team gravity VS WM Thor w/PG

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Well graviton alone did this

Then gravity can affect it on a universal scale.Not exactly sure how geart nova is at it but hes good.And not sure at all about the other one.

They can easily crush his skull.

Graviton is ridiculously powerful. He somehow -it was all off panel as I recall- defeated all of the heroes on Earth when he went insane in the Thunderbolts run IRCC. And I mean every hero. Everyone from Thor, the Hulk, Scarlet Witch and Genis to Black Widow and Moon Knight. A fair bit above Top Tier power there. He however didn't look that powerful when he went up against the Thunderbolts so I think there might have been shenanigans involved. I don't remember if there was any mention of him being more powerful than ever. If he wasn't, I don't think he did it straight up.

If he really did beat those heroes straight up, he could most likely solo this before Thor amps up high enough to the point he could beat him with raw strength. In this state of mind, he'd fight only like a brick and wouldn't use his powers to counter act Graviton's abilities - even if they could.

I would give Graviton the edge over a regular brick Thor based on their fights if he didn't defeat the world's heroes straight up. I believe after breaking throug his barrier, Thor held his own against Graviton until he reversed Thor's blast back at him, and then kept pounding on Thor when he gained the edge.

I don't recall him ever doing this though. Not at the same time at least:
"immobilized every single hero on earth, simultaneously while levitating a 3 mile landmass above ground, moving continents around, AND pummeling thor with megaton blasts. "

Nothing Graviton has done suggests he can crush Thor's skull by the way.

After his initial appearance, I'd say Graviton stock dropped a bit. Didn't Extremis Iron Man beat him recently? Shame. Marvel needs to start respecting it's classic villains.

I'm not too sure about Gravity. From what I've seen he operates at the mid tier level and can go above that. The only time I recall him operating anywhere near a Universal scale was during his Fantastic Four return but I'm not sure if there were circumstances or not. I know there were some cosmic shenanigans at one point or another due to Epoch or some shit.

Originally posted by dmills
Nova prime's powers are gravimetric based. He can manipulate gravity as it relates to mass, density and g-forces. Even in a weak condition he has manipulated nuetron star level gravimetric forces.

When did he do that? Just curious. It's not enough to defeat Thor by the way.

Originally posted by dmills
^^^ He has also opened up a stargate so massive that it allowed thousands of ships to pass through it and has hit Firelord with a gravity pulse so powerful that it blasted him across the solar system.

Above applies here. Are you talking about Richard Rider or Super Nova in the FireLord example?

"Nothing Graviton has done suggests he can crush Thor's skull by the way."

Probably not.But between the four of them they can easily drop his hammer,make the PG drop,then cave in his skull.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
"Nothing Graviton has done suggests he can crush Thor's skull by the way."

Probably not.But between the four of them they can easily drop his hammer,make the PG drop,then cave in his skull.

Not sure if that would work. Thor could always use his own control over Mjolnir to overpower any gravity based manipulation they could do. IRCC, Graviton once was able to hold Mjolnir afloat with his powers, but once Thor willed it to come to him, it flew right towards him. I'd say the enchantment over Mjolnir is a fair bit greater than any power this team can muster on anything resembling an average.

If we however chose to go solely by high showings here for the Team, then I'd have to do the same for Thor, and then the possibility of even making the hammer to heavy for Thor to lift, becomes significantly less likely. Overpowering his own weight multiplied infinitely and all that.

The Power Gem trick could work. Defeats the purpose of this thread but it's a viable tactic. It does however bring up an interesting question. How was Thor able to fight Surfer, Strange and the Infinity Watch, Thanos etc. and never have the Power Gem fall off? It wasn't even once a possibility that was mentioned. They didn't even try and remove it from him. Perhaps they formed a bond -Thanos for example had to trick Champion into giving the Power Gem instead of trying to force it off of him- or Thor was able to use his own powers -Mjolnir, Storm Breaker etc. have manipulated Gravity in the past- to keep it attached to him.

Not sure if that would work. Thor could always use his own control over Mjolnir to overpower any gravity based manipulation they could do. IRCC, Graviton once was able to hold Mjolnir afloat with his powers, but once Thor willed it to come to him, it flew right towards him. I'd say the enchantment over Mjolnir is a fair bit greater than any power this team can muster on anything resembling an average.

The Power Gem trick could work. Defeats the purpose of this thread but it's a viable tactic. It does however bring up an interesting question. How was Thor able to fight Surfer, Strange and the Infinity Watch, Thanos etc. and never have the Power Gem fall off? It wasn't even once a possibility that was mentioned. They didn't even try and remove it from him. Perhaps they formed a bond -Thanos for example had to trick Champion into giving the Power Gem instead of trying to force it off of him- or Thor was able to use his own powers -Mjolnir, Storm Breaker etc. have manipulated Gravity in the past- to keep it attached to him.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
I didn't mean in the air.But easily between the four they could very easily make it much much to heavy for him to lift.Whether hes worthy or not thor is still bound by gravity and how much he can lift.And if they make it weight a couple billion tons...

Like I said, if Thor uses his power over Mjolnir, I doubt they could make it too heavy for Thor to wield. They aren't overpowering the bond between Thor and Mjolnir. Mjolnir is beyond the forces of Gravity from what I can tell. You could potentially use Gravity manipulation to move it around etc. but that's about it.

If they make it weigh a couple of billion tons, Thor would grunt, and then continue attacking them.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
I think its mostly PIS as to why the gems stay on.I mean it never show anything holding them in place.

I wouldn't be so quick to call PIS. We are talking about a Gem that leads to all the power that ever was or will be in the Universe. It being able to hold itself in place on someone's fore head isn't exactly far fetched when we've reached this point.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Like I said, if Thor uses his power over Mjolnir, I doubt they could make it too heavy for Thor to wield. They aren't overpowering the bond between Thor and Mjolnir. Mjolnir is beyond the force of Gravity from what I can tell. You could potentially use Gravity manipulation to move it around etc. but that's about it.

If they make it weigh a couple of billion tons, Thor would grunt, and then continue attacking them.

I wouldn't be so quick to call PIS. We are talking about a Gem that leads to all the power that ever was or will be in the Universe. It being able to hold itself in place on someone's fore head isn't exactly far fetched when we've reached this point.

True.Point taken.It just doesn't seem like theres much holding it in place.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
I think they could.I mean graviton alone seems like he could.

True.Point taken.It just doesn't seem like theres much holding it in place.

I highly doubt they're overpowering the bond. Yes, even Graviton. At best they could hope to inconvenience Thor temporarily by making it too heavy for Thor to lift with his own physical strength. But like I said, if you want to go by high end showings, all the gravity in the Universe won't allow them to do that. It would be a better strategy to try and pull Mjolnir away from Thor after bombarding him with attacks. Hopefully he'd be too disoriented to will it back. Their superior numbers would help in such a strategy.

If it helps, you can imagine that it's the power of the Gem that's keeping it in place.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I highly doubt they're overpowering the bond. Yes, even Graviton. At best they could hope to inconvenience Thor temporarily by making it too heavy for Thor to lift with his own physical strength. But like I said, if you want to go by high end showings, all the gravity in the Universe won't allow them to do that. It would be a better strategy to try and pull Mjolnir away from Thor after bombarding him with attacks. Hopefully he'd be too disoriented to will it back. Their superior numbers would help in such a strategy.

If it helps, you can imagine that it's the power of the Gem that's keeping it in place.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Could it be possible for them to use gravity like a slingshot?I'm not sure how they would...mabye one make gravity really dense in one area and another really light in another.So one takes the hammer away,one drops the PG,one makes gravity light,on makes gravity dense,and the one holding the hammer uses it to slingshot his own hammer at him.

I'm not sure. It's possible I guess, but that plan seems overly complicated. This team is compromised of four individuals I don't think have ever meet before or at the very least have never fought on the same side.

I predict they'd be stumbling over each other for a lot of the fight. Especially since Graviton and Moonstone are about as stable as loony toons.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
I didn't mean in the air.But easily between the four they could very easily make it much much to heavy for him to lift.Whether hes worthy or not thor is still bound by gravity and how much he can lift.And if they make it weight a couple billion tons...

I think its mostly PIS as to why the gems stay on.I mean it never show anything holding them in place.

They are held in place by the hosts bio signature, in actuality they should have never been able to be pried from the host in the first place. Oh well, no ones perfect write?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
When did he do that? Just curious. It's not enough to defeat Thor by the way.

Above applies here. Are you talking about Richard Rider or Super Nova in the FireLord example?

The Neutron star happened in Nova #7.

Firelord fight was in New Warriors # 42. Yes it was Dick.

@Blackbolt,

They could get it away, but they damn sure ain't keeping it away. Magic > Gravity.

With CIS off, even a team that powerful would be hard pressed to beat Thor amped like that.

Actually, doesn't the power gem kinda make the whole warrior madness amp redundant? It's mostly about mindset at that point right?

Thor in Warrior Madness mode is basically a blood crazed Thor. I'd say that outside #502, there isn't any amp taking place. He would actually be less effective in a batte in this mind set as noted by Balder.

A pissed off Thor would fair a lot better in my opinion. Heck, he might fair better even when you take the Gem into account. The Gem doesn't automatically boost it's wielder's power by leaps and bounds.

Switch "pissed off" in place of Warrior Madness, and Thor's odds would really go up in my opinion.

Originally posted by dmills
The stargate feat was in the Annihilation: Nova #4 mini.

The Neutron star happened in Nova #7.

Firelord fight was in New Warriors # 42. Yes it was Dick.

Thanks.

From a quick flip of Nova #7, he didn't create Neutron Star level forces on his own. He basically flew at a Neutron Star, and using World Mind's calculations, bent the Star's abnormal gravity until he created a Wormhole event.

I'm not sure how applicable that would be in a battle like this.

I'll check out the FireLord thing later.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Thor in Warrior Madness mode is basically a blood crazed Thor. I'd say that outside #502, there isn't any amp taking place. He would actually be less effective in a batte in this mind set as noted by Balder.

A pissed off Thor would fair a lot better in my opinion. Heck, he might fair better even when you take the Gem into account. The Gem doesn't automatically boost it's wielder's power by leaps and bounds.

Switch "pissed off" in place of Warrior Madness, and Thor's odds would really go up in my opinion.

Thanks.

From a quick flip of Nova #7, he didn't create Neutron Star level forces on his own. He basically flew at a Neutron Star, and using World Mind's calculations, bent the Star's abnormal gravity until he created a Wormhole event.

I'm not sure how applicable that would be in a battle like this.

I'll check out the FireLord thing later.

Originally posted by dmills
Which is why I said he manipulated them. Not created. Although with the type of forces involved, that still took a lot of power to do.

If he simply bent an already present Gravity anomaly, I don't see how applicable that is.

True, a certain level of power had to be involved, but based on World Mind's explanation, it was more about Richard possessing the right kind of power -Gravity manipulation- instead of Richard possessing the right level of power if that makes sense.

Could be. But I'd say tomato tomato' on that one. I mean It was clearly emphasized that he was weak and thus couldn't make one on his own to escape the barrier around Kree space, so they improvised.

Originally posted by dmills
Could be. But I'd say tomato tomato' on that one. I mean It was clearly emphasized that he was weak and thus couldn't make one on his own to escape the barrier around Kree space, so they improvised.

Where? When they reached the Star, and World Mind explained his plan, Richard's waning level of power wasn't even mentioned. Nowhere was it emphasized that he needed the Neutron Star because he couldn't make one of his own.

The only thing emphasized regarding his power level was that he couldn't stand and fight their enemies. Even Gamora and Drax had him on the ropes in moments with some generic guns.

Read the whole book. I'm not a phucking school teacher. jk. We'll have to continue this tomorrow. Gotta drive now. Phoenix to L.A. Working for Greyhound and all.