Kenshiro vs Goku

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
Yeah, the last one hit him in his torsoe however, not in even in the translation I got on DVD says that he hit him in the chest.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
Like you said, there are certain pressure points to hit that would have a certain affect. Also, Amiba was much weaker than Ken and really didn't have much knowledge about Hokuto Shinken. Ken knew all the pressure points he hit while Amiba was basically "guessing".

Anyway, my point was that the power points actually lie beneath the skin, normally it is no problem to depress the skin to touch the power point, but for Kiba Daio it had to be a multi step process, and for Goku I doubt that Ken could ever affect a power point.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
I don't remember Toki saying that but he most likely meant for people like Raoh, as Ken have touched pressure points with very little force.

Now obviously, Ken may have applied "little" force, but it is obvious that you still have to give some kind of forceful pressure on them, which through someone as durable as Goku, I really don't see happening.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
Yes, a [b]possibility. Even if it is a small one, it's still a possibility. [/B]

I didn't read most of this thread but even I'd say that it's a long stretch to say that HSK could affect Frieza, Buu or Cell. Saiyans, Tien, humans yeah but not Frieza. Ken is ridiculously strong and easily within the Class 100+ range but I don't see him beating Frieza unless Frieza just stood there and let him wail on him but yeah induced stupidity of a character should not equate to the other having a chance.

Originally posted by carver9
Frieza can stand still and let Ken hit on him all day with no effect. This is a guy that survived a planet explosion. Ken aint doing sh** to him.

He only survived it because of his ability to stay alive after having his body part blown away, not because he's durable.

Originally posted by jinzin
The fact that you believe that is out and out... INSANE... 😐

Yeah? Then tell me what is your counterargument.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
He only survived it because of his ability to stay alive after having his body part blown away, not because he's durable.

Thats funny, King Cold alluded to the fact that Frieza has survived planets exploding in his face before, in his initial form... The only reason he would have been that badly damaged was because of Goku's attacks that left him sliced in two, crippled, and depleted of energy, not because he was on an exploding planet...

Originally posted by King Kandy
Ah. What pressure point does it refer to it as? My translation says "breast pressure point".

He just simply say "I hit the pressure point known as Dai Kyou."

Originally posted by King Kandy
Amiba was not guessing. He knew where the power points were, they just happened to lie deeper in the body than the "traditional" power points of Hokuto Shinken. I am also not sure where you got that Amiba didn't know much about Hokuto Shinken... he wasn't very practiced, because he hadn't been using it for years, but in terms of knowing the concepts behind it I would say he was probably second only to Toki. Who else can boast that they actually discovered new power points?

The difference is Ken and Toki already know about the pressure points beforehand. They knew what effect each one has. Amiba didn't know squat compared to them and in the end, it was Hokuto Shinken itself to proved to be his downfall.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Anyway, my point was that the power points actually lie beneath the skin, normally it is no problem to depress the skin to touch the power point, but for Kiba Daio it had to be a multi step process, and for Goku I doubt that Ken could ever affect a power point.

But like I said already, that was REAL early in the series.

Originally posted by King Kandy
No, it was in the flashback that featured Toki talking about his discoveries in medical Hokuto Shinken. And that medical arts was based on pressing them softly, while martial arts pressed them hard.

Now obviously, Ken may have applied "little" force, but it is obvious that you still have to give some kind of forceful pressure on them, which through someone as durable as Goku, I really don't see happening.

I can somewhat can. Goku may be can take some hits but I've never seen him just stand there and not even be moved by hits (at least against someone beyond human level).

Originally posted by King Kandy
No, it's really not. Freeza's blood is purple, he shifts shape and changes form, most of his earlier forms have his body with some kind of spongy-like armor substance covering it... there is NO way this guy has human power points.

He's got pressure points for sure, it's the location is what seems to be the problem. If they're not in the same location, then I can't see Ken having a chance.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Thats funny, King Cold alluded to the fact that Frieza has survived planets exploding in his face before, in his initial form... The only reason he would have been that badly damaged was because of Goku's attacks that left him sliced in two, crippled, and depleted of energy, not because he was on an exploding planet...

When did King Cold say that?

How do we know that Frieza has pressure points for sure? What about him says "I have pressure points"?

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
How do we know that Frieza has pressure points for sure? What about him says "I have pressure points"?

I don't think it's that big of a stretch to say he has pressure points, as I'm pretty sure he has a heart and all.

How do we even know if he has a heart? tbh, I wouldn't be surprised if he had three.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
I don't think it's that big of a stretch to say he has pressure points, as I'm pretty sure he has a heart and all.

But I'm afraid Kenshiro won't hit Freeza's pressure point. Freeza has a different body than human. Most likely his pressure points are completely different unlike most of the humans. Maybe Kenshiro would figure it out if Freeza gives him a chance. But if not, Kenshiro would die in an instant. Freeza is no Souther. He is much more powerful, faster, and durable while his pressure point location must be different than Souther. One finger beam and Kenshiro would meet Yuria in the afterlife.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH

Yeah? Then tell me what is your counterargument.

The fact that you think I even NEED a counterargument is a testement to you being out and out insane. 😐

As for a counter argument I think it lies somewhere in the fact that Frieza's a casual planet buster who could tank a planet actually detonating after exhausting the majority of his power WHILE already having been diced in half quite literally.

That he's an very alien creature with the abilities of a changeling able to add mass or shrink his sctructure.

That there's no proof he even has pressure points or evidence of pressure points even existing in his body/race.

That he's literally more than 100 million times as strong as Goku was when he was a teenager who was already more durable than steel at the beginning of the series when he was a child and was ten times that by the end of Dragonball.... 100 million times THAT. 😐 And Ken's supposed to affect his durability?

That Ken is in the same department of shortcomings as he is against Goku; that he doesn't have the neceessary speed to be even a moderate threat, that he doesn't have the durability to take even a single attack if his opponent chooses to land it, and that he doesn't have the stamina or power level to even withstand the battle aura eminating off his opponent's body during the heat of battle.... Except unlike with Goku where all these are issues against Goku as a CHILD... we have to multiply these factors by over a 100 million times. 😐

As I said, NO possibility exists for Ken to defeat Frieza and you're insane to insist otherwise.

He isn't even dreaming about beating frieza and he sure as hell ain't touching goku. Like I said before goku and frieza could stand there and let ken wail on them to no effect.

To attack someone's pressure point you need to be able to press the point itself.

If you cannot even dent the opponent's skin, then you are not hitting the pressure point.

It would be like trying to hit the pressure points of a rhino.

Originally posted by NemeBro
To attack someone's pressure point you need to be able to press the point itself.

If you cannot even dent the opponent's skin, then you are not hitting the pressure point.

It would be like trying to hit the pressure points of a rhino.

Originally posted by jinzin
The fact that you think I even NEED a counterargument is a testement to you being out and out insane. 😐

As for a counter argument I think it lies somewhere in the fact that Frieza's a casual planet buster who could tank a planet actually detonating after exhausting the majority of his power WHILE already having been diced in half quite literally.

That he's an very alien creature with the abilities of a changeling able to add mass or shrink his sctructure.

That there's no proof he even has pressure points or evidence of pressure points even existing in his body/race.

That he's literally more than 100 million times as strong as Goku was when he was a teenager who was already more durable than steel at the beginning of the series when he was a child and was ten times that by the end of Dragonball.... 100 million times THAT. 😐 And Ken's supposed to affect his durability?

That Ken is in the same department of shortcomings as he is against Goku; that he doesn't have the neceessary speed to be even a moderate threat, that he doesn't have the durability to take even a single attack if his opponent chooses to land it, and that he doesn't have the stamina or power level to even withstand the battle aura eminating off his opponent's body during the heat of battle.... Except unlike with Goku where all these are issues against Goku as a CHILD... we have to multiply these factors by over a 100 million times. 😐

As I said, NO possibility exists for Ken to defeat Frieza and you're insane to insist otherwise.

The only thing that mattered is the fact that he's an alien being and thus may have different insides (though the thought of him not having any pressure points at all is insane itself). Other than that, I don't see what's the point in bringing all that up (such as pulling out random numbers and the obvious fact that he can destroy planets). Nobody said that Ken is gonna withstand a planet explosion, which is why I said he'd lose if Frieza decides to get serious.

Originally posted by NemeBro
To attack someone's pressure point you need to be able to press the point itself.

If you cannot even dent the opponent's skin, then you are not hitting the pressure point.

It would be like trying to hit the pressure points of a rhino.

In this case, who says their skins can't be dent?

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
The only thing that mattered is the fact that he's an alien being and thus may have different insides (though the thought of him not having any pressure points at all is insane itself). Other than that, I don't see what's the point in bringing all that up (such as pulling out random numbers and the obvious fact that he can destroy planets). Nobody said that Ken is gonna withstand a planet explosion, which is why I said he'd lose if Frieza decides to get serious.

In this case, who says their skins can't be dent?

Show me ken surviving a nuclear blast because frieza was throwing them out like candy when he transformed to his final form.

Originally posted by Bro SMASH
The only thing that mattered is the fact that he's an alien being and thus may have different insides (though the thought of him not having any pressure points at all is insane itself). Other than that, I don't see what's the point in bringing all that up (such as pulling out random numbers and the obvious fact that he can destroy planets). Nobody said that Ken is gonna withstand a planet explosion, which is why I said he'd lose if Frieza decides to get serious.

Again, you are without a doubt insane...

I brought all that up because those are all reasons or part of reasons as to why NO POSSIBILITY of Kenshiro beating Frieza exists. EVER.... 😐

Those are no random numbers, those are numbers that are relivant to power levels in DBZ... something you also have no concept of.

I'll give you a hint; all that bitching about DBZ supporters using ABC logic..... WELL THAT'S HOW DBZ WORKS.... in the entire show and all of the movies there were MAYBE only a handful (actually less) of people who could beat someone without resorting to having a superior power level. Power levels are relative to every single aspect of a Z fighters arsenal. Speed, strength, durability etc etc... So when you have an argument for a Z fighter who's already superior to Kenshiro with a powerlevel of a couple hundred or less (and there have been plenty here) then you really don't need another one for a character who has a powerlevel of 500,000 at casual and exceeds 100 million well before his max....

The fact that you even BEGIN to think Frieza would need to even approach "serious" to take Ken out is beyond ludicrous, I don't know whether to laugh until I'm crying or just cry due to the sheer sadness here.

Kenshiro could not take 3 nameks with powerlevels of 3,000 MINIMUM, and we've seen Frieza literally blow wind from his lips which killed every one of them. He couldn't take 1 namek at that powerlevel, Hell! He couldn't take 1 namek at half that or Piccolo at a third of that. He couldn't take King Piccolo at a few hundred....

......Freiza sitting in a chair while laughing his ass off completely annhialated an entire planet of the strongest and most feared fighters in the universe... WITH A FINGER.....

So again, you thinking Ken would be in trouble "if Frieza got serious" is so utterly retarded it barely warrants a response.

Serious? lol

no... Seriously..... GTFO. 😐

Originally posted by jinzin
Again, you are without a doubt insane...

I brought all that up because those are all reasons or part of reasons as to why NO POSSIBILITY of Kenshiro beating Frieza exists. EVER.... 😐

Those are no random numbers, those are numbers that are relivant to power levels in DBZ... something you also have no concept of.

Then prove it then. Show this 100 million then and also show me if it works the way you say it.

Originally posted by jinzin
I'll give you a hint; all that bitching about DBZ supporters using ABC logic..... WELL THAT'S HOW DBZ WORKS.... in the entire show and all of the movies there were MAYBE only a handful (actually less) of people who could beat someone without resorting to having a superior power level. Power levels are relative to every single aspect of a Z fighters arsenal. Speed, strength, durability etc etc... So when you have an argument for a Z fighter who's already superior to Kenshiro with a powerlevel of a couple hundred or less (and there have been plenty here) then you really don't need another one for a character who has a powerlevel of 500,000 at casual and exceeds 100 million well before his max....[B]

Wait, hold on, lets back up here a little bit. That's simply not true about it being relative to every single aspect of a Z fighter and there's some examples of that in the series itself.

Originally posted by jinzin
[B]The fact that you even BEGIN to think Frieza would need to even approach "serious" to take Ken out is beyond ludicrous, I don't know whether to laugh until I'm crying or just cry due to the sheer sadness here.

I don't think overhyping the character is gonna convince anybody.

Originally posted by jinzin
Kenshiro could not take 3 nameks with powerlevels of 3,000 MINIMUM, and we've seen Frieza literally blow wind from his lips which killed every one of them. He couldn't take 1 namek at that powerlevel, Hell! He couldn't take 1 namek at half that or Piccolo at a third of that. He couldn't take King Piccolo at a few hundred....

You forget one thing; power levels are useless when use for other worlds/series, because not all worlds use that kind of stuff.

Originally posted by jinzin
......Freiza sitting in a chair while laughing his ass off completely annhialated an entire planet of the strongest and most feared fighters in the universe... WITH A FINGER.....

With a planet destroying blast.

Originally posted by jinzin
So again, you thinking Ken would be in trouble "if Frieza got serious" is so utterly retarded it barely warrants a response.

Serious? lol

no... Seriously..... GTFO. 😐

No...seriously...stop crying! 😐

Originally posted by carver9
Show me ken surviving a nuclear blast because frieza was throwing them out like candy when he transformed to his final form.

That's when he's "serious".

Nail would have easily beaten Kenshiro... in first form, Freeza, with one hand, easily stomped Nail.