sigh...facepalm2
the reason our real life experience doesnt apply in a comic forum vs fight is b/c we are not comic book characters and we cannot substitute real world mechanics and our own personal experience for those of the comic characters we are arguing for or against.. we have to use what feats they have and sadly hercules wrestling feats tumph supes
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
pretty sure everyone said if supes uses his powers he wins. other then that in a skill and pure strength supes aint winning...
Speed isn't a power, it is an innate ability. If the OP wanted to compare only skills, he should have said just that. Now if you want to neuter superman, and make him equal to herc, then yeah herc is going to win. But then what was the point of this thread as we all know that, all other factors being the equal, herc is more skilled so he will get the win.
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
sigh...facepalm2the reason our real life experience doesnt apply in a comic forum vs fight is b/c we are not comic book characters and we cannot substitute real world mechanics and our own personal experience for those of the comic characters we are arguing for or against.. we have to use what feats they have and sadly hercules wrestling feats tumph supes
So we cannot use our real world experience to make a better estimate about what attributes are important for a match up, than someone who has never actually participated in a wrestling match? I am not substituting anything, I am using what I know about the subject at hand, and applying said knowledge to the debate.
By your logic, in an H2H fist fight to the death, superman loses to batman, as batman has better H2H skills and feats... I doubt you would agree with that though, because common sense says otherwise. You are using a very one dimensional POV for this match. There is more to wrestling than just skill, and anyone who has wrestled knows that.
Originally posted by snyper1982
So I guess wrestlers never do any strength training right? LULZ. Also, if wrestling is all about technique, then why do they bother with those pesky weight classes?
Sorry, I missed the part where I said weight training is useless. But most times it does come down to technique. It's considering all the factors: Leverage, balance, basic technique AND experience, to name a few. The OP states strictly a wrestling match. I'm not a wrestler, I'm a martial artist (and yes, I do weight training), and I know all things being equal, it all comes down to the fighter with the better technique. Have you ever watched Joyce Gracy, a skinny brazilian Jujitsu fighter, make a muscular fighter, 25-30 lbs heavier, submit? He did it often and on a regular basis. Bruce Lee is another name that comes to mind. At 5'7" and weighing in at 135 lbs, he was a beast! Read his biography someday, about the 6' + stunt men he had to teach a lesson to. All about the technique, baby!
Originally posted by BerserkersRage
Sorry, I missed the part where I said weight training is useless. But most times it does come down to technique. It's considering all the factors: Leverage, balance, basic technique AND experience, to name a few. The OP states strictly a wrestling match. I'm not a wrestler, I'm a martial artist (and yes, I do weight training), and I know all things being equal, it all comes down to the fighter with the better technique. Have you ever watched Joyce Gracy, a skinny brazilian Jujitsu fighter, make a muscular fighter, 25-30 lbs heavier, submit? He did it often and on a regular basis. Bruce Lee is another name that comes to mind. At 5'7" and weighing in at 135 lbs, he was a beast! Read his biography someday, about the 6' + stunt men he had to teach a lesson to. All about the technique, baby!
When you said it is all technique, you may as well have said that strength is useless. Otherwise you wouldn't have said that. If you believe that strength training is important, then you obviously believe there is more to it than just technique, otherwise why bother doing anything other than training your technique?
I know the OP states strictly a wrestling match. Superman doesn't have the technique that Hercs does, but is stronger, and insanely faster. Certainly being able to move so fast your opponent is effectively a statue must count for something in a wrestling match...
And yes I have watched "Royce Gracie"(the correct spelling of his name) beat people who outweighed him by a good bit more. That was also back in the infancy of MMA. Now that everyone cross trains, he is useless. I would say that Royce Gracie is better at subs and sub defense than Matt Hughes, but that didn't stop Hughes from applying an arm bar on Gracie, because Hughes was just so much stronger he could effectively force his way into the arm bar. I know Gracie didn't tap from it, but he was still completely caught, and had his elbow hyper extended because he didn't tap. Hughes said as much in an interview after the fight.
As far as Bruce Lee, well I think he would get dominated in modern MMA... But he was definitely ahead of his time.
Like I said if this was just a skills contest, herc wins hands down. But it isn't. Your skills and physical attributes are both in play.
Originally posted by Mshinuyeah, he is.
Supes is not stronger than the God of Strength..And in a ground fight skill>endurance>strength>>speed.
Sups is screwed and better tap out unless he is a fan of broken limbs. He`d do better as a luchador(sp?), especially with that outfit 😛
superman is so much faster that his wrestling skill wouldn't matter one bit. He's a genuine super-speedster who's much stronger than base hulk.
Originally posted by namorsubby
I don't care how good a wrestler Herc is, Supes pounds him everytime. He's stronger and SO much faster that this is not even a contest. He could blitzes herc and have him on the ground in the shape of a pretzel before he even knew what happened.
Do you fap to the DC logo?
Originally posted by namorsubby
That depends on what exactly "fap" means(I'm not "hip" to you hooligans and your new-fangled terminology)does "fap" mean:
A. Masturbate
B. Rascist term for a half french, half japenese person
or
C. Something else entirely
Are you serious? I think you know exactly what I'm talking about.
Originally posted by amnesiaYou mean you weren't literally asking me if I "fap" to the DC logo?
Are you serious? I think you know exactly what I'm talking about.
was that some sort of implication concerning my alleged personal bias for DC characters written in the form of a crude joke?
idda never guessed it.
Originally posted by namorsubby
You mean you weren't literally asking me if I "fap" to the DC logo?was that some sort of implication concerning my alleged personal bias for DC characters written in the form of a crude joke?
idda never guessed it.
I think you guessed it instantly. Unless you are sort of backwards, and i don't think you are.
Judging from your previous posts, you seem pretty DC biased.