Dr Doom and Lex Luthor VS Superman · Comic Book 'Versus' Forum

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

Originally posted by Bentley
Yeah, "magic doesn't autowin against Supes" is a pointless endevour in this fight

"Magic doesn't autowin against Supes" has nothing to do with the attitude that "magic isn't really a factor since he's resisted it in the past." One is right. One is wrong. We both know which one is relevant to this conversation.

Originally posted by Bentley
Superman hits harder, flies faster and has enough tools to work around both. Thankfully for team Kal holds back a lot. With enough CIS team gets some hard earned wins.
Nor Lex nor Doom casually work around people on Kal's level.

You finally said something of worth: "Superman has enough tools to work around both." He'd have to. Superman doesn't work through magical assaults, kryptonite poisoning or red sun radiation by unleashing his full might. His full might is short-circuited by it. So Superman holding back is a red herring.

Nobody said anything about Lex or Doom fighting casually. Specious comment.

Bentley Seitei

Except Supes gets around all those things otherwise he would be long dead 😬

I said casually because you -rightly assume?- Doom and Luthor won't be holding back, while Superman will be doing so willingly. We admit this and we happily get back to the CIS scenario I mentioned.

Badabing Gym rat

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Superman ain't no Sentry.

Which is the reason Superman wins this first time, every time.

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

^ Except when he doesn't.

Originally posted by Bentley
Except Supes gets around all those things otherwise he would be long dead

And sometimes he doesn't and is laid out or saved via circumstance or arbitrary mustache-twirling. And neither Doom nor Lex sport a 'stache. uhuh

Originally posted by Bentley
I said casually because you -rightly assume?- Doom and Luthor won't be holding back, while Superman will be doing so willingly. We admit this and we happily get back to the CIS scenario I mentioned.

... that makes no sense.

Badabing Gym rat

Okay, so we all agree. Supes wins handily and I can close this?

superdur

SamZED Senior Member

Yeah, but still...

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Superman ain't no Sentry.

😈

Bentley Seitei

Lex doesn't pose a serious threat against Superman without hefty amounts of CIS, PIS and prep anyways; and that's still a kryptonian who doesn't use his abilities to their full extent.

Supes is well above Luthor and the whole Doom argument revolves around magic. And it hasn't been more developped than that. Victor may as well try to teleport Kal and bfr; at least that should work for sure.

Mindset Senior Member

Bently, you don't even read Superman comics, you chump.

Bentley Seitei

Originally posted by Mindset
Bently, you don't even read Superman comics, you chump.

I'll let that pass... For now peaches

Omega Vision Face Flowed Into Her Eyes

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Superman ain't no Sentry.

Which is one of the reasons he's a good character.

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Which is one of the reasons he's a good character.

Originally posted by Bentley
Lex doesn't pose a serious threat against Superman without hefty amounts of CIS, PIS and prep anyways; and that's still a kryptonian who doesn't use his abilities to their full extent.

I would disagree. Lex is far from helpless and ineffective.

Originally posted by Bentley
Supes is well above Luthor and the whole Doom argument revolves around magic. And it hasn't been more developped than that. Victor may as well try to teleport Kal and bfr; at least that should work for sure.

Doom has other abilities, powers and methods. He is not one-dimensional and he is not a man in a tin suit. But I don't see any reason why he would resort to fisticuffs and blasting, a harder (but not impossible) avenue of engaging Superman when he's got formidable magicks. Particularly when teamed with the knowledgeable Luthor.

Warlord Yes, I am...

Originally posted by Bentley

do you have any example of Kal being handled by a mid-level magician?

beating Le Fay and Nightmare gets you to middle level?

huge underestimation

Bentley Seitei

Originally posted by Warlord
beating Le Fay and Nightmare gets you to middle level?
huge underestimation

Beh, not straight battles, plot devices all around and here I never claimed Doom isn't amazing with prep, he is. There isn't any prep here though.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I would disagree. Lex is far from helpless and ineffective. Doom has other abilities, powers and methods. He is not one-dimensional and he is not a man in a tin suit. But I don't see any reason why he would resort to fisticuffs and blasting, a harder (but not impossible) avenue of engaging Superman when he's got formidable magicks. Particularly when teamed with the knowledgeable Luthor.

Well, if we differ about how Luthor fares against Superman I think it could be part of our misunderstanding. If I thought there was a serious chance for Luthor to be as harmful to Kal as he tends to be in some comics -prepped, inside a plot and with Kal seldomly using his abilities-, then my opinion would be vastly different. In truth, I don't think even Luthor has enough info to justly estimate Superman's threat level outside the passive use of his abilities. Next to that, he would not be more of a threat than Iron Man in a Hulkbuster armor against the Hulk.

I think Doom's best shot is with magic, I don't believe it's enough to give him the upperhand or whatsoever.

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

Originally posted by Bentley
Well, if we differ about how Luthor fares against Superman I think it could be part of our misunderstanding. If I thought there was a serious chance for Luthor to be as harmful to Kal as he tends to be in some comics -prepped, inside a plot and with Kal seldomly using his abilities-, then my opinion would be vastly different. In truth, I don't think even Luthor has enough info to justly estimate Superman's threat level outside the passive use of his abilities. Next to that, he would not be more of a threat than Iron Man in a Hulkbuster armor against the Hulk.

Ironically, Iron Man has beaten Hulk straight up without Hulkbuster armor. And Iron Man's armor wasn't even laced with a number of goodies that heavily poison Hulk or compromise Hulk's powers.

Originally posted by Bentley
I think Doom's best shot is with magic, I don't believe it's enough to give him the upperhand or whatsoever.

biscuits

Bentley Seitei

For one thing I think Luthor would beat Superman more often if he had his own book and was quite popular himself. This not being the case he blows biscuits

I respect Doom's magic, I just respect Superman's fists even more 😄

tkitna Senior Member

Doom kills Superman and then kills Lex for being a nuisance.

quanchi112 Disney

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Which is one of the reasons he's a good character.

That's besides the point that the Sentry is a lot more powerful and a lot more dangerous than baby blue. Who is a better character is subjective and I side with the Sentry there tenfold.

-Pr- Hey Yo!

Lex can only really beat Superman when he prepares for it. He's a genius, sure, but he's still human. Most of their biggest showdowns have been when he's had prep. In a fight he's a danger to Superman, sure, but even a Superman with CIS on knows not to play nice against a battlesuit wearing Lex.

With Doom there they can win (and will most definitely take some if not the majority), but it's not going to be 10/10. Not nearly.

I don't see Doom being unbeatable for Superman either.

OneDumbG0 Find Your Own Fire

Originally posted by -Pr-
Lex can only really beat Superman when he prepares for it. He's a genius, sure, but he's still human. Most of their biggest showdowns have been when he's had prep. In a fight he's a danger to Superman, sure, but even a Superman with CIS on knows not to play nice against a battlesuit wearing Lex.

So how much danger does Lex in his battlesuit pose to Superman in a straight fight?

Originally posted by -Pr-
With Doom there they can win (and will most definitely take some if not the majority), but it's not going to be 10/10. Not nearly.
I don't see Doom being unbeatable for Superman either.

I have little issue with that statement. 👆

I have even less issue with this statement. 👆

-Pr- Hey Yo!

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
So how much danger does Lex in his battlesuit pose to Superman in a straight fight? I have little issue with that statement. 👆
I have even less issue with this statement. 👆

if they had never met before, i would say considerable. the problem is familiarity. superman has fought lex enough times to know what the suit is capable of, and while lex might score a hit or two, superman is not going to willingly take hits from kryptonite energy blasts like he would a punch from grundy.

besides, i always considered lex better when he wasn't using the suit. he's more of a threat imo.