Revan vs Dooku

Originally posted by Alistair Wow thats very harsh S_W_legend, you claim others are over emotional but you are the one looking very emotional calling others low lifes just because they likely beat you in debates.

And whats PT fanboyism? But revan IS an unknown, he could have killed his foes in countless ways and not the traditional swordplay + force powers because we never actually see him kill anybody other than gameplay which i usually end up throwing a grenade....

If Revan is an unknown, try to discourage people from bringing him in to debates - specially in versus threads.

And here are some events depicting Revan in aggressive situations:

Clearly we don't see Revan relying upon grenades and blaster fire. What you do in the game is irrelevant.

three pictures.

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
three pictures.

interesting interpretation

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

For Jedi - A legend and a great Jedi hero.

For his original mentor - Revan is like staring in to the heart of the Force.

For accomplished Sith Lords - Revan was impressive.

As far as those two unkown Sith Lords in SWTOR are concerned; Well Revan trumps them in his accomplishments.

WOW! Darth Malgus put down an unknown Jedi by himself. He is awesome. 🙄

And we no nothing about Revan's fate. However, if we are to believe that Revan went to face the true sith than he did managed to delay their invasion.

You talk like you are some great debater, but what i see here is "Revan is this, Revan is that, Revan did this, Revan did that".

Revans only act of delaying the invasion was by blowing up the star forge, he couldn't kill the sith emperor, nor could he stop the entire empire.

And you do know that unknown jedi has already demonstrated more combat feats on screen than revan ever did considering she could actually block saber strikes with her bare hands and demonstrated a force wave that ravaged the entire environment? Just to wonder, what on screen feats did Revan actually show? Last i recall, none.

EDIT. "The heart of the force" is merely a hyperbole, considering that palpatine was called "the dark side itself" to "a blackhole in the force" or exar kun being powerful enough to "have the earth tremble beneth his feet".

These are just hyperboles.... figures of speech.

Originally posted by Alistair Revans only act of delaying the invasion was by blowing up the star forge, he couldn't kill the sith emperor, nor could he stop the entire empire.

And you do know that unknown jedi has already demonstrated more combat feats on screen than revan ever did considering she could actually block saber strikes with her bare hands and demonstrated a force wave that ravaged the entire environment? Just to wonder, what on screen feats did Revan actually show? Last i recall, none.

And if those actions impress you than keep in mind that Zayne Carrick managed to levitate almost eighty miners away from a rapidly disintegrating comet. This is a feat that many Jedi Masters have yet to demonstrate. However, he actually sucked in combat. Contrary to this, Revan was very successful in combat and killed many accomplished warriors of his time. He surely had to make some moves to put them down.

EDIT. "The heart of the force" is merely a hyperbole, considering that palpatine was called "the dark side itself" to "a blackhole in the force" or exar kun being powerful enough to "have the earth tremble beneth his feet".

These are just hyperboles.... figures of speech.

Originally posted by Alistair Wow ok.

You talk like you are some great debater, but what i see here is "Revan is this, Revan is that, Revan did this, Revan did that".

Originally posted by Ms.Marvel
interesting interpretation

The image in the MIDDLE depicts Revan had just killed Darth Malak on the Star Forge.

The image on the RIGHT depicts Revan fighting his way through hordes of Sith - Events that took place during KOTOR.

Originally posted by Red Nemesis
I think that Slash, especially, would resent the implication that I am being anything less than sincere. Anyway, Revan is clearly an incredibly powerful combatant: his holocron about philosophy had Bane shivering in his wee little booties.

🙁

Depending on what Revan knows of and, read carefully, is WILLING to use, he could stand a fair chance. Now, in sabers he might have to resort raw speed or attempting to throw off Dooku with some force powers, but if it comes to pure skill, Dooku pretty much has it.

It's a contest. Dooku wins sabers 8/10 easily. Revan gets the two purely out of youth, possible skill, and a wealth of knowlege in the force. The last we can atleast assume that 10% of it is applicable in combat, the Revan is fully capable of using it, and is willing. The rest is likely either stuff that is pointless or tedious in CQC, stupidly dangerous, or just academic stuff that while interesting, is just kinda... useless without futher practice.

Dooku wins all-out 6/10-7/10. Again, purely for accounting for the fact that we know Revan was a powerful SOB, we just have a lack of info on what his habits are and how he uses his powers and what hes comfortable with. Also, we don't know if the Stasis Field would work on Dooku that well or just present a limb to be chopped off.

Originally posted by Letum Lettow
🙁

Depending on what Revan knows of and, read carefully, is WILLING to use, he could stand a fair chance. Now, in sabers he might have to resort raw speed or attempting to throw off Dooku with some force powers, but if it comes to pure skill, Dooku pretty much has it.

It's a contest. Dooku wins sabers 8/10 easily. Revan gets the two purely out of youth, possible skill, and a wealth of knowlege in the force. The last we can atleast assume that 10% of it is applicable in combat, the Revan is fully capable of using it, and is willing. The rest is likely either stuff that is pointless or tedious in CQC, stupidly dangerous, or just academic stuff that while interesting, is just kinda... useless without futher practice.

Dooku wins all-out 6/10-7/10. Again, purely for accounting for the fact that we know Revan was a powerful SOB, we just have a lack of info on what his habits are and how he uses his powers and what hes comfortable with. Also, we don't know if the Stasis Field would work on Dooku that well or just present a limb to be chopped off.

A well prepared and capable of taking on multiple opponents simultaneously - Darth Malak on the Star Forge could not stop Revan. Revan being a prodigy would not be easy to handle in a Lightsaber duel. And Revan's force moves would definitely work on Dooku. His barrage of Force Lightning would be overwhelming, since he knew Force Lightning Storm. If Dooku somehow manages to counter his Lightning blasts, Revan could also create Force Whirlwind or could perform Stasis Field (Courtesy - KOTOR Campaign Guide). In addition, Revan is very smart and is expected to pull off cunning moves or could find a weakness to exploit. Also, Darth Bane pointed out that Revan knew some things that some would not even dare to try them, so....

While you can argue that some of moves that I mentioned were likely performed by Revan when he was the DLOTS. In spite of this, Darth Malak believed that redeemed Revan became even more powerful, so....

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Star Forge or not - The Emperor was preparing to invade the Republic. And as I have pointed out before - Revan's fate is unknown. Maybe! Sith Emperor learned his lesson by depending upon two strangers and prepared for the worse. Also, you cannot expect one man to bring down an entire Empire singlehandedly. However, the invasion took place hundreds of years later, which surely hints on something - Revan's actions likely caused this delay. Or maybe he did the unthinkable. Point is that this topic is open to speculation and their is no point on arguing on this matter until we get more details.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

I saw Darth Malgus using Force Lightning, Force Jump, Force Push, and Light Saber throw. Any Sith Adept can perform these moves. As far as the Jedi was concerned; He was struggling to keep up with him. Revan's knowledge of the Force was superior to these. According to the Star Wars Campaign Guide - He could perform moves which even Count Dooku did not demonstrated.

I was talking about an unkown female jedi in the new trailer, that has already at the very least shown much more potent and powerful powers on screen. Learn to read seriously. I am just pointing out that Revan is too much of an unknown with little to no feats actually shown on screen. I wasn't arguing how Malgus, or The Female jedi is superior to Revan, but the fact that they did show feats on screen whereas for revan, they did not hence its incredibly difficult to actually gauge revans efficiency in combat.

surely had to make some moves to put them down.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

It is a matter of reputation. Such hyperboles are typically assigned to those persons who are well known for their incredible power and accomplishments.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

Firstly! Learn to form logical arguments and then talk about others.

Consider this my last message to you, you are not worth anybodies time.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
The image on the LEFT depicts Revan punishing one of his officers during his reign as the Dark Lord of the Sith.

The image in the MIDDLE depicts Revan had just killed Darth Malak on the Star Forge.

The image on the RIGHT depicts Revan fighting his way through hordes of Sith - Events that took place during KOTOR.

Wow punishing his officers? That clearly makes him better than Dooku.

Yes but do we know how? No, exactly he could have grenaded the fck out of Malak or killed him with blasterfire, which makes him, an average trooper.

Hordes of Sith? I see four. Plus two have blasters which even a youngling could deflect blasterfire from more troopers for a time and slay some before being overwhelmed.

Originally posted by mattatom
Wow punishing his officers? That clearly makes him better than Dooku.

Yes but do we know how? No, exactly he could have grenaded the fck out of Malak or killed him with blasterfire, which makes him, an average trooper.

Hordes of Sith? I see four. Plus two have blasters which even a youngling could deflect blasterfire from more troopers for a time and slay some before being overwhelmed.

However, I would still like to address your points:

1. Revan punishing an officer is not an indication of his greater power than Dooku. The latter can do that too.

2. You are simply generalizing in this case. The canonical depictions of Revan do not present him as a guy who loves to use grenades and blaster fire. I agree that Revan would be an experienced soldier but being a highly trained Jedi - his weapon of choice is Lightsaber and of-course! He would use the Force when necessary.

3. And Revan was not overwhelmed by them.

Originally posted by Alistair Yes and that because revan blew up the star forge, the invasion was delayed. Listen to the video carefully.

I was talking about an unkown female jedi in the new trailer, that has already at the very least shown much more potent and powerful powers on screen. Learn to read seriously. I am just pointing out that Revan is too much of an unknown with little to no feats actually shown on screen. I wasn't arguing how Malgus, or The Female jedi is superior to Revan, but the fact that they did show feats on screen whereas for revan, they did not hence its incredibly difficult to actually gauge revans efficiency in combat.

surely had to make some moves to put them down.

You have no idea what is a hyperbole do you? You are taking the quote out of context and using it so literally, thats the problem.

Says the one who forms "logical arguments" by making claims such as "revan is teh heart of teh force, so he MUST be uber
!!".

Consider this my last message to you, you are not worth anybodies time.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

1. Revan punishing an officer is not an indication of his greater power than Dooku. The latter can do that too.

It is not an indication of anything.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

2. You are simply generalizing in this case. The canonical depictions of Revan do not present him as a guy who loves to use grenades and blaster fire. I agree that Revan would be an experienced soldier but being a highly trained Jedi - his weapon of choice is Lightsaber and of-course! He would use the Force when necessary.

What canonical depictions? Give me a combat scenario in which Revan is actually fighting someone and in which not only the outcome is given. Maybe Malak got overconfident like Maul and was caught by surprise. He could've used medpacs, he could've managed to use the captive Jedi for himself, mines, grenades, weird Force powers that distracted Malak, he could've had a special lightsaber, ...

Bottom line is that we don't know how the fight went. We can only conclude that Malak was beaten and that Revan stood there with a lightsaber, Revan probably beat Malak with a lightsaber, but it isn't conclusive at all.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD

3. And Revan was not overwhelmed by them.

Originally posted by Slash_KMC
Fine, there are three unknown troopers and one unknown Force user. He apparently fatally wounds one of the troopers. You can't say anything conclusive about his speed judging from a picture. It is unknown whether he is alone or not, maybe he has back up right behind him.

Also, everything that is told in the holorecords is open for discussion because there are quite some events mentioned in the holorecord that directly contradict established canon. This may be because these are records from 300 years after the events occured.

Btw, stop ignoring my posts.

S_W_LeGenD! You'r back! Welcome!

Would you like to rectify the lie you told in the original thread? (You know, the one that had you leave the forum for a lot of months, then show up again for a few posts until TJ asked you to go back to the last thread.)

You know, Neb is an infinitely better debator than this guy, but they share the same kind of fervent devotion to their character. The difference is, Neb makes usually pretty valid points with only small leaps in logic. This guy is taking a few photo images, and his own suppositions and trying to call them "facts" and "evidence". Its a joke.

It's such a ***** when your faults don't dissappear in time because people remember them.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I saw Darth Malgus using Force Lightning, Force Jump, Force Push, and Light Saber throw. Any Sith Adept can perform these moves. As far as the Jedi was concerned; He was struggling to keep up with him. Revan's knowledge of the Force was superior to these. According to the Star Wars Campaign Guide - He could perform moves which even Count Dooku did not demonstrated.

It's impossible to say. Saying Revan would win is completley wrong, but saying Dooku would win is nearly as bad.

But in my baised and baseless opinion I do think Revan is more powerful.

I also want to point out the Jedi during the KotOR era seem to be quite powerful. Lucien Draay was powerful enough to crush numerous droids simatenesly and to hurl Zayne and Gryph across the horizon. In fact, Zayne, who is a falied Padawan, was able to lift many (well over fifty) miners at the same time.

Originally posted by ares834
It's impossible to say. Saying Revan would win is completley wrong, but saying Dooku would win is nearly as bad.

why? i mean im sure dooku can handle someone who's primary weapon of choice is a blaster.