polls state that the muslim brotherhood only has about 15% support among the egyptian people, any look at the history of this event shows that they were not the initial, or any, cause of the protests, and they have said they wont run a candidate in the next presidential elections...
but, wait, angry brown people, must be crazy fundamentalists, no way they could want the same things we do. And there are no social/cultural differences from Iran and Egypt, one can be used as a clear model of the other
/facepalm
Originally posted by inimalist
polls state that the muslim brotherhood only has about 15% support among the egyptian people, any look at the history of this event shows that they were not the initial, or any, cause of the protests, and they have said they wont run a candidate in the next presidential elections...but, wait, angry brown people, must be crazy fundamentalists, no way they could want the same things we do. And there are no social/cultural differences from Iran and Egypt, one can be used as a clear model of the other
/facepalm
Originally posted by The Dark Cloud
And what do "we" want exacly?
in this context, I was speaking about the universiality of democracy and individual freedom. Taking a stand against oppression, ie: human universal qualities that fly in the face of the idea of some "clash of civiliziations".
Basically, these people in the streets of Egypt are fighting for the same things we have. It is a secular revolution against material tyranny, not some ideological resistance against colonial American power, which is a more valid model for Iran.
you can deconstruct "we" all you want, it doesn't make the Muslim Brotherhood any more involved in the protest, nor does it make them anything but marginal on the political scene in a mainly secular nation like Egypt.
Originally posted by inimalist
in this context, I was speaking about the universiality of democracy and individual freedom. Taking a stand against oppression, ie: human universal qualities that fly in the face of the idea of some "clash of civiliziations".Basically, these people in the streets of Egypt are fighting for the same things we have. It is a secular revolution against material tyranny, not some ideological resistance against colonial American power, which is a more valid model for Iran.
you can deconstruct "we" all you want, it doesn't make the Muslim Brotherhood any more involved in the protest, nor does it make them anything but marginal on the political scene in a mainly secular nation like Egypt.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
No see since America didn't directly back this overthrow it MUST lead to a communist or fundamentalist regime, or some combination of the two. awesome
glad you pointed that out, Glenn 😉
EDIT: though, maybe I should qualify, 15% is hardly marginal, and the MB is a far cry from Al Qaeda or other extremist organizations, though again, only 15% of Egyptians support them.
Originally posted by RocasAtoll
Do you have a link to that poll? From what I've read, and this includes Al Jazeera, the Muslim Brotherhood would have a majority if elections were held soon.
blog summing it up well:
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2011/02/poll_no_constituency_for_musli.html
pdf of the poll:
http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/html/pdf/pollock-Egyptpoll.pdf
Muslim Brotherhood wont run in presidential elections:
http://edition.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2011/02/04/jk.erian.muslim.brotherhood.cnn?hpt=T2
Originally posted by inimalist
glad you pointed that out, Glenn 😉EDIT: though, maybe I should qualify, 15% is hardly marginal, and the MB is a far cry from Al Qaeda or other extremist organizations, though again, only 15% of Egyptians support them.
Edit: That poll pretty much dismisses any notion that a Fundamentalist takeover is likely, given that the three major reasons for such a change (Regime seen as too Pro US, regime not Islamic enough, and regime seen as too pro-Israel) are so low on the list of reasons.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
Yeah in some countries where there aren't a few major power blocs 15% can be a winning plurality. Ukraine for instance has more than a dozen parties of roughly equal prominence and influence IIRC.
the point is that they wouldn't get anything resembling a clear majority, and in no way are they going to "take over" egypt (if there is any such take over, it will undoubtedly be the military, again).
there is also the fact that the Muslim Brotherhood is a far cry from the Iranians or Al Qaeda.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
Edit: That poll pretty much dismisses any notion that a Fundamentalist takeover is likely, given that the three major reasons for such a change (Regime seen as too Pro US, regime not Islamic enough, and regime seen as too pro-Israel) are so low on the list of reasons.
oh, exactly
Egypt is far too modern and secular of a society for this to happen, and Islam was never a banner for rallying against oppression (whereas in Iran, Islamic garb and other outward signs of religiosity were banned, making Islam a powerful way to identify with rebellion).
Originally posted by inimalist
the point is that they wouldn't get anything resembling a clear majority, and in no way are they going to "take over" egypt (if there is any such take over, it will undoubtedly be the military, again).there is also the fact that the Muslim Brotherhood is a far cry from the Iranians or Al Qaeda.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
So we file that theory away with "fluoride is really a mind control conspiracy" and "Obama is a secret Muslim"? 😛
well, I think this comes more from the ideas of "clash of civilizations-esque" mindsets, where it is thought that Muslim people just can't have democracy because their culture has never had it and it wont mesh with their religion, whereas the others seem like signs of clinical paranoia.
and no, I don't know when one becomes the other...