First of all, let me congratulate you guys on the great match! After the rules settled into their final forms, the debating was great.
I feel like both prep plans seemed quite valid, and I don't see that often in tournaments. The thousand clones and summons go off without a hitch as far as I can see. Downloading the dominus objective seems totally supported by the scans despite leo's objectiongs.
To me, however, this fight hinged mainly on one thing. Originally, Ambient's plan was simply to crush the enemy with physical force; this idea was rendered completely ineffective because all of the Based Gods characters are immortal. At that point, it seems Ambient relied increasingly on his TP for getting the win, either by mass brainwashing or infonet knockout.
First, the mass brainwashing. It is true that Magneto's abilities probably couldn't completely nullify TP use; but that doesn't really change much, because I think it would still prove a huge hindrance to this plan which relied on the TP working without problems. Leo rightfully pursued this issue, asking for scans and calling Cable's TP credentials into doubt. As it is, I can see Cable maybe snagging a couple of zombies, but controlling the entire army seems very doubtful. Captain Comet's mind control feats actually looked much better than Cables, so that could even be pushing it.
The infonet is almost a non-issue. Unfortunately there was no proof that it could work on characters with strong protection from mental attacks. Ambient could only assert that TP protection does not work on technopathy, but to me that opens up a whole new problem, as that would essentially be saying only someone with Cable's own powerset could resist the ability, bringing this rule into play:
Originally posted by inimalist
No characters who have attacks that would be unstoppable generally. Ala KK's tourney, a psychic or speedster attack is something you could reasonably expect and prepare for, an attack that is always 100% effective and lethal would not be allowed.
Again, I don't believe that's the case; I think psycho/leo's team can absolutely defend against it. But Ambient is caught between a rock and a hard place with this sort of no-limits fallacy. I think if he had been able to provide evidence of Cable doing this to anyone impressive, I would have been won over. As is, its just speculation.
I think Ambient put too much faith in his force field as well. Protecting from a nuke is great, as I think the zombies attacks are well below that level. But we're talking about him doing this while Magneto is actively undermining the shield, and the zombies never tire and are free to attack again and again. I feel that the shield may stand up for quite a while but will doubtlessly break eventually.
The last minute stuff about possible side effects to Warlock was interesting but I feel Ambient was totally correct in that only a rewriting is necessary, and that Warlock could survive the process. I see God Cable as easily achievable with this character combo.
In summary: I feel Ambient spent more time trying to defend his initial plans than actually fleshing out an effective offense. He essentially kept reiterating the "1000-to-3" line, assuming he could simply stomp team Based Gods. But 1000-to-3 (actually more like 40) doesn't mean much when those 3 regenerate all physical damage. TP was the only angle that seemed workable, but when it came down to it, the evidence just wasn't there. I think that Ambient might have done better to focus on nabbing a few summons whose abilities might have been useful against the opponent, rather than steadfastly insisting he would grab the whole army despite the numerous protections they had.
Meanwhile, PG/Leo's offense worked on multiple levels, and i'm convinced that the minute that shield goes down Ambient's team is in for a world of hurt. Based on that, I am casting my vote for Leo and Psycho Gundam
My vote is for Based Gods.
I feel like both teams had a main focus on the team, Magneto for the Based Gods, and Cable, for the Mutant X. Those two were the primary defensive and offensive focus of both teams and the other characters played supporting roles.
So it really comes down to Magneto vs Cable for me. I wasn't convinced the Cable's technopathy attack would work on Magneto, not that I didn't believe it possible, I simply don't think enough evidence was provided to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.
On the other hand, I thought Based Gods did a good job showing what a poor matchup Cable faces against Magneto, that Cable's weaknesses play into Magneto's strengths.
So the crux of my decision was on the fact that I thought Based Gods had a better matchup in pitting their superstar against Mutant X's superstar.
Originally posted by Ambient
Thanks KK!! Nicely done.. ✅Hmm! Immortal = unkillable, kinda off the rule
😖hifty: ..
it was one of the tactics I was watching for the battle
leo/gundam already know I'm looking at that prior to the redraft
lol, tbh, it was you two, and Simbon, whose characters I knew were going to cause nonsense, and as such, I think I was proved right, if, you know, in a highly confusing way...
can't wait for time conquerors....
Tbh. I saw that, I just didn't make any argumentation about it cause I wanted those summons in my team 😄. I thought I had quit a strong case regarding control of those immortal summons as my dupes, dough not in the level of God Cable was still capable of mind control the likes of Sam. So with G - Cable and the dupes, I was quite confident that my plan was passable but I quess the case wasn't strong enough.. That kinda back fired against me.. 🙁 Agh! Next time.. 🙂 😄
Originally posted by leonidashonestly, this was a confusing match to judge because the first 3 pages were filled with rulings rather than debating, and it is kinda confusing what was legal and what wasn't tbh
i'll be perfectly frank and say i didn't think we'd win the match. it's always interesting reading the judges' rationales.