Zatanna vs Raven

Empathy is different yes, but it's not like Zatanna's telepathy isn't mystical in nature either. After recently punking that demon in his own dream realm I'm entirely certain Raven isn't doing any harm here.

Her magic is instantaneous after the spell is cast. She says pots and then they pots. Conversely, Raven has to draw out her spirit and then lunge it forward.

Zatanna was able to summon an audience of Circe and Spectre under her own power. Raven is outclassed.

@ Prep

Dark Raven as in Raven under Trigon's influence. Under his influence her power fluctuates on the upscale and she actually demonstrates powerful magic during these times.

It could also be taken to mean Titans of Tomorrow Raven, her alternate future incarnation that was able to completely drain the United States of emotion or somesuch. Not what I was talking about though.

Didn't DR beat the Titans within a second the last time she appeared? Ordinary Raven probably loses becase of her CIS.

Generally speaking, Z takes a solid majority. But Raven can make some wins. Not many. But some circumstantial wins are very possible. Z's raw power and finesse is pretty much a given; Raven's capable of taking advantage of even the slightest hesitation on Z's part (and, as others have said, Z's power is pretty much a "plot driven" thing, hence allowing for Raven getting the drop via teleportation and soul-self -- not a given, by any means, but still a distinct possibility).

Originally posted by SamZED
Didn't DR beat the Titans within a second the last time she appeared? Ordinary Raven probably loses becase of her CIS.

Last time she appeared she summoned massive armies of demons, beat Donna Troy in head to head (apparent strength boost in DR form, this was addressed in the issue), and possessed multiple psychics simultaneously with the soul self.

Ordinary Raven feels Zatanna's determination and falls to the floor mumbling something about psychic backlash.

Originally posted by Konton
Last time she appeared she summoned massive armies of demons, beat Donna Troy in head to head (apparent strength boost in DR form, this was addressed in the issue), and possessed multiple psychics simultaneously with the soul self.

Ordinary Raven feels Zatanna's determination and falls to the floor mumbling something about psychic backlash.

raven wins this with ease

because the only think you know about zatanna is from the tv series, right?

[QUOTE=12922851]Originally posted by Konton
[B]Empathy is different yes, but it's not like Zatanna's telepathy isn't mystical in nature either. After recently punking that demon in his own dream realm I'm entirely certain Raven isn't doing any harm here.

Her magic is instantaneous after the spell is cast. She says pots and then they pots. Conversely, Raven has to draw out her spirit and then lunge it forward.

Zatanna was able to summon an audience of Circe and Spectre under her own power. Raven is outclassed.

Raven's soul self manifests itself instantly. It also has been described as moving "with lightning speed" and has been fast enough to snatch characters like Wonder Girl and Kid Flash.

what if, she release her soul self and grab Zatanna with it faster than Zatanna can cast a spell? Even if she fails to do this, Raven's soul self can still KO Zatanna and remain active for several minutes without Raven's body being present or conscious. More than enough time to nab Zatanna.

The soul self has also been shattered by Cyborg's sonics =/

Esprepsid puts Raven down. For the count.

Originally posted by Konton
The soul self has also been shattered by Cyborg's sonics =/

Esprepsid puts Raven down. For the count.

Yeah and in order to accomplish this feat....Speedy and Kory had to keep her off balance, a machine disrupted her inner ear, and Starfire blasted her thus making her loose control of her Soul Self...Had that not been the case he would have not been able to do so...

Originally posted by Lord_Talron
because the only think you know about zatanna is from the tv series, right?

This fight is only about the comic book versions just to clear thing up...

Originally posted by freakybinx
actually i have 4 different dc encyclopedias over 600 comic books almost all movies,tv series and games from dc thats why i said raven owns zs ass and what she chooses to do with it is completely up to her

Troll.

No one can rebuttal me? o.O

You don't really have an argument.

i am going to say that Z is going to win this one the only way that R is going to win this battle is if Z has been smokeing too much Weed and is unable to fight a decent battle because of being High

Originally posted by Konton
You don't really have an argument.

I think I do...you were saying how Raven's soul self takes time to manifest, but I provided proof with a scan that it is fast, like catching kid flash and wonder girl fast.

Surely, she can release her soul self and grab Zatanna with it faster than Zatanna can cast a spell. Even if she fails to do this, Raven's soul self can still KO Zatanna and remain active for several minutes without Raven's body being present or conscious. More than enough time to nab Zatanna.

I can't recall it nabbing Flash and you didn't give me a scan or book to look it up in. Even if it did, it's probably on the same level as Zatanna out reacting Superman in a combat situation and Slade beating Starfire in h2h.

Originally posted by Konton
I can't recall it nabbing Flash and you didn't give me a scan or book to look it up in. Even if it did, it's probably on the same level as Zatanna out reacting Superman in a combat situation and Slade beating Starfire in h2h.

in the scan i gave, flash was already was the ground...but what about Raven's first appearance. when she went to the JLA and titans for help to deal with her dad. zatanna was afraid and told them to make her go away. then when she lost to her father, and it took the JLA and titans to stop her.

That's Raven operating on story induced power levels. In the vast majority of her appearances she flies around and complains about psychic backlash without actually doing anything.

Zatanna is more likely to put her down on the first go.