted by TheKahn

As for Cable vs SS, people tend to forget that SS was holding back as well. He didn't use any of the numerous powers at his disposal that could have killed or KO'ed Cable (ie molecule manipulation, creating blackholes, board entrapment, size altering, and planet destroying cosmic blasts...among others). In the end the fight ended on SS's terms and nothing about the fight suggest Cable ever had a chance.

Well it matters little, reference in regards towards Surfer vs. Cable has reached its usefulness.

Fact is X-Man can relay on more broken abilities at his disposal, that Sentry would have a hard time countering. Abilties such as intangibility, bfr, and even isolated time stoppage.

Originally posted by TheKahn
I don't think so. The way he is written only high level gods/abstracts are obviously above him. Given the way he has handled Herald level characters, I'd put him around Thanos' level of power. But that's just my opinion.

He defeated Terrax who did the serious job and laid down for Sentry. Meanwhile Sentry was taxed to the limit by WWH and before you dismiss it as saying "well everyone loses to WWH" you can't turn around and then prostitute his showing over Terrax (and we're just going to ignore the nonsense about Galactus) when everyone was losing to Sentry at that time. Not to mention Sentry has been shown to easily be removed from the field (Secret Invasion) with almost minimal effort. He also got blasted by Noah varr's gun. I don't see Thanos being removed from the field as effortlessly as the Skrull vision did. I don't see Thanos succumbing to a random Kree gun.

Bob has impressive showings but it's clear he has limitations and weaknesses.

I don't see what bob can do if Nate takes him to the astral plane, something he's done to the most powerful telepaths with ease.

And I love making matches, that could be made some time soon. Take for example Dark X-Men #3. Nate will be taking on Dark X-Men, and Dark Avengers. What’s this will we see, a possible X-Man vs. Sentry in January?peaches

DARK X-MEN # 3
The Story: Nate Grey, a.k.a., X-Man is back and he is not happy with the state of affairs in the Marvel Universe. So he goes straight to the man responsible—Norman Osborn—and it’s not for a nice chat. It’s X-Man vs. the Dark Avengers and Dark X-Men. Can this Omega class mutant survive this matchup? Find out here! Rated T …$3.99

Originally posted by id369
TBH I don’t like follow the whole Herald Level criteria. Nate as a mutant has his own classification which sounds much better. Omega Level that is. stoned

Your partially correct about how Nate came to best the Harvester. But your not acknowledging what I stated. And that is the Harvester admitted he would lose to Nate in a physical confrontation, at the cost of the Earth. Or all life on Earth.

http://img33.imageshack.us/img33/1021/hr31.jpg
[B]
You can fight me. I’m sure you’d win. But I’m part of everyone now. You hurt me, and you hurt them. Kill me, and you kill them. - The Harvester. [/B]

I'm still not sure what has you convinced that the Harvester is comparable to Marvel's other cosmic beings. IIRC, he could manipulate energy on a planetary scale, but it might take him decades to set that up. I can't remember any of his other feats off the top of my head.

Originally posted by id369

Because for all of Cables powers and limitations in that fight. Shattering the Surfers Board falls as a weak moment, where Cable clearly had no chance to ever hurt him.

Well it matters little, reference in regards towards Surfer vs. Cable has reached its usefulness.

Fact is X-Man can relay on more broken abilities at his disposal, that Sentry would have a hard time countering. Abilties such as intangibility, bfr, and even isolated time stoppage.

Those abilities might be useful, but unless X-man can find someway to counter the Sentry's speed he'll never get the chance to use any of them.

Originally posted by Tenebrous
He defeated Terrax who did the serious job and laid down for Sentry. Meanwhile Sentry was taxed to the limit by WWH and before you dismiss it as saying "well everyone loses to WWH" you can't turn around and then prostitute his showing over Terrax (and we're just going to ignore the nonsense about Galactus) when everyone was losing to Sentry at that time. Not to mention Sentry has been shown to easily be removed from the field (Secret Invasion) with almost minimal effort. He also got blasted by Noah varr's gun. I don't see Thanos being removed from the field as effortlessly as the Skrull vision did. I don't see Thanos succumbing to a random Kree gun.

Bob has impressive showings but it's clear he has limitations and weaknesses.

I don't see what bob can do if Nate takes him to the astral plane, something he's done to the most powerful telepaths with ease.

I'm not saying that Bob can't be manipulated mentally - he can. But those instances have occurred under a specific context and not by someone who was in the act of fighting the Sentry. As for why the Kree gun worked, I have no logical explanation and as far as I know Marvel hasn't come up with one. But claiming people are jobbing to the Sentry when his power has been described as "limitless" and "god-like" by numerous characters on numerous occasions (I counted about half a dozen in a few pages of the respect thread) doesn't make sense to me.

Also, Morgan La Fey tried to kill/BFR in Dark Avengers and it didn't stick.

Originally posted by TheKahn
I'm still not sure what has you convinced that the Harvester is comparable to Marvel's other cosmic beings. IIRC, he could manipulate energy on a planetary scale, but it might take him decades to set that up. I can't remember any of his other feats off the top of my head.

Just to give you an idea, look how Sentry fared when he took on the Collective. Then you begin to realize, that the Harverster was no joke.

Originally posted by TheKahn

Those abilities might be useful, but unless X-man can find someway to counter the Sentry's speed he'll never get the chance to use any of them.

Why not? Respectively Nate has flown from to Earth’s orbit and back in a quick manner.

Originally posted by id369
And I love making matches, that could be made some time soon. Take for example Dark X-Men #3. Nate will be taking on Dark X-Men, and Dark Avengers. What’s this will we see, a possible X-Man vs. Sentry in January?peaches

DARK X-MEN # 3
The Story: Nate Grey, a.k.a., X-Man is back and he is not happy with the state of affairs in the Marvel Universe. So he goes straight to the man responsible—Norman Osborn—and it’s not for a nice chat. It’s X-Man vs. the Dark Avengers and Dark X-Men. Can this Omega class mutant survive this matchup? Find out here! Rated T …$3.99

I'm looking forward to it. It seems like Marvel is going to give Nate another powerboost. It will be interesting to see the Sentry take on a high level telepath/psi user in a straight up fight.

Why would you think, Nate is going to recivie a power boost? g_twitch

Originally posted by id369
It matters little if Harvester needs to take time to set up that power. What matters is he had, all assimilated himself to the entire planet by the time he fought Nate. That’s a lot of power considering its Pre-House of M.

Just to give you an idea, look how Sentry fared when he took on the Collective. Then you begin to realize, that the Harverster was no joke.

I'm not saying the Harvester is some weakling. Simply that other cosmic characters (such as heralds) have been shown to manipulate energy/matter on a global scale almost instantly. Baring any other feats from the Harvester, this puts him on a significantly lower tier. But that's just my opinion.

Originally posted by id369

Why not? Respectively Nate has flown from to Earth’s orbit and back in a quick manner.

Originally posted by id369
Why would you think, Nate is going to recivie a power boost? g_twitch

IIRC Bendis' description of Nate in the latest was something like "godly sunking" or something like that. I thank they are going to make him strong enough to take on the Sentry. 😈

Originally posted by TheKahn
IIRC Bendis' description of Nate in the latest was something like "godly sunking" or something like that. I thank they are going to make him strong enough to take on the Sentry. 😈

No that’s not even Bendis description. The writer Paul Cornell, is presetting each character off a music theme.

Issue 1 - is themed after Beetles, each presented character is marked off a popular music title. The fun part is connecting the dots, as to why each character is themed or presented as so.

Issue 2 - the Rolling Stones

Anyway it does no matter. Nate has always been presented as a God Like, Near Omnipotent, Limitless Power etc…

Originally posted by TheKahn

As far as I know Nate has never been shown to have superhuman reflexes or combat speed. The Sentry has. Its the same issue of a speedblitz win that comes up a lot on this board. If you have to think to use you powers and you opponent can attack you faster than that....well then you're kinda screwed. 😬

I would not know how to even measure, Nate’s speed of though. What I can be certain is, that his powers operate on thought. And we have seen him, out pace Jean Gray own attack after its execution. Let alone the pre-cog to back him up.

In this case, Sentry would be hard pressed to speed blitz X-Man.

Originally posted by id369
No that’s not even Bendis description. The writer Paul Cornell, is presetting each character off a music theme.

Issue 1 - is themed after Beetles, each presented character is marked off a popular music title. The fun part is connecting the dots, as to why each character is themed or presented as so.

Issue 2 - the Rolling Stones

Anyway it does no matter. Nate has always been presented as a God Like, Near Omnipotent, Limitless Power etc…

Huh. I didn't catch the references. Thanks, I'll have to go back and reread those.

When was Nate confirmed as an Omega-level mutant? I've seen people refer to him as such but I've seen any confirmation of it.

Originally posted by id369
I would not know how to even measure, Nate’s speed of though. What I can be certain is, that his powers operate on thought. And we have seen him, out pace Jean Gray own attack after its execution. Let alone the pre-cog to back him up.

In this case, Sentry would be hard pressed to speed blitz X-Man.

🤨 Precognition would only let him know just how badly he was going to lose right when the fight begins. Assuming Nate knows what is going to happen, the Sentry's speed feats suggest anyone without superhuman reflexes is going to lose in a speedblitz, imo.

DARK X-MEN # 3
The Story: Nate Grey, a.k.a., X-Man is back and he is not happy with the state of affairs in the Marvel Universe. So he goes straight to the man responsible—Norman Osborn—and it’s not for a nice chat. It’s X-Man vs. the Dark Avengers and Dark X-Men. Can this Omega class mutant survive this matchup? Find out here! Rated T …$3.99

An Omega Level Mutant. A living God returning to the world of mortals - Dark Beast
http://www.comicbookresources.com/assets/images/preview/3976/prv3976_pg4.jpg

Blah, blah, blah, and capture our first Omega Level Threat - Norman
http://www.comicbookresources.com/assets/images/preview/3976/prv3976_pg7.jpg

Originally posted by TheKahn
🤨 Precognition would only let him know just how badly he was going to lose right when the fight begins. Assuming Nate knows what is going to happen, the Sentry's speed feats suggest anyone without superhuman reflexes is going to lose in a speedblitz, imo.

Pre-Cog can be used in a vary abusive manner. Take for instance if Nate can not out muscle him, he certainly has the tools, to beat him through weakness exploitation. Seeing as he is an Energy and Matter manipulator on a vast order.

Originally posted by id369
DARK X-MEN # 3
The Story: Nate Grey, a.k.a., X-Man is back and he is not happy with the state of affairs in the Marvel Universe. So he goes straight to the man responsible—Norman Osborn—and it’s not for a nice chat. It’s X-Man vs. the Dark Avengers and Dark X-Men. Can this Omega class mutant survive this matchup? Find out here! Rated T …$3.99

An Omega Level Mutant. A living God returning to the world of mortals - Dark Beast
http://www.comicbookresources.com/assets/images/preview/3976/prv3976_pg4.jpg

Blah, blah, blah, and capture our first Omega Level Threat - Norman
http://www.comicbookresources.com/assets/images/preview/3976/prv3976_pg7.jpg

😠 I'd been trying to avoid reading those previews until I could read the entire thing!

s'ok. 😉 So is that the first instance? Because I have had people argue day and night that Cable and Nate were Omegas long before this issue was written.

Originally posted by id369
Pre-Cog can be used in a vary abusive manner. Take for instance if Nate can not out muscle him, he certainly has the tools, to beat him through weakness exploitation. Seeing as he is an Energy and Matter manipulator on a vast order.

Again, I don't see how any of that helps Nate against a speedblitz.

its kinda funny how Norman sees it as some kind of game to catch an omega level mutant lol

Originally posted by TheKahn
😠 I'd been trying to avoid reading those previews until I could read the entire thing!

s'ok. 😉 So is that the first instance? Because I have had people argue day and night that Cable and Nate were Omegas long before this issue was written.

That’s the first time, he has bin confirmed as an Omega Level Mutant.