Originally posted by -Pr-
Okay, and what are you guys trying to get ruled? That it doesn't count?
I think its irrelevant since Creed didn't have his powers when it happened, some people think it means that Iron Fist retroactively beat Creed with his powers and the fight still remains an accurate depiction of a fight between the two.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
I think its irrelevant since Creed didn't have his powers when it happened, some people think it means that Iron Fist retroactively beat Creed with his powers and the fight still remains an accurate depiction of a fight between the two.
Hmm, okay, so basically:
Sabretooth the character gets created.
Iron Fist beats him one on one.
Marvel decides what they're going to do with Sabretooth, and give him his abilities, but also make him very old, so going by that, he would have "technically" had his powers when he fought Iron Fist, even though the writing can't reflect that?
Am I on the right track?
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Srank I believe you are incorrect as Creed did display powers in that issue. Not like the powers of today of course, that I agree with you all the way. But Danny himself is different from today then back then as well.
He displayed some intuition in "sensing" that Iron Fist was disguised as one of his men, but he didn't smell him out with super senses or anything, he just had a feeling. Hardly a power.
And for your other post, Wolverine didn't have his current powers when he fought Iron Fist either, just some vaguely defined level of enhanced durability, and it was much later when the idea of Creed being Wolverine's father floated around, which is one of several absurd ideas for the origin of Wolverine that got ignored, when Wolverine fought Iron Fist, Claremount was still fishing with the idea Wolverine was mutant Wolverine who turned into a human...
Originally posted by -Pr-
Hmm, okay, so basically:Sabretooth the character gets created.
Iron Fist beats him one on one.
Marvel decides what they're going to do with Sabretooth, and give him his abilities, but also make him very old, so going by that, he would have "technically" had his powers when he fought Iron Fist, even though the writing can't reflect that?Am I on the right track?
Yes.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
He displayed some intuition in "sensing" that Iron Fist was disguised as one of his men, but he didn't smell him out with super senses or anything, he just had a feeling. Hardly a power.
No. Creed stated " My Senses, read him as wrong. As an enemy."
He didn't say my "my feelings" also you forgot his dangerous claws as well.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
No. Creed stated " My Senses, read him as wrong. As an enemy."He didn't say my "my feelings" also you forgot his dangerous claws as well.
Here are the five senses: sight, touch, smell, taste, and hearing. Which one do you think he used? Creed didn't smell that it was Danny, he got a feeling that whoever it was was an enemy. That doesn't fall under the preview of any of the five senses. It's called intuition, and its not a super power.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
He didn't say which sense he used. He said "my senses" at least we know he used more then "one" sense to figure out Danny was disguised as his henchmen.
It's a turn of phrase. Creed's "sensed" that Danny was an enemy. That's called intuition, it's called instinct. It's not a superpower.
Well he did say instinct but clarified with "my senses read him wrong" and Danny viewed sabretooth as a cat(as cats have heightened senses)
IMO if the writer wanted to show your logic it would have been much easier with a simple "gut feeling" or the word "sensed" instead of "my "senses" read him wrong plural for more then just one thing....one feeling. But me thinks it was his way to show off Creeds more Cat like enhanced senses.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Well he did say instinct but clarified with "my senses read him wrong" and Danny viewed sabretooth as a cat(as cats have heightened senses)IMO if the writer wanted to show your logic it would have been much easier with a simple "gut feeling" or the word "sensed" instead of "my "senses" read him wrong plural for more then just one thing....one feeling. But me thinks it was his way to show off Creeds more Cat like enhanced senses.
You've never said or heard someone say "All my senses are telling my blah blah blah"? It's a turn of phrase, what it amounts to is saying "I have a gut felling." Creed "sensed" that the person coming into the room was an enemy, he didn't know or smell it was Danny, he just "sensed" it was an enemy. He intuited that there was something dangerous about the guard, it's nothing spectacular, and certainly not evidence of a super power. He trusted his instincts.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Right now I'm undecided. I'll see if i can get my hands on the comic, and give it a look.
it's a very good issue actually. and comes with a hefty price tag. bought it about 20 years ago when it wasn't so valuable. loved that early fist series. byrne was still really good at that time. i still think it was some of his best work.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Creed didn't have powers when he fought Iron Fist. Iron Fist didn't retroactively beat Sabretooth with powers because Creed has powers now, what he beat a powerless human Sabretooth, which is completely irrelevant to this or virtually any discussion. Marvel retcon'd Sabretooth's powers in Uncanny 212, completely invalidating any events prior to it.
Also it should be noted in Powerman and Ironfist 66. Ironfist had the advantage against Creed(once again) and Creed thought smart by turning off the lights to fight him in the dark against Danny(making him blind again, like there first fight) again Creed's comments.
"I'll be able to track you in the dark. Your scent...every move you make...will lead me to you like a beacon."
But Danny out wits him once again play's possum and KO's Creed.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Also it should be noted in Powerman and Ironfist 66. Ironfist had the advantage against Creed(once again) and Creed thought smart by turning off the lights to fight him in the dark against Danny(making him blind again, like there first fight) again Creed's comments."I'll be able to track you in the dark. Your scent...every move you make...will lead me to you like a beacon."
But Danny out wits him once again play's possum and KO's Creed.
Sounds like enhanced senses to me.
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Also it should be noted in Powerman and Ironfist 66. Ironfist had the advantage against Creed(once again) and Creed thought smart by turning off the lights to fight him in the dark against Danny(making him blind again, like there first fight) again Creed's comments."I'll be able to track you in the dark. Your scent...every move you make...will lead me to you like a beacon."
But Danny out wits him once again play's possum and KO's Creed.
Which happened three years after the issue we are currently talking about.
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Which happened three years after the issue we are currently talking about.
True. But I like that Danny was portrayed to have the advantage before Creed needed a advantage by turning out the lights.
The only time Creed had the advantage was when Danny was without his IF and was trying to summon it during there fight. In that marvel comic presents issue(Creed needed context to have a advantage)