Hawkeye vs. Crossbones

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
When did I say this?

Said receiving training from capt and were a ninja costume does not translate into being match for bones in h2h.

How is this a double standard?

It h2h fight between bones and hawlk-eye, what relevence does weapons have?

also why are you goping on a spew about bucky weapons, which I never brought up at all, nor has relevance to h2h fight between hawlk eye and bones.

you give him .5 less. That far from fair or accurate based off hawlk eye showings, which you keep dodging. Were are these h2h showing that give him 4.5 out of ten against bones?

np, but still dont see the relevance. Bucky is much better fighter the hawlk eye.

Better fighter with a friggin cyborg hand....LOL. Anyways Bucky is better then Bones with his cyborg hand that much is for sure. Bones to my knowledge has never even beaten Cap or who for that matter?

The closes one was his alternate version from Heroes Reborn(not the real Crossbones) that sneak attack with a tackle take down on Cap and defeated him. His Ronin h2h scenes and his training and experience with Bone's stock going down a bit. But Bones still wins of course.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Right but it was stated he was shooting his image right? Where is it?
So it was stated he got up to shoot his image? Where is it?

The art of dodging I see. Let see each other argument shall we.

Your arguement is that bones mid battle decided to kneel down behind capt and grab his head, only to then stand up in order to create space to not harm himself. Is that right? despite the fact this was not hinted or stated in the least. But you think that is clearly what occured?

Now lets see my argument. Bones who entire reason to fight capt was to assure that this time he stayed dead. So he kneeled behind him grabbed his head and was aiming his face to sever his neck. He then got distracted by the image of himself he mistakenly took for red skull, to the point we even see in the scan I posted that he moves his head from behind Cap, to beside him for better look, then precedes to stand up and blast said image while stating "im better the him" (red skull)

yea clearly I am the one, wishful thinking right 🙄

Originally posted by Daredevil1
thinking indeed. Right so he can hold his face and not shoot himself?

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Now who's making up all this stuff to suit there scenario.

YOU ARE.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
You know what it doesn't matter anyways even if there was no image it's not like you can prove he would have been able to shoot Cap anyways there. Since he couldn't and missed anyways...LOL

Except I could, since we see in the scan and I already stated which you ignored. That in the third to last pannel of the scan I posted, red skull had capt by the head behind him, with his face leveled at his neck. All he had to do was think shooting him and capt would be dead. Honestly dont get what is so hard about that.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO you got nothing. And I got he owned Bones. 🙂 Doesn't even matter.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Better fighter with a friggin cyborg hand....LOL.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Bucky is better then Bones with his cyborg hand that much is for sure. Bones to my knowledge has never even beaten Cap or who for that matter?

Bucky also better then hawlkeye so again how is that relevant?

He given capt all hell in h2h before, which is more then hawlk-eye ever done.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Ronin h2h scenes and his training and experience with Bone's stock going down a bit. But Bones still wins of course.

Training and experience which is less then bones. great.

again why are you basing bones entire career off of two fights with the same character?

Crossbones isn't Wolverine please leave you Wolverine wanking for Wolverine related characters. Don't take you're stink and then add them to Captain America characters as well.

You're the Wolverine guys were the Caps guys, you've got enough Wolverine related characters to play with stop being greedy. In the Cap camp we like to interpret events as objectively as we possibly can, save that nonsense for Wolverine.

Originally posted by Deadline
Crossbones isn't Wolverine please leave you Wolverine wanking for Wolverine related characters. Don't take you're stink and then add them to Captain America characters as well.

How on earth am I wanking bones?

Originally posted by Deadline
You're the Wolverine guys were the Caps guys, you've got enough Wolverine related characters to play with stop being greedy.

Why, you have to turn this into us vs you is beyond me. I read captain America and have hundreds if not in the thousands of comics with him in it.

Originally posted by Deadline
the Cap camp we like to interpret events as objectively as we possibly can, save that nonsense for Wolverine.

This is just 😆. By objectively, you mean riddle with bias, then yes. Because there is nothing objective about what you are argueing. In fact quite clear that DD is ignoring context and providing his own, that not even remotely implied and pretending that how it is. Which is nonsense.

since you missed it here you got

not to mention, third to last pannel

Shows red skull grabbing capt head with his face aimed downward at capt neck as if to decapitate him, but then notices his reflection as shown right in the scan

If Boens was not distracted by the image he saw in the lake, then riddle me this, why did he stand up and blast? why take kneel down in the first place and grab capt if he intention was to stand up and firer at him?

Not too sure how that Cap fight is relevant to Hawkeye vs Crossbones.

I've not seen much of Clint as Ronin, I just know he got an upgrade hand to hand fighting wise.

He tagged US Agent a few times way back in WCA although got owned in the end but he's never been without skill hand to hand, he's just not an A lister.

As for Bones, Cap himself has stated that Bones is a dangerous fighter and one of the best he's faced.

I don't see getting beaten down by a PO'd Bucky as that bad a showing, given all Bucky's experience and training plus that bionic arm of his.

Same with Logan unless we're saying that Hawkeye would fair any better against either combatant?

When Cap beat Bones without the SSS he had to fight dirty to win to make up for the edge he lost having no SSS in his body, which should really tell you how skilled an opponent Bones is.

As for this fight I would have to give Bones an edge over Clint unless someone can show me scans that show Clint is on the same level as Cap hand to hand or close to it?

Originally posted by BigSid
Not too sure how that Cap fight is relevant to Hawkeye vs Crossbones.

I've not seen much of Clint as Ronin, I just know he got an upgrade hand to hand fighting wise.

He did not receive an upgrade. In fact aside from using nun-chucks, I not sure he displayed anything beyond what he could do before. In fact he utilized mainly swords, which is far from a new skill set, he has been quite proficient with swords since being trained by swordsmen in the circus

Originally posted by BigSid
tagged US Agent a few times way back in WCA although got owned in the end but he's never been without skill hand to hand, he's just not an A lister.

To be honest, there really not evidence, that he even C lister or third tier fighter in terms of h2h combat.

Originally posted by BigSid
for Bones, Cap himself has stated that Bones is a dangerous fighter and one of the best he's faced.

I don't see getting beaten down by a PO'd Bucky as that bad a showing, given all Bucky's experience and training plus that bionic arm of his.

Same with Logan unless we're saying that Hawkeye would fair any better against either combatant?

so true.

Originally posted by BigSid
Cap beat Bones without the SSS he had to fight dirty to win to make up for the edge he lost having no SSS in his body, which should really tell you how skilled an opponent Bones is.

Originally posted by BigSid
for this fight I would have to give Bones an edge over Clint unless someone can show me scans that show Clint is on the same level as Cap hand to hand or close to it?

Also, if not mistaken did not hawlk and bobi both imply she was better? and she not even that good.

Crossbones.

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
It was becuase of a fight between cross bones and capt being analyzed.

He did not receive an upgrade. In fact aside from using nun-chucks, I not sure he displayed anything beyond what he could do before. In fact he utilized mainly swords, which is far from a new skill set, he has been quite proficient with swords since being trained by swordsmen in the circus

To be honest, there really not evidence, that he even C lister or third tier fighter in terms of h2h combat.

so true.

Yup, not to mention he was not some weaklining with out it. In fact he pretty much retainedhis abilities, and simply had to train more. Even then the decline for capt was extremely slow. Does anyone even know when capt fought bones and how long after losing his SSS?

He would not need to show capt level, because capt better then bones. But I get the point. He needs to at least show ability to hang with such individual in h2h combat, besides simply fighting cannon fodder.

Also, if not mistaken did not hawlk and bobi both imply she was better? and she not even that good.

Cap fought bones right after losing the SSS in the Streets of Poison arc, that fight was actually a good showing for Bones, he was taking it to Cap until Steve yanked his mask back over his eyes and punched him in the throat IIRC

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Really not need for that, at all.

How on earth am I wanking bones?

Why, you have to turn this into us vs you is beyond me. I read captain America and have hundreds if not in the thousands of comics with him in it.

This is just 😆. By objectively, you mean riddle with bias, then yes. Because there is nothing objective about what you are argueing. In fact quite clear that DD is ignoring context and providing his own, that not even remotely implied and pretending that how it is. Which is nonsense.

since you missed it here you got

not to mention, third to last pannel

Shows red skull grabbing capt head with his face aimed downward at capt neck as if to decapitate him, but then notices his reflection as shown right in the scan

If Boens was not distracted by the image he saw in the lake, then riddle me this, why did he stand up and blast? why take kneel down in the first place and grab capt if he intention was to stand up and firer at him?

LOL he could have blasted the image without even getting up. Seriously you got nothing.

And now you said he could have killed Cap?

Prove it. Show me him blasting Cap with the face beam in the end.

Cap outwitted and outsmarted him in the end. And drowned him in a pool just like your logic has been drowned. 🙂

Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
so now having a cyborg arm makes him less skilled?

Bucky also better then hawlkeye so again how is that relevant?

He given capt all hell in h2h before, which is more then hawlk-eye ever done.

First were are these h2h scene? Because what your suggesting really does not exist.

Training and experience which is less then bones. great.

again why are you basing bones entire career off of two fights with the same character?

You keep asking for Clint h2h scenes and again I ask you who has Bones really beaten as well? Besides circumstantial advantages on Cap, DD, the fight with Bullseye was so brief it was two panels and then he left. Bones did slit the throat of this nobody who wore green and like to use swords.

What big time names has Bones beaten as well? I still give Bones the edge, but lets see it.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
In the past vs Hawkeye I actually would have said Crossbones 7-8/10. But with Hawkeye's new push recently and with Bones looking terrible against Bucky two times there fights and Logan making him look like a stooge.

His stock has gone down a bit. Even Batroc did better against Bucky...yikes. But to be fair Bucky was ubber pissed since he thought that he killed Steve.

Damn Crossbones 5.5/10 and its a tough fight every damn time.

There were circumstances to almost every fight between Bones and Bucky.

Their first fight, he took a swan dive out of a hellicopter breaking his arm and fracturing his skull.
Their second fight, he was winning until Sin got in the way allowing Bucky to use his robotic arm to break some ribs.
Their third Bones shot Bucky and then beat the hell out of him.

They haven't had a single clear fight yet.

Originally posted by jinzin
There were circumstances to almost every fight between Bones and Bucky.

Their first fight, he took a swan dive out of a hellicopter breaking his arm and fracturing his skull.
Their second fight, he was winning until Sin got in the way allowing Bucky to use his robotic arm to break some ribs.
Their third Bones shot Bucky and then beat the hell out of him.

They haven't had a single clear fight yet.

Looked back at first fight its hard to tell if it was the fall or Bucky cyborg arm that gives him the injury, maybe both. As he does talk about his fracture in the rematch. But nothing about his arm being broken? But because the vagueness of it I will agree with you since its argumentative and won't count it as a clear win. So I was short changing Bones a bit because of this.

Second fight your right Bones had the advantage but Buck admitted he rushed in blindly and paid for it, as even with that advantage Buck had already recovered after the second hit and stated he would fix that and give him another fracture.

So I think Buck throwing her helped to re-start the fight from scratch and as it restarted Bones threw again the first punch.....Buck dodged and hit him good. Then that was pretty much was all she wrote, as Buck then picked him up by the throat and Bones was helpless, as Buck could have killed him had he wanted too. As it ended there with Buck turning his attention to Skull. So this one I definitely give the win to Bucky.

Third fight Bones did shot Buck from the back side(Buck is lucky his uniform is bullet proof even though he was hurt from it) as they continued to fight Bones did have the advantage because of it but even hurt Buck still got his licks in even stabbing Bones. Bones tossed him over a window and Bucky was lucky Blackwidows air car was in the way, to save him from a painful fall. Bones peaked out of the window and then Buck got even and shot him three times. Sigh this one your right I can't count because of Bones sneak attack shooting on Buck and Natalia's intervention. So I guess Buck only beat him once in my mind now instead of 2 clear cut wins.

I guess I'll change it to Bones 6/10 vs Clint and it wasn't completely as bad for Bones, as I had previously thought. From memory it seemed Bones got POWNED bad but that was my fault for not reviewing there encounters.

I still think Clints stock has risen lately especially with him defeating Cap recently even if he did it with the help of his weapons. Its how he mixes it with his h2h prowess and that is getting a bit short changed as well just because both Bones/Buck uses weapons as well IMO.

You know what I think I would give Bones the majority, but serioulsy what in hells name are you guys trying to do to Bones? Are you trying to argue hes top tier, or hes better than Cap? I noticed you Wolverine guys seem to have adopted him. I'm quite sure I read an issue were Cap beat both Red Skull and Crossbones.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Looked back at first fight its hard to tell if it was the fall or Bucky cyborg arm that gives him the injury, maybe both. As he does talk about his fracture in the rematch. But nothing about his arm being broken? But because the vagueness of it I will agree with you since its argumentative and won't count it as a clear win. So I was short changing Bones a bit because of this.

In the first fight I believe that Crossbones was unlucky he landed on his head, Bones mentions this in the second fight but still gets tooled.

Originally posted by jinzin
In the script they had for the book it makes mention of Bones having a broken arm but yeah looking at the fight it doesn't really show it.
I didn't know clint beat Cap recently. what?! when was that?

It was in Hawkeye blind spot 2 or 3 IIRC. But of course he has his arrows and Steve gives him mad props in the end.

Seriously after viewing what Clint did to Batro/Zaran in another encounter without his arrows. He really impressed me. He used his bow like a hitting weapon but Zaran and Batroc had weapons as well.

Pure h2h? Tough, I think Rumlow beats him more often than not, but it's close.