The Federation Alliance vs Galactic Empire

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
This. This right here is what everyone in this entire forum has against you. At the time of my posting in the Battle Bar, I had given one glance as to how many pages that thread was and refused to read it. I even SAID that.

But you see an insult to yourself. I didn't even know you had been posting in that thread. Because you dislike me you saw an imaginary insult to you.

Well then, I'm sorry if I did indeed misinterpret your response as an insult when it wasn't, but I'm still suspicious as to you saying that in a thread where I was debating Jaden101 - and let's face it; you oppose me in almost every thread that I debated a lot in, often times when you had me on ignore and didn't even read my arguments.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
Well then, I'm sorry if I did indeed misinterpret your response as an insult when it wasn't, but I'm still suspicious as to you saying that in a thread where I was debating Jaden101 - and let's face it; you oppose me in almost every thread that I debated a lot in, often times when you had me on ignore and didn't even read my arguments.

The Galactic Empire stomps the hell out of the Federation.

I have a better suggestion. Research something called The Imperium of Man.

They are a much more entertaining opponent for the Feddies.

there was a very long debate in the sci-fi forum on star wars vs. warhammer 40K

Originally posted by AthenasTrgrFngr
there was a very long debate in the sci-fi forum on star wars vs. warhammer 40K

And on the ground? Good god would the Guard have a field day with Storm Troopers andthe like. The SMs might get bored... No, seriously, bored.

And I pray that there aren't any Grey Knights being brought along, otherwise Vader is ****ed. Palpatine not so much, but Vader would be doomed. If they bring a Custode along....well Palpatine joins the screwed crowd.

But that's if its just a Crusade. If it is a total mobilization, once the IOM gets rolling, nothing would stop it.

However, the GE could largely be in the same situation, albeit there losses would be far more severe. It largely depends on who has the iniative and a few otehr things, But its an even fight.

Link plz?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f88/t417876.html

thanks.

Im currently reading the failure of the other sw vs st as well

urm, that Star Craft vs WH40K. Which is a horrible stomp in favor of 40K.

You know I can see maybe the Borg defeating the Empire, but certainly not the Federation.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
You know I can see maybe the Borg defeating the Empire, but certainly not the Federation.

Even if they didn't, there would be a certain point where they simply could not disperse that energy fast enough for their shields to be effective.

The problem is in OOM. Order of magnitudes. The Deathstar's superlaser in either incarnation is overkill, it's epic ****-ton of Heavy TBs, regular TBs, and otehr assorted cannons along with tractor beams and nigh-invincible shields would prevent the Brog from being able to do anything. Not to mention that range thing is...BS.. to put it mildly.

At the high-end, we have 200 Gigaton per shot at maximum 'charge' for Heavy Turbolasers on everything from Acclamators and beyond. At the very least, this puts 'most' shots at around 20+ gigatons.

Gigatons. Not Megatons. Giga. Order of Magnitude.

Even assuming the Borg could get ahold of hyperdrive, it would only put them at parity as far as Strategic Speed is concerned. Tactical FTL is an advantage, but not a major won that has been repeatedly used.

The IOM ships are occasionaly rated in the Teratons. yeah....

No, even the Borg would simply get slaughtered. Against base Imperial-Class SDs. Against Executor-Class SSDs or god forbid Eclipse-Class(Has its own Superlaser, smaller obviously, but even without it is still much more heavily armed and armored than the Executor) it is a brutal massacre.

And if at any point a major battle(Excluding the GE having to defend Strategically important facilities) it looks like the Borg are gaining the upperhand, the GE can bug out with impunity.

If they went with infiltration and quiet-like stuff to steal the Empire tech and refit their own vessels with it, then yeah, the Borg could do it. But, that's not their MO...

I've read the stardestroyer.net entry a few times, and are their stats backed up by source Star Wars material? Because if they are, as Jaden says they aren't, then power-output and range would f*ck over any of the Star Trek militaries.

And I have looked and looked, asked many Trekkies I know and no one and nothing can give a definitive limit or range of the Borg's adaptation capabilities. How much is too much? How many drones are affected by one instance? For how long? When one group adapt to a phaser's beam, does the ENTIRE collective adapt that frequency? Every time the Federation kills a drone, their entire species becomes immune to that magnitude of weapon? Bullshit, the Borg would have conquered the galaxy centuries ago. Their must be a limit, or they'd never be beaten.

Only thing Star Trek has is Species 8571 and Q (that's all I know of). Gods and god-like being are deus ex machinas for anything. Though Star Wars has its own supernatural gods too.

As much as I despise Wong, ALL of his stuff is backed up by Canon. Go ask them yourself. Self-important douchebagy dickhead they are, they aren't lying about the disparity.

In economic terms, it isn't even Imperial Japan vs USA, it's Haiti vs USA.

Star Trek doesn't have a prayer. Their weapons are physical torpedoes. What can blow up torpedoes? Lasers. Their superior range is mooted right there.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
You know I can see maybe the Borg defeating the Empire, but certainly not the Federation.

No, not really. Even borg cubes were damaged by 1160 megaton weapons and fought in 5 miles ranges, so I don't see how they could stand up to 2.4 million megaton weapons being fired from thousands of miles.

Borg weapons are also inaccurate, unable to consistently hit Federation starships at 5 mile ranges, so I don't see how they could consistently hit Star Wars starfighters.

Also, there's the huge industrial and numerical difference. Star Wars has millions of worlds, some with populations in the trillions.

Heck, even species 8472 would lose to Star Wars.

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
No, not really. Even borg cubes were damaged by 1160 megaton weapons and fought in 5 miles ranges, so I don't see how they could stand up to 2.4 million megaton weapons being fired from thousands of miles.

Borg weapons are also inaccurate, unable to consistently hit Federation starships at 5 mile ranges, so I don't see how they could consistently hit Star Wars starfighters.

Also, there's the huge industrial and numerical difference. Star Wars has millions of worlds, some with populations in the trillions.

Heck, even species 8472 would lose to Star Wars.

Originally posted by truejedi
Star Trek doesn't have a prayer. Their weapons are physical torpedoes. What can blow up torpedoes? Lasers. Their superior range is mooted right there.

Also: when have 'Wars weapons been shown to be equivalent to a point defense system? A human would have to hit that target.

Also: Transphasic torpedoes phase in and out of existence. They would go through any shields and the "laser" would go right through them.

The problem is in OOM. Order of magnitudes.

I don't think orders of magnitude will be a problem.

Originally posted by Zampanó

Both Voyager and the Enterprise have been stated to have power generation of a "terawatt" at least.

I don't think orders of magnitude will be a problem.

😆

Star Wars Acclamators have a power generation of 200 trillion gigawatts, which is = to 200 billion terawatts.

200 billion terawatts vs a terrawatt

Originally posted by Zampanó
That isn't the range that was shown. That was phasers I thought.

Also: when have 'Wars weapons been shown to be equivalent to a point defense system? A human would have to hit that target.

Also: Transphasic torpedoes phase in and out of existence. They would go through any shields and the "laser" would go right through them.

Both Voyager and the Enterprise have been stated to have power generation of a "terawatt" at least.

I don't think orders of magnitude will be a problem.

Um. This debate was decided years ago. The main rules are

1. No one off or rarely used tech that is seemingly forgotten.

2. Darkstar arguments.

SW won this. Even if you argue for full ship-to-ship parity, ST loses.

Hard. The resources they brought together for the Deathstars alone prove this.

The reason Trekkies can't stand it is because they have almost no area of military superiority. None. And for the most part, sheer incompetency, even compared to pt-jedi, is outstanding.

Not to mention Picard's faggy ass and BORGLOVE ****ERS HATE ON VOYAGER BUT AT LEAST BORG DIDNT FALL IN LOVE YOU STUPID FATBEARDS. Sorry bout that....

Back to Op.

SW wins. Brute numbers alone decide victory the moment it started. The fact that Makos are apparently ST's best doesnt exactly add up to a super military.

Even with asspull of the weeks, the ST crew would still have to use them competently...and not forget them...

Transporters are among the most unreliable, finicky things in Sci-Fi. Not to mention Frequency crap is...different... than what SW uses.

Terrawatts? Really? Evidence? then, just for good form, post absolute low end.

In order for this to be remotely close, it would have to be ST with asspull of the week plus superhighendsestimates vs SW uber low end everything with mos of the Navy gutted.

BTW, a good chunk of the 25,000 Imperial Navy is enforcing Imperial Law or were killed/died due to lack of Maintenance and logistics or were in various peoples possesion. Thrawn didn't have much available for many reasons. The GE would be free.

QFT and

Star Wars: 200 trillion gigawatt reactor cores
Star Trek: 15 billion billion gigawatt reactor cores.

OOPS!!!! Lol mistake, it's actually:

Star Wars: 200 trillion gigawatt reactor cores
Star Trek 15 billion gigawatt reactor cores

I don't know what a darkstar argument is.