Originally posted by BentleyIt can't be justified, Jake just has failed to properly understand the scene.
Why would it not kill Thanos? I don't get it, obviously the blast stays as powerful as it was, as long as Hal can replicate it. Even if it means it kills trans levelers, how do you justify downgrading the blast?
Originally posted by BentleyI think Jake was trying to say that because Hal needed extra willpower to overcome the restriction on his ring, he wouldn't be able to readily duplicate his Krona-buster feat against another baddie like Thanos/DS/etc. There'd be no restriction for Hal to knowingly overcome, and thus no reason to exert additional willpower that would be required to create the blast that one-shotted Krona. At least that's how I read his point.
Why would it not kill Thanos? I don't get it, obviously the blast stays as powerful as it was, as long as Hal can replicate it. Even if it means it kills trans levelers, how do you justify downgrading the blast?
I don't agree with that assessment, but....yeah.
Jake made it pretty clear what he was saying already.
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
His willpower apparently superseded Krona's control of Ion (and the other entities) as well as bypass the ring's safeguard against injuring/slaying Guardians. I personally don't think the blast itself was so much powerful as its properties were capable to blast through those specific defenses. It's a great feat for Hal, still.
The blast compromised Krona's defenses, it wasn't the strength of the blast that did him in. Basically anyone other than Hal is going to have a much harder time hurting Krona, according to Jake.
I agree with that last part, at least. That blast was uber.
What I'm saying essentially is that Hal overcame a limitation from his power ring which would have normally prevented him from killing Krona, a Guardian (and one who was seriously amped at that).
If Hal was paired against someone like Darkseid/Thanos/Mordru/The Serpent/Badguy of the Week, I don't think we should assume that Hal's "Krona Killer" shot is going to one shot kill or maim those characters when it was shown explicitly that Hal overcame a specific obstacle inhibiting his ring.
And I really don't think my view downplays the blast at all.
Originally posted by Cogito
Jake made it pretty clear what he was saying already.The blast compromised Krona's defenses, it wasn't the strength of the blast that did him in. Basically anyone other than Hal is going to have a much harder time hurting Krona, according to Jake.
I agree with that last part, at least. That blast was uber.
Basically. The strength of that blast was immense (and I've never disputed that the blast wasn't powerful), but I don't think it was the sheer power of the blast which was the deciding factor, but Hal's will compromising those defenses which would have otherwise prevented Krona from being one-shot.
Originally posted by JakeTheBankHow could it not be the sheer power of the blast, when that was the only thing directed at Krona, and the only limitations that Hal overcame were his own ring's, which had nothing to do with Krona's defenses or his capability to deal with that blast?
Basically. The strength of that blast was immense (and I've never disputed that the blast wasn't powerful), but I don't think it was the sheer power of the blast which was the deciding factor, but Hal's will compromising those defenses which would have otherwise prevented Krona from being one-shot.
You're not making any sense here.
Ok, then what I don't get is how breaking a defense who is supposed to limit Hal is going to make his blast less effective. Or are you saying that Krona was not defending himself correctly because he was trusting that safeguard was enough? Or that such safeguard was at least an important part of his defense?
Originally posted by Philosophía
How could it not be the sheer power of the blast, when that was the only thing directed at Krona, and the only limitations that Hal overcame were his own ring's, which had nothing to do with Krona's defenses or his capability to deal with that blast?You're not making any sense here.
I see where Jake's going, and I don't necessarily disagree but I don't think there's any evidence to really support his argument either.
Krona had control of Ion. Ion is an abstract - the embodiment of willpower in the universe. Jordan's willpower was so great that it temporarily compromised Ion which, in turn, compromised Krona.
Originally posted by Philosophía
How could it not be the sheer power of the blast, when that was the only thing directed at Krona, and the only limitations that Hal overcame were his own ring's, which had nothing to do with Krona's defenses or his capability to deal with that blast?You're not making any sense here.
Hal's willpower overrode the security protocols of his ring, which enabled him to use lethal force on Krona.
Obviously the blast had to be powerful to injure, much less kill Krona, but if Hal didn't override those protocols, the blast wouldn't have finished Krona off. Which is what I'm saying. That doesn't demean the firepower of the blast at all.
And that's without factoring in Ion.
Originally posted by BentleyKrona wasn't even around when the Guardians forged the rings- thus he wasn't likely to have known the limitations they'd placed on them.
Ok, then what I don't get is how breaking a defense who is supposed to limit Hal is going to make his blast less effective. Or are you saying that Krona was not defending himself correctly because he was trusting that safeguard was enough? Or that such safeguard was at least an important part of his defense?
Anyway, this is how is see it: Hal willed a blast so powerful/concentrated that it overrode the safeguard and killed Krona. Easy-peasy. 🙂
Originally posted by JakeTheBankHal's willpower overrode his own ring's limitations, and he managed to produce a blast powerful enough to kill Krona.
Hal's willpower overrode the security protocols of his ring, which enabled him to use lethal force on Krona.Obviously the blast had to be powerful to injure, much less kill Krona, but if Hal didn't override those protocols, the blast wouldn't have finished Krona off. Which is what I'm saying. That doesn't demean the firepower of the blast at all.
Why would this same blast not be as potent against somebody like Thanos, when its effectiveness had nothing to do with Krona's defenses or power being weakened, just with the amount of willpower Hal summoned?
Originally posted by Nihilist
Hal's blast wouldnt have killed Thanos.As for the fight Krona wins, but Thanos makes im work for it.
Well, maybe not killed, I admit that Thanos's durability is very high, but it would certainly be hurtful and I see Hal killing/incapacitating the likes of Surfer with that. Thanos was maybe pushing it too far...
Originally posted by BentleyA blast from a cosmic cube only just ko'd Thanos and that was a weak Thanos from being reborn too early.
Well, maybe not killed, I admit that Thanos's durability is very high, but it would certainly be hurtful and I see Hal killing/incapacitating the likes of Surfer with that. Thanos was maybe pushing it too far...