Mace vs. Galen, Darth Maul, Grievous

when yoda was hit by lightning he was tossed back at least 30-40 feet, same with anakin and mace.

there is however nothing that points to it being a result of TK in concurrence with the lightning.

in fact the only time that someone hasnt been thrown back from lightning in the movies is when it was used against luke, and he was already on the ground and the lightning was pointed down.

Nemesis, its your claim that its TK, not lightning, you prove it. You are asking me to prove a negative on an claim made by yourself. That's beyond ridiculous.

TJ
Nemesis, its your claim that its TK, not lightning, you prove it. You are asking me to prove a negative on an claim made by yourself. That's beyond ridiculous.

Cut him some slack, jackass. He's probably been popping pills and drinking booze ever since the whole Nihilus thing.

Spoiler:
Belief in Nihilus's uber telekinesis is what pulled him from the mass shadows of Malachorsocial despair and kept the shiphim together. 😐

Your insensitivity knows no bounds.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
when yoda was hit by lightning he was tossed back at least 30-40 feet, same with anakin and mace.

there is however nothing that points to it being a result of TK in concurrence with the lightning.

in fact the only time that someone hasnt been thrown back from lightning in the movies is when it was used against luke, and he was already on the ground and the lightning was pointed down.

And we really should keep in mind that Force Lightning is Force Lightning. Eventually, we have to look at it and realize that our understanding of electricity's behavior (and origins) means jack shit in Star Wars.

Sidious used lightning on Mace and he went flying out the window...

Originally posted by truejedi
Nemesis, its your claim that its TK, not lightning, you prove it. You are asking me to prove a negative on an claim made by yourself. That's beyond ridiculous.

Actually TJ, I haven't made any sort of claim at all. You'll notice that my post didn't say "it is TK and not FL" but rather "you've yet to substantiate that it was the lightning exerting the force, and not some other application of the Force." I gave you a for instance but did not endorse it.

I've learned how to avoid burden of proof. So prove up or shut up. 😄 😄

I, for one, am a little confused as to how Force Lightning would throw Anakin sideways into a wall. Or how it could shock Windu for several seconds and then suddenly fling him through the window like a cricket ball, again at an angle. I always assumed that it was TK.

It may be. But we have no source indicating that telekinesis is involved. Until something else is brought in to canon, we have to assume that it's the force of the Lightning itself, and that perhaps the caster has a measure of control as to where to direct it and its victim.

It wouldn't make sense (from an in-universe perspective) for Lightning NOT to have "weight" behind it. We're given a fair amount of instances where it propels people, and in Palpatine's battles with Mace, Yoda, and Marek, they're all struggling to redirect some sort of pressure coming at them. I'll say it again, our physics=/=their physics.

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
Actually TJ, I haven't made any sort of claim at all. You'll notice that my post didn't say "it is TK and not FL" but rather "you've yet to substantiate that it was the lightning exerting the force, and not some other application of the Force." I gave you a for instance but did not endorse it.

I've learned how to avoid burden of proof. So prove up or shut up. 😄 😄

You haven't learned as well as you think you have. You are the one who introduced TK into the equation, without being able to prove it was there. I have given you two instances of lightning lifting a person and shoving them away. For me to need to give you more proof, you first need to prove that TK was involved. In the meantime, Occum's Razor applies.

That is how burden of proof works. I can say that you are just assuming that the Ravager is heavy, and therefore assuming that N's feat was impressive. I can stand here and claim all day that it is POSSIBLE that the Ravager is actually made out of a virtually weightless alloy virtually indetectable from durasteel, and say you need to PROVE that it actually weighed something before N.'s feat is impressive. But that is ridiculous. Before I could ask you to claim something so abnormal, I would need to establish a platform putting reasonable doubt on the weight of the Ravager.

You don't have a platform to even base your doubts on, so no proof from myself is required until you provide one.

Originally posted by truejedi
You haven't learned as well as you think you have. You are the one who introduced TK into the equation, without being able to prove it was there. I have given you two instances of lightning lifting a person and shoving them away. For me to need to give you more proof, you first need to prove that TK was involved. In the meantime, Occum's Razor applies.

That is how burden of proof works. I can say that you are just assuming that the Ravager is heavy, and therefore assuming that N's feat was impressive. I can stand here and claim all day that it is POSSIBLE that the Ravager is actually made out of a virtually weightless alloy virtually indetectable from durasteel, and say you need to PROVE that it actually weighed something before N.'s feat is impressive. But that is ridiculous. Before I could ask you to claim something so abnormal, I would need to establish a platform putting reasonable doubt on the weight of the Ravager.

You don't have a platform to even base your doubts on, so no proof from myself is required until you provide one.

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
This is not so. You are taking "FL includes some kinetic component" as an axiom. I am asking you to prove that axiom.

Which I have done with the video clips. You would need to prove its anything other than the force lightning, as I have shown, before I would require further proof. There are a few places in the literature that talks about the lightning picking up, or the lightning "throwing him back"
but I don't feel like I should have to include those quotes yet, based on what has been posted.

EDIT: It would be different if you had been able to cast a bit of reasonable doubt on the evidence i offered, but your alternate explanation doesn't really have anything to support it, other than "Its possible."

I think the answer here is that force lightning does generate it's own 'weight' (some times, at least.) This explains why we have instances like when Yoda was blown back immediately upon being struck by it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ou2_OCNFi6g
(0:37)

However, it's also logical to assume that FL has been portrayed as relatively weightless in other instances, but apparent bursts of secondary TK have been introduced. This would explain why Anakin was first struck with Dooku's lightning head on, but instead of moving backward, he moved horizontally and bashed against the wall (i). It would also explain why Mace stood in one general place for a few seconds whilst being electrocuted, then he was all of the sudden pushed several meters outward (ii). FL's initial weightlessness can also be seen when the Emperor was electrocuting Luke at the end of RotJ, and he (Luke) was barely moving at all (iii):
(i)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQTzGzVSHec
(0:18)
---
(ii)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kxb630ipsbs&feature=related
(3:54)
---
(iii)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QhrrynMFiM
(0:08)

So I think that 'amalgamating' the differing opinions on the matter would be a logical conclusion, all things considered. /shrug

Perhaps, since the lightning is mystical in nature, that it is entirely dependent on the intent of the user? It's obvious that Palpatine wasn't interested in knocking Skywalker aside or flinging him away, but in torturing him. This wasn't the case with Mace or in Dooku's situation with Anakin.

Originally posted by DARTH POWER
In fact iv seen many people on these threads who think Vader would have a decent shot at taking Mace.

An they are ALL wrong Mace would epically PWN vader

and thats not fanboyism

Originally posted by Gideon
Perhaps, since the lightning is mystical in nature, that it is entirely dependent on the intent of the user? It's obvious that Palpatine wasn't interested in knocking Skywalker aside or flinging him away, but in torturing him. This wasn't the case with Mace or in Dooku's situation with Anakin.

Galan
^ Which, in the rawest of terms, would equate to either the addition or subtraction of TK used with said lightning, no?

I'm not sure.

Let me put it to you like this: I don't recall a single source that mentions telekinesis being used in conjuction with Force lightning as the means by which an enemy is hurled across the room. It's possible, but I haven't seen anything that would indicate as much.

Originally posted by Gideon
I'm not sure.

Let me put it to you like this: I don't recall a single source that mentions telekinesis being used in conjuction with Force lightning as the means by which an enemy is hurled across the room. It's possible, but I haven't seen anything that would indicate as much.

But like I said a few posts ago, there are multiple canon happenings to support both sides. So no one can really be wrong until a reliable source is released which explains the particulars of FL.

Mace kills GG & Maul. Galen & Mace kill each other. Both too strong in the Force. Reason: Galen would have won, but he still wasn't fully 'trained.'