Marka Ragnos and Dooku versus Sidious

Don't sally the good Count's honor.

As long as we're posting random shit.

Originally posted by SlightlyFlaccid
Don't sally the good Count's honor.

I win!

Allah grants victory to Mark and the good Count.

Originally posted by SlightlyFlaccid
I'm sure a certain moose and a certain German would have no compunctions about taste-testing the flavors of the two surviving Sith.

I'm sure those certain people would also taste-test Sidious, if some hillbilly from Kentucky hadn't eaten all the candy, including - but not limited to - Sidious' chocolate starfish. 🙄

And of course Sidious will win this. He will use the power of his ROOM SIZED SITH FOCUS CRYSTAL to defeat Dooku and Ragnos with his "unaided" abilities, that allowed him to...

...get thrown into a reactor shaft by a guy vunerable against Sidious main force attack, while Sidious executed said attack on the guy. I'm blinded by that uberness. 👆

A room sized sith focus crystal, you say?

In all fairness, the focus crystal was destroyed when that huge worm-like thing busted out of it near the end of Sithisis.

Originally posted by Galan007
In all fairness, the focus crystal was destroyed when that huge worm-like thing busted out of it near the end of Sithisis.

In all fairness. We see him performing a certain ritual that leads to the effect that somebody has listed as the greatest testament to Sidious unaided force abilities. And what we learn is, that he used an artifact to do so, that trumps almost anything ever used by the ancient Sith in size, including the focus crystal that Sadow had in his ship. And why should we assume that Sidious didn't use such objects on more than one occassion? That puts all of his "feats" to question, that are just described by some sourcebooks and never displayed "on screen".

Shall we ignore that? I don't think so.

I don't believe I said anything about ignoring that instance - please stop adding your own conjecture to my posts.

All I said is that by the end of Sithisis, the crystal was destroyed. Nothing more, nothing less.

Originally posted by Q99
A room sized sith focus crystal, you say?

The comic Sithisis shows Sidious casting lightning on a huge crystal, but the comic has no narration to describe what is happening in the comic. All we see is younglings at the temple bust out in tears of terror, and jedi such as Yoda seemingly lose concentration during battle. It shows Anakin seemingly tapping into the dark side and starts ripping apart battle droids with his bare hands.

I believe the only explanation we are given about the comic is in the Complete Visual Dictionary, which describes Sidious as using a ritual to send ripples in the force that caused anxiety and fear to jedi across the galaxy, and to increase Anakin's hunger for power. In other words, Sidious used a sith ritual to aide him in manipulating the emotions of the jedi on a galactic level, including one of the most powerful jedi in galactic history [Yoda].

I did not even have to click on Borb's post to know where this is getting at. He has misinterpreted the crystal's use in the past. This instance of Sidious using a ritual has nothing to do with Sidious' combat-oriented powers, and does not diminish his standing as being one of the greatest force users of all time. Seeing how Sidious was constantly using the dark side to hide his own force sensitivity and clouding the visions of most force users across the galaxy, with his own power (unaided), I don't see how needing some aide for this particular instance takes away from Sidious at all. But let's ignore how most of the so called "more powerful" ancient sith lords used sith artifacts for just about everything they did accomplish with the force.

(Is my fanboy showing?)

Nah. Though this bit:

Seeing how Sidious was constantly using the dark side to hide his own force sensitivity and clouding the visions of most force users across the galaxy, with his own power (unaided).

Isn't strictly true.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nah. Though this bit:

Isn't strictly true.

How so?

We don't know if he's clouding them totally with his own power and not through some ritual iirc.

Is there proof that Palpatine was using any power-augmenting artifacts after the events of Sithisis (ie. after the crystal/worm were destroyed)?

No. But we can't say for certain that he wasn't.

Plus I think he'd be a little more peeved if that was his only one after its destroyed and he kills it.

Spoiler:
The focusing crystal is never said to be used in anything other than "increasing Jedi anxiety" (The Ultimate Visual Guide).

Originally posted by Nephthys
No. But we can't say for certain that he wasn't.

Plus I think he'd be a little more peeved if that was his only one after its destroyed and he kills it.

We don't need proof. The fact that he could have done so means that we cannot say he did it without aid with any degree of certainty or proof.

S66
I believe the only explanation we are given about the comic is in the Complete Visual Dictionary, which describes Sidious as using a ritual to send ripples in the force that caused anxiety and fear to jedi across the galaxy, and to increase Anakin's hunger for power. In other words, Sidious used a sith ritual to aide him in manipulating the emotions of the jedi on a galactic level, including one of the most powerful jedi in galactic history [Yoda].

I didn't see this earlier, my bad.
Other than identifying the wrong source (it is The Ultimate Visual Dictionary, not The Complete Visual Dictionary), your summary is spot on. The crystal is only ever identified as increasing Jedi anxiety; Palpatine himself was identified as the sole and specific source of the shroud of the dark side blunting Jedi sensitivity. Borbarad is confusing two fundamentally different phenomena and assuming they are one and the same.

S66
(Is my fanboy showing?)

You're arguing that Sidious is something other than what Borbarad says he is, so yes. sneer

Originally posted by Nephthys
We don't need proof. The fact that he could have done so means that we cannot say he did it without aid with any degree of certainty or proof.

Spoiler:
Excellent. Nihilus could have plundered Malachor V's secrets, confiscated all manner of Sith focusing crystals, and used them to augment his powers. Now, I have no proof that he did, but apparently we don't need proof when it comes to arguing against a character we don't like. Right?