Amatsu-Mikaboshi vs Shuma Gorath

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
[B]you dont know what you are talking about.
im telling what the LT said not some personal opinion if the vishanti engaged slorith the power out would of killed not only 616 eternity but all of them

No Colossus, KK generally knows his stuff. But you are right, I remember the scan you provided. Basically the Vishanti called the Tribunal and he came running. It was stated if they threw down, it would be omniversal level damage.

It should be noted too, that aside from 616, the Vishanti have their own universe governed by Order/Chaos/In-betweener. I've never seen any other power/principality/demon lord claim the same. For example, look at Dormammu, Mephisto, Gorath, etc... no abstractions, nothing. They are merely "realms", the Vishanti have a full universe they rule.

dr strange was the same guy who didnt think chaos magic even existed

LOL good one.

@King Kandy

You said it was stated on panel that Eternity > Gorath? Or am I misremembering?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
seems like mikaboshi spawned the elder gods

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/57606/1442310-darkness.jpg

who knows he probably spawned shuma

No he didn't. That's Hera summing up the different eras of the Earth. How does Mikaboshi spawn the Elder Gods when apparently Mikaboshi existed before even Galactus' universe came into being? Gaea came after the Earth's formation.

This fight isn't conclusive until Chaos War is over. As of right now tho, Shuma Gorath takes it. It also made a puppet of Nightmare. The Vishanti battled SG to keep it from entering Earth. It took a nigh-omnipotent being like Sise-Neg to put it to sleep.

As for Eternity, Eternity is greater than either Zom or SG. If you wanna bring up SG having conquered dimensions, Eternity is consisted of dimensions and universe when Dormammu enter Eternity's being. Hell, Dormammu is the one who controls hundreds of dimensions. Where does it say anywhere that SG controls more than one dimension? He merged with his universe yes.

As for Dr. Strange, that bit about Chaos Magic was because Bendis was an idiot who didn't know what he was writing. Slott retconned it already into people (including Strange) denying chaos magic and Chthon's existence.

do you have the scan of the retcon

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
do you have the scan of the retcon

Yeah, too lazy to post them.

please post them

Originally posted by zopzop
Omg I just thought of something.

If Mikaobshi is so powerful, how the hell did the Japanese pantheon manage to imprison him?

I think Chaos War:Chaos King will venture into that.I heard it will explore both Mikaboshi and the Amatsu-kami's history or something.

Originally posted by zopzop
It should be noted too, that aside from 616, the Vishanti have their own universe governed by Order/Chaos/In-betweener. I've never seen any other power/principality/demon lord claim the same. For example, look at Dormammu, Mephisto, Gorath, etc... no abstractions, nothing. They are merely "realms", the Vishanti have a full universe they rule.

Originally posted by zopzop
@King Kandy

You said it was stated on panel that Eternity > Gorath? Or am I misremembering?

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Where does it say anywhere that SG controls more than one dimension? He merged with his universe yes.

Shuma-Gorath tells Strange/Arioch on panel that he is ruler of hundreds of dimensions.

he might be the ruler of the cancerverse, seeing as a lot of them look just like shuma

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing

WHAT BOOK IS THIS FROM?

Originally posted by King Kandy
[B]Incorrect. Chaos and Order govern the "sphere of magic" that is the laws for all magic users whatsoever, not simply the vishanti. Each Vishanti has it's own realm, not unlike those of the powerful demons you mentioned. For instance, when Galactus encountered Aggamoto, it was in Aggamoto's own, personal universe-the other two vishanti were not associated with it.

King Kandy, I'm almost 100% positive the LT said so when addressing the Silver Surfer in Silver Surfer vol III issue 31.

Strange never said that directly, but he did say that Eternity was the most powerful of all magical beings (and this was after meeting Shuma). And he certainly believed that, given how he reacts to the two; faced with Shuma he fights believing he can thwart him, faced with Eternity he fought, but knew from the beginning that he had no hope of winning.

Ah ok. I was hoping for something else but......

Bah too late to edit my post, but King Kandy here's the Vishanti Universe image :

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Well that's just incorrect that he said that, then. We have seen the universes of the Vishanti several times and it does not resemble the magic universe at all. Aggamoto himself has a universe separate, so it is clearly not just one universe they occupy. Not to mention, somehow the Vishanti have failed to ever show themselves in chaos and order's universe? I think you're probably taking it too literally, just because it is the "realm of the vishanti" doesn't mean they necessarily own the entire thing, just that they are noted dwellers of it.

also according to Mystic Arcana: The Marvel Tarot
the vishanti created the astral plane

Originally posted by King Kandy
[B]Well that's just incorrect that he said that, then. We have seen the universes of the Vishanti several times and it does not resemble the magic universe at all.

Believe it or not this statement was used yet again but not by the LT, I think by Strange or the Ancient One (ie the Vishanti's universe and Order/Chaos/In-betweener working there).

I just can't place the issue.

Aggamoto himself has a universe separate, so it is clearly not just one universe they occupy. Not to mention, somehow the Vishanti have failed to ever show themselves in chaos and order's universe? I think you're probably taking it too literally, just because it is the "realm of the vishanti" doesn't mean they necessarily own the entire thing, just that they are noted dwellers of it.

Oshtur and Hoggoth have their own separate realms too that aren't necessarily part of the magic universe mentioned by the LT. Like Colossus said, Oshtur created the Astral Plane, it's mentioned in the Marvel Tarot. Agamotto has his own realm and Hoggoth the same. But the three of them when they form the Vishanti seem to operate in a whole new realm not connected to the realms of their individual personas.

Originally posted by CortSether
Shuma-Gorath tells Strange/Arioch on panel that he is ruler of hundreds of dimensions.

And so does Dormammu.

Originally posted by Warlord
WHAT BOOK IS THIS FROM?

Mighty Avengers 23.

thanks

I've checked too. it's the story where Hulk brawls Chthon.
something like what's about to come in Chaos War...😉

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
And so does Dormammu.

That's all fine and dandy. Shuma-Gorath has hundreds more than one realm. You're not trying to say that Shuma-Gorath = Dormammu in power are you? Because that would be wrong ya know.