i said it before, but the mountain thing and juggernaut was only a story technique to prevent him from killing charles xavier the next day.
juggernaut literally could come back every issue and beat the x-men and take out xavier if the writers didn't have other classic characters and story lines to put forth.
he was always strong as shit and his powers worked the same way.
Originally posted by rotiart
wow... going off the scans.. i originally thought it was juggernaughts strength... but now i firmly believe it is simply the enchantment...yes they slug it out,,, but then juggs headbuts him, juggs lunges at hulk... and hulk straight out stops him...
juggs has so MUCH momentum built up that when hulk steps out of the way, juggernaut goes running out to sea
and as for a reference
Lulz, What?
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You're slow, I see that now. Unfortunate for you I can't make my text appear slow for you.Did I ever say Pak wrote it? No. What difference would that make anyway? There's a link in the respect thread about the Juggernaut i did that will lead you to a quote where CHRIS GAGE says the unstoppability enchantment was never ever a factor. He says that this story wasn't like the orginal Spider-Man story called "Nothing can stop the Juggernaut" and that Juggernaut was there for one reason and one reason only, to kick the Hulks ass. So, there we have the writer of that very story calling you an idiot.
Juggernauts OHotMU handbook excerpt...again, read carefully:
It says he has to have gained momentum for the enchantment to work. No momentum was ever gained. They locked up from a stand still.
Here's the pag before they lock up, are they running or walking at eachother?
Here's the page where they lock up. Look at the panel before the lock up, are they running or walking at eachother? No. They're slugging it out.
Again, and more slowly: IN...ORDER...FOR...THE...JUGGERNAUT...TO...GO...FROM...A...DEAD..STOP...TO...PUSHING...HULK...BACK...AGAINST...THE..HULK...PUSHING...HIM...HE...WOULD...HAVE...TO...USE...STRENGTH. He wasn't given the opportunity to gain momentum...ever. Ergo, Juggernaut used strength to push Hulk back against Hulk pushing against him i.e. Juggernaut overpowered Hulk physically.
Let's get to your "mountain of evidence".
What's happening here? Hulk says your favorite quote about Juggernaut being unstoppable (The world "Juggernaut" literally means unstoppable), then he sidesteps him. What happens next? Juggernaut stumbles. If it was the force of his enchantment against the force of Hulks strength he would've done alot more than stumble. Hulk proceeds to spin around and smack Juggernaut in the back which is what ultimate sends him running into the pond.
If you still don't get it after this, I don't know how to help you. I can't explain it any better than that.
Actually thinking about it I have a different interpretation now.
See the author clearly was only thinking about Juggs being unstoppable and completely forgot that Juggs must first have momentum. I think it was a mistake by the writer.
This isn't the first time this has happened. Another instance have Flash clearly moving far above the speed of light but the writer writes him as moving slightly under the speed of light.
Now since we have this discrepancy then either choice can be considered valid (Juggs stronger or writer's mistake). So those in the debate can just agree to disagree.
I love Juggs more and very much hope that he is indeed stronger than WWH. But a gut feeling tells me that Marvel writers don't think so.
Originally posted by Neutron-Blast
Countless weights?.. Wrong. Superman would have been trapped under that mountain like hulk was under the same conditions as hulks powerset. He may be able to move just like everyone else in this challenge, but he would never be able to get out like the hulks, juggernaut and gladiator because of how their strengh works. Supermans strength is set in stone ( unless sundipped ) whereas the ones mentions can and have gotten stronger by state of mind.
Superman can move Earth sized planets for crying out loud. A mountain is a speck of dust to him.
Originally posted by h1a8Then explain to me why when the writers had him try it, he needed help to move the earth and even a moon??... He was straining like hell picking up a pyramid. Show me one scan of him moving a planet or destroying one and i will bet the farm it will be pre-crisis, all-star or silver age superman.. It is unbelieveable how people keep trying to match current superman with gladiator... Gladiator is NOT based after the weaker current superman.. He is based after the FAR stronger and more powerful version of superman.. By saying that current superman is as strong or stronger would imply that people think current superman is as strong or stronger than pre-crisis superman. If all-star superman is noted as being 3 times stronger than regular superman, then it is re-inforced that current superman is far weaker than people give him credit for.
Superman can move Earth sized planets for crying out loud. A mountain is a speck of dust to him.
To go even further... Current superman is not that much stronger than WW who cannot come close to destroying a planet, nor moving one.
Originally posted by Neutron-Blast
Countless weights?.. Wrong. Superman would have been trapped under that mountain like hulk was under the same conditions as hulks powerset. He may be able to move just like everyone else in this challenge, but he would never be able to get out like the hulks, juggernaut and gladiator because of how their strengh works. Supermans strength is set in stone ( unless sundipped ) whereas the ones mentions can and have gotten stronger by state of mind.
the opposite is actually true. his strength is dynamic and can increase with his state of mind.
Originally posted by Neutron-Blast
Then explain to me why when the writers had him try it, he needed help to move the earth and even a moon??... He was straining like hell picking up a pyramid. Show me one scan of him moving a planet or destroying one and i will bet the farm it will be pre-crisis, all-star or silver age superman.. It is unbelieveable how people keep trying to match current superman with gladiator... Gladiator is NOT based after the weaker current superman.. He is based after the FAR stronger and more powerful version of superman.. By saying that current superman is as strong or stronger would imply that people think current superman is as strong or stronger than pre-crisis superman. If all-star superman is noted as being 3 times stronger than regular superman, then it is re-inforced that current superman is far weaker than people give him credit for.To go even further... Current superman is not that much stronger than WW who cannot come close to destroying a planet, nor moving one.
My friend there is a such thing as low and high showings. Everyone has them. We only go on best feats unless they are considered PIS. Superman can move the Earth but needed the others just to move it faster in that time. Superman is a lot stronger now though, so past feats have no bearing on current ones. The current Starbreaker feat had Superman moving the Earth solo and against the multiplanetary force Starbreaker was moving it with. Superman has also move the wheels of Mageddon who size dwarfs the Earth moon system. Superman also casually hit a 1600lb being not only into orbit but through two very thick and highly durable (more durable than steel) walls of an alien ship, like a bullet through paper.
As of today Current Superman has the better strength feats over Gladiator. So I don't get where you think Glads is stronger than current Superman.
And I already proved that according to WW's best feat she can indeed exert a force equal to that of the weight of the Earth.
Originally posted by h1a8
My friend there is a such thing as low and high showings. Everyone has them. We only go on best feats unless they are considered PIS. Superman can move the Earth but needed the others just to move it faster in that time. Superman is a lot stronger now though, so past feats have no bearing on current ones. The current Starbreaker feat had Superman moving the Earth solo and against the multiplanetary force Starbreaker was moving it with. Superman has also move the wheels of Mageddon who size dwarfs the Earth moon system. Superman also casually hit a 1600lb being not only into orbit but through two very thick and highly durable (more durable than steel) walls of an alien ship, like a bullet through paper.As of today Current Superman has the better strength feats over Gladiator. So I don't get where you think Glads is stronger than current Superman.
And I already proved that according to WW's best feat she can indeed exert a force equal to that of the weight of the Earth.
😕 Glads>Supes and wonder woman physically
Originally posted by snoopdogg
WWHulk pretty much comes to terms that he cannot stop Juggernaut in those scans hence the comment "fine".
actually in that issue he's already stopped.
He just realizes that he doesn't have the time to duke it out with a guy that he may or may not be able to beat with brute force.. and lets him run out to sea.