Yet another case demonstrating the need for the death penalty.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
And from an econimc standpoint too. Why should we tax-payers house and feed some lowlife for 30-odd years, when it would be a lot cheaper to kill the fool once and for all.

You would have to streamline the execution process first, as it stands keeping a person on death row is extremely expensive.

It costs Maryland $3 million for every execution. http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/CostsDPMaryland.pdf (page 4)

California spends just over $63 million a year on death row (p72), $120,000 per inmate compared to $30,000 (p84). Cases like this take 12 years or so to finish (p85). In order for the death penalty to be more economically sound inmates not going to be executed would have to spend an average of 48 years in prison.
http://www.deathpenalty.org/downloads/FINAL%20REPORT%20DEATH%20PENALTY%20ccfaj%20June%2030.2008.pdf

Originally posted by lil bitchiness
The penal system is supposed to bring justice, not revenge or thuggish conduct - that's what mobsters do.
It was also supposed to work for the society, not for individual's feelings of retribution and revenge. The raise of victimhood has significantly shifted the way justice is perceived and in some cases, conducted.

So locking him away for a certain amount of years = justice?

Why would torturing him in kind not be justice, considering he'd also learn a valuable life lesson?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
You would have to streamline the execution process first, as it stands keeping a person on death row is extremely expensive.

It costs Maryland $3 million for every execution. http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/CostsDPMaryland.pdf (page 4)

California spends just over $63 million a year on death row (p72), $120,000 per inmate compared to $30,000 (p84). Cases like this take 12 years or so to finish (p85). In order for the death penalty to be more economically sound inmates not going to be executed would have to spend an average of 48 years in prison.
http://www.deathpenalty.org/downloads/FINAL%20REPORT%20DEATH%20PENALTY%20ccfaj%20June%2030.2008.pdf

This is correct; China's got it right, they do same day service.

Dont kill him yet, they should tortured him first and lets see how this piece of shit likes it. The old fashion way of the death penalty is much cheaper.

Originally posted by Robtard
This is correct; China's got it right, they do same day service.

lol

But I don't like China's data policies. They are like the Gestapo over there.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I would definitely suggest the US learn a lesson from Norway. I'm not sure how it works, exactly; you should be talking to those CJ professors you think so much of.

Hey, you're the one who said we can learn from Norway. So you should already have an idea.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
You would have to streamline the execution process first, as it stands keeping a person on death row is extremely expensive.

It costs Maryland $3 million for every execution. http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/CostsDPMaryland.pdf (page 4)

California spends just over $63 million a year on death row (p72), $120,000 per inmate compared to $30,000 (p84). Cases like this take 12 years or so to finish (p85). In order for the death penalty to be more economically sound inmates not going to be executed would have to spend an average of 48 years in prison.
http://www.deathpenalty.org/downloads/FINAL%20REPORT%20DEATH%20PENALTY%20ccfaj%20June%2030.2008.pdf

Thats why I think all executions should be one week from the conviction. Give them a week to say their goodbyes to everyone, and then just put them against a wall and shoot them. No fancy ceremonies with stadium seating where a doctor administers 3 shots, and all happening up to 15 years after the trial...such a waste.

One of my former employees' dad was a witness to an execution at the AZ State Penn in Florence. He said that an hour before they were allowed in the amphitheater (it was a lethal injection with seats arranged in a semi-circle on one side of glass), they were sitting in a greenroom and literally offered hors d'oeuvres and refreshments. That's just weird...and kind of funny in way

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Hey, you're the one who said we can learn from Norway. So you should already have an idea.

Originally posted by King Kandy
So clearly the system would probably not be improved by adding death/life sentences, which you were advocating more of.

Correction: death only.

Send this guy to a Mexican jail.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Correction: death only.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Thats why I think all executions should be one week from the conviction. Give them a week to say their goodbyes to everyone, and then just put them against a wall and shoot them. No fancy ceremonies with stadium seating where a doctor administers 3 shots, and all happening up to 15 years after the trial...such a waste.

You don't think that people in a position to get executed should have the same opportunities for appeal as everyone else?

Originally posted by King Kandy
OK. Remove the "life" part. My point is still the same.

So as it stands, you have no proposition of how we should adopt Norwegian Justice?

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
You don't think that people in a position to get executed should have the same opportunities for appeal as everyone else?

They actually have it better when it comes to appeals. People sentenced to death get one free appeal, but lifers don't get the same luxury. They have to foot the bill for an appeal. And I think people on death row should be stripped of that appeal (which is usually denied anyways, so its really just a formality). All too often, legal formalities fly in the face of common sense. We know the SOB did it, so let's just get it over with and kill him. I don't wanna feed him twice a day (because it is our money) for 17 years while he pathetically tries to get his conviction overturned. Just kill that fool already.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
So as it stands, you have no proposition of how we should adopt Norwegian Justice?

this is such a red herring

whatever the US could learn from the norwegian system is moot. Criminal behaviour is NOT a product of government policy toward the death sentence.

Recidivism rates in Norway do not represent an argument against the death penalty.

Originally posted by Robtard
No more arbitary than the varying degrees a person can be charged with murder, eg intent and reason can lower a murder charge to manslaughter, yet a person died either way.

Some people? It would be society. Just as, why can a society make and impose laws, but you and I individually can't?

It comes down to what a person sees as just punishment, I guess. The death of some murderers to me isn't something I'm bothered by; reason why I don't hang outside San Quentin with protest signs when a convict is scheduled to be gased.

Don't get me wrong, while I would never agree with the lethal injection of Tookie Williams, I didn't lose sleep over it.

However, I'm probably not the person to get into this with. To me it is such a clear moral line that we, as civilization, cannot cross.

Its like slavery. Tell me all the great shit that will come of it, it is wrong, and no man has the right to own another man, the same as no man has the right to take the life of another.

That they have a little badge given to them by the "state" is meaningless to me.

Originally posted by inimalist
this is such a red herring

whatever the US could learn from the norwegian system is moot. Criminal behaviour is NOT a product of government policy toward the death sentence.

Recidivism rates in Norway do not represent an argument against the death penalty.

So what explains Norway's low recidivism? Where do you think the answer lies?

Originally posted by inimalist

Its like slavery. Tell me all the great shit that will come of it, it is wrong, and no man has the right to own another man, the same as no man has the right to take the life of another.

Well, you have to admit; the Great Wall of China's pretty cool.

Originally posted by inimalist
this is such a red herring

whatever the US could learn from the norwegian system is moot. Criminal behaviour is NOT a product of government policy toward the death sentence.

Recidivism rates in Norway do not represent an argument against the death penalty.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
So what explains Norway's low recidivism? Where do you think the answer lies?

probably more in cultural things that are impossible to replicate, same way as how the swiss have as many guns as in America, but no gun crime.

Though, the one word answer would be "economics". It seems people don't have to resort to crime to get by. Though, these people are not the ones who would be given the death penalty I'd hope...

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Well, you have to admit; the Great Wall of China's pretty cool.

I don't know, it kinda just sits there 😉

Originally posted by King Kandy
That was not really my point. It should be manifestly obvious that the death penalty does not reduce the crime rate. So I don't see a benefit in having it aside from a sense of vindication that imo should really have no place in the government.

we totally agree

I'm just pointing out that recidivism and punishing people who would otherwise spend the rest of their lives in jail are talking about what to do about two different populations of people

Originally posted by inimalist
probably more in cultural things that are impossible to replicate, same way as how the swiss have as many guns as in America, but no gun crime.

Though, the one word answer would be "economics". It seems people don't have to resort to crime to get by. Though, these people are not the ones who would be given the death penalty I'd hope...

Why would they be "impossible" to replicate?

I think Switzerland has guns for different reasons. Like Afghanistan, they're a mountain pass country that lies between all the top-dogs, and so they need to be on gaurd all the time. But here guns were necessary for killing the Injuns and keeping other undesirables in line.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Why would they be "impossible" to replicate?

I think Switzerland has guns for different reasons. Like Afghanistan, they're a mountain pass country that lies between all the top-dogs, and so they need to be on gaurd all the time. But here guns were necessary for killing the Injuns and keeping other undesirables in line.

You hit on it perfectly though

the reason it would be difficult is because of the cultural histories.

Norway has a much better developed social net and a VERY homogenous society. The difference in America, where there is little assistance for racially segregated economic stratas, would require an overhaul of things totally unassociated with "prisons" to correct.

Originally posted by Quiero Mota
Hey, you're the one who said we can learn from Norway. So you should already have an idea.

Thats why I think all executions should be one week from the conviction. Give them a week to say their goodbyes to everyone, and then just put them against a wall and shoot them. No fancy ceremonies with stadium seating where a doctor administers 3 shots, and all happening up to 15 years after the trial...such a waste.

One of my former employees' dad was a witness to an execution at the AZ State Penn in Florence. He said that an hour before they were allowed in the amphitheater (it was a lethal injection with seats arranged in a semi-circle on one side of glass), they were sitting in a greenroom and literally offered hors d'oeuvres and refreshments. That's just weird...and kind of funny in way

Execution delay exists so convicts can exhaust the appeal possibilities and many have been acquited while on death row.

Legal systems are failable and convict innocent people, that's undeniable. As long as a wrongfully convicted man is alive there is a chance the injustice will be proven and he'll be released, death sentence cannot be repaired afterwards.