Quicker pacing is nice but it can be a problem sometimes. Dunno though cause I never got around to picking up Fairy Tail again. I'll get to it eventually though.
OP needs to be on cause it's making me mad. I hate complaining about OP because even though I disliked Skypeia, the rest of pre time skip was golden(or silver at least). That's why I haven't compared the pre-time skips of the big three, OP would win.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
Quicker pacing is nice but it can be a problem sometimes. Dunno though cause I never got around to picking up Fairy Tail again. I'll get to it eventually though.
Yea, it's not always a good thing*, but when comparing chapter-by-chapter? It means it does pretty well.
*Mind you, I, personally, love quicker pacing ^^
It's just after Legend of Korra I get really nervous when I hear fast pace. In the hands of a talented writer, the pacing will go at a pretty decent speed that isn't too fast or too slow.
Hmm...best pacing of the HST? mmm
I have a feeling Bleach won't get the nod on this one unless you prefer slow pacing.
I don't read Toriko, btw, so my comments don't include that one.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
It's just after Legend of Korra I get really nervous when I hear fast pace. In the hands of a talented writer, the pacing will go at a pretty decent speed that isn't too fast or too slow.
I'll add that in general, shonen errs to the slow side, sometimes by a little, sometimes by a lot. None of the big shonen series have a fast pace.
Fairy Tail being faster paced, just means it's medium-paced.
There's series like, say, Record of a Fallen Vampire. It's 10 volumes long, a lot of stuff happens in each volume, and it's not rushed. It just doesn't waste any time either.
Or to take a long series, Negima has a tournament arc with 16 competitors, that shows all but one of the fights and only one person dropped out. In other words, 12 fights total. All in 4 volumes, with breaks for other character/plot progression outside of the fights, and you will not get in the least bit lost on what's going on.
That's good fast pace without even rushing.
Hmm...best pacing of the HST? mmmI have a feeling Bleach won't get the nod on this one unless you prefer slow pacing.
Hah, Bleach has abhorrent pace 🙂 There are volumes, plural, that don't divert from the main plot, where you can say, "Did anything important happen in this volume, in either plot progression or character development? No."
It's pre-Soul Society volumes have nice pace, medium pace. It's Soul Society ones were a bit slower and paused occasionally, but still kept things moving. Post? You have entire sub-arcs that turn out to not matter that are longer than FT's full arcs.
Naruto has the best pace of the SJ trio. One Piece tends to drag stuff out a bit- even some good parts like the Whitebeard War, for example, spend a lot of panels on random fight shots of mooks clashing. And Oda does like stalling confrontations- Wapol avoiding any of the main characters for quite awhile, Luffy having to climb to face Enel twice, all the time spent not-punching Hodi, heck, even in good arcs, you almost always had at least some stall factor (like Luffy being underwater in the Arlong arc, or the trouble finding Luffy and getting him to the fight location plus the slippery slope in the Kuro arc).
Shounen Jump editors, btw, certainly encourage stalling ^^
Originally posted by Q99
That's good fast pace without even rushing.
Are you under the impression that I'm as easy to manipulate as NemeBro? I do not fall for subtle advertisement of Negima. uhuh
Originally posted by Q99
Hah, Bleach has abhorrent pace 🙂 There are volumes, plural, that don't divert from the main plot, where you can say, "Did anything important happen in this volume, in either plot progression or character development? No."It's pre-Soul Society volumes have nice pace, medium pace. It's Soul Society ones were a bit slower and paused occasionally, but still kept things moving. Post? You have entire sub-arcs that turn out to not matter that are longer than FT's full arcs.
Naruto has the best pace of the SJ trio. One Piece tends to drag stuff out a bit- even some good parts like the Whitebeard War, for example, spend a lot of panels on random fight shots of mooks clashing. And Oda does like stalling confrontations- Wapol avoiding any of the main characters for quite awhile, Luffy having to climb to face Enel twice, all the time spent not-punching Hodi, heck, even in good arcs, you almost always had at least some stall factor (like Luffy being underwater in the Arlong arc, or the trouble finding Luffy and getting him to the fight location plus the slippery slope in the Kuro arc).
Lol abhorrent is harsh. But maybe fitting, idk. But I will say that Bleach's pacing is probably due to the supporting cast stealing the show. Kubo letting everyone get a fight when Aizen was just going to effortlessly stomp was just a waste of time since none of the fights ultimately did anything to the villain.
I agree, Oda does stall too often. The fight with Arlong being the most noteworthy example I can think of(there is no reason Luffy should have been unable to get out of that before Arlong did that crap lol). In fact if I'm being 100% honest, Impel Down felt like it was stalling quite a bit. I still liked it but Luffy goes there to save Ace, Ace gets moved, Luffy goes somewhere else to save Ace. Thankfully, Jimbei, Crocodile, and others showed up(and less fortunately, so did Ivankov), saving it from being totally pointless.
Originally posted by Q99
Shounen Jump editors, btw, certainly encourage stalling ^^
Oh? What makes you say that? I agree though.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
Are you under the impression that I'm as easy to manipulate as NemeBro? I do not fall for subtle advertisement of Negima. uhuh
Hey Nemebro isn't th only person here that read Negima. I feel kind of offended 🙁
I will agree that Naruto has the best pacing even despite the "magic eyeball/hebi arc" or"magic eyeball/kage summit" arc. Though OP does tend to have more entertaining arc IMO.
Wakka, you are like Pac-man. You should not give a darn what I say. You should just like...eat a pellet. And then try and eat me while I run away like a little girl. :T
That goes into which do you think is better lol.
It's amazing how youtube can so quickly become Naruto vs One Piece in a second by the way. Like it's instant. If the two are ever loosely mentioned together, it's on.
I ate all of my pellets early...nonetheless I did enjoy it even if the beginning is horrible and I thought I was turning into a pedophile from all of the fanservice.
I find myself enjoying Naruto more recently though Fairy Tail has a decent pace as well.
Only 4 years ago it was Naruto vs Bleach the ravaged youtube. That is funny though.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
Are you under the impression that I'm as easy to manipulate as NemeBro? I do not fall for subtle advertisement of Negima. uhuh
Please, fall for my subtle advertisement of Record of a Fallen Vampire 🙂
You know how I've been called on recommending manga that take a few volumes to get good?
RoaFV starts off with the vampire king swearing vengeance over the imprisonment of his queen while a dying soldiers tells him of the forces that will hunt him over the centuries while he tries to save her.
Lol abhorrent is harsh. But maybe fitting, idk. But I will say that Bleach's pacing is probably due to the supporting cast stealing the show. Kubo letting everyone get a fight when Aizen was just going to effortlessly stomp was just a waste of time since none of the fights ultimately did anything to the villain. [/quote[I have experience in editing, I say abhorrent 🙂
Consider stuff like the Szayel fight, which drags on looong to no plot purpose and who doesn't really advance either Uryu or Renji. Or the four pillars fights- each makes sure we get to know the arrancar who are killed off right then and there.
One doesn't have to give nearly as much time to side-character fights even if he likes them- they get about as much length as actual important fights early on.
Kubo's biggest failing is perhaps failure in making most of it relevant, and not being relevant, they are expendable.
Consider Luppi most of all- Luppi ending up doing nothing but serve as non-vital motivation for Grimmjow, who was not himself highly relevant to the wider plot, and was simply there to fill a rival fight before Ulquiorra, and Ulquiorra and the other espada were in turn later revealed to be a red herring. Meaning, Luppi is literally not only not relevant, but three degrees away from being important to the bad guy's plot.
You could cut Ulquiorra from the plot if you had to, though it'd take a bit of work. Cutting Grimmjow would be pretty easy. Cutting Luppi would be incredibly trivial.
[quote]In fact if I'm being 100% honest, Impel Down felt like it was stalling quite a bit. I still liked it but Luffy goes there to save Ace, Ace gets moved, Luffy goes somewhere else to save Ace. Thankfully, Jimbei, Crocodile, and others showed up(and less fortunately, so did Ivankov), saving it from being totally pointless.
Yea, it had it's purposes... but it could still be cut down.
Oh? What makes you say that? I agree though.
Japanese editors have a lot of control over the story in general.
Most famously, Akira Toriyama was heavily pressured into extending DBZ multiple times, including mid-arc. The Buu saga was supposed to end sooner, for example. Also the Cell saga- 19 and 20 were originally supposed to be *the Androids*. 17 and 18 were added in after the arc was already in progress.
Big series creators in general are known for not being allowed to end 'em. Inu Yasha's another example, that one had crazy amounts of filler.
Honestly whoever editors Naruto is an abberation among big-series editors, in a (generally) good way. At least when it comes to pacing. Word has gotten out that, for example, Tsunade was supposed to fight with Pain, but the editor said, "No, you've done enough prelim fighting, hurry it along," hence the defending-against-the-towncrusher exhausting her out of the way. And even liking Tsunade and as someone who'd love to see that fight, I can say it probably didn't affect the plot to remove it.
Originally posted by Q99Please, fall for my subtle advertisement of Record of a Fallen Vampire 🙂
You know how I've been called on recommending manga that take a few volumes to get good?
RoaFV starts off with the vampire king swearing vengeance over the imprisonment of his queen while a dying soldiers tells him of the forces that will hunt him over the centuries while he tries to save her.
I may.
Neat. Then again I could recommend the bible to someone by saying God creates the universe in like chapter 1. The result is still just him talking it into existence. 😛
But hey, I might.
Originally posted by Q99
Japanese editors have a lot of control over the story in general.Most famously, Akira Toriyama was heavily pressured into extending DBZ multiple times, including mid-arc. The Buu saga was supposed to end sooner, for example. Also the Cell saga- 19 and 20 were originally supposed to be *the Androids*. 17 and 18 were added in after the arc was already in progress.
Big series creators in general are known for not being allowed to end 'em. Inu Yasha's another example, that one had crazy amounts of filler.
Honestly whoever editors Naruto is an abberation among big-series editors, in a (generally) good way. At least when it comes to pacing. Word has gotten out that, for example, Tsunade was supposed to fight with Pain, but the editor said, "No, you've done enough prelim fighting, hurry it along," hence the defending-against-the-towncrusher exhausting her out of the way. And even liking Tsunade and as someone who'd love to see that fight, I can say it probably didn't affect the plot to remove it. [/B]
Sound like jerks.
To be fair, I like 16, 17, 18, and Cell more than them anyway. Tropes are not Bad I guess.
Yay for Naruto's editors! Though I do wonder if it's the publishers who have all this power instead? mmm I have this weird image of an editor finding a typo and declaring an extension on the work.haermm
Man...I'd love to meet Kubo's editor. Just for the stories he'd have.
Mm, that doesn't sound like a 'hits the ground running' start.
It's quite awhile before the action gets going again.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
Sound like jerks.
Oh yea. I'm sure it varies individual to individual editor, and established names have *some* pushback, but, like, if you're a new mangaka?
"I'd like to do a supernatural horror-action series!"
"Mm, really? Well, we'd like you to do a tennis manga. Do that first."
^Is the level of control they have.
To be fair, I like 16, 17, 18, and Cell more than them anyway. Tropes are not Bad I guess.
I don't know if Cell was originally planned either. I suspect not.
Originally posted by Q99
Mm, that doesn't sound like a 'hits the ground running' start.It's quite awhile before the action gets going again.
Start off with a...Big Bang? rimshot
Depends on your cup of action I guess.
Originally posted by Q99
Oh yea. I'm sure it varies individual to individual editor, and established names have *some* pushback, but, like, if you're a new mangaka?"I'd like to do a supernatural horror-action series!"
"Mm, really? Well, we'd like you to do a tennis manga. Do that first."
^Is the level of control they have.
Oh God please tell me that's how Prince of Tennis got started. haermm
Originally posted by Q99
I don't know if Cell was originally planned either. I suspect not.
Since his character revolves around eating 17 and 18, probably not. I guess he could have made it 19 and 20 that Cell needed to eat but then that brings up the question of why he'd bother with the former pair if he had Cell on the back burner from the beginning.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
Start off with a...Big Bang? rimshotDepends on your cup of action I guess.
It didn't really have a giant explosion 🙂 Just 'let there be light,' then talking about making stuff day by day.
Compare to, say, Norse myth, where the world's made from the bones of insanely massive giants. Or Hindu, where the world was made after the destruction of an old.
Though it does beat Greek, "Ok, there was, like, the couple gods around already. They banged." (with a couple variants on who was banging)
Any creation myth is going to have the universe made, but the drama factor varies.
Oh God please tell me that's how Prince of Tennis got started. haermm
I don't think that's the case, considering that mangaka sprung for a sequel too.
It was probably some minor Tennis series we never heard of (there's many sports manga in Japan, of course).
(Sidenote- I rather like Prince of Tennis! It just takes it's over-the-top tennis so seriously!)
The artist for Death Note got started on Hikaru no Go, the manga based on the boardgame Go (working with an author).
Originally posted by Q99
It didn't really have a giant explosion 🙂 Just 'let there be light,' then talking about making stuff day by day.Compare to, say, Norse myth, where the world's made from the bones of insanely massive giants. Or Hindu, where the world was made after the destruction of an old.
Though it does beat Greek, "Ok, there was, like, the couple gods around already. They banged." (with a couple variants on who was banging)
Any creation myth is going to have the universe made, but the drama factor varies.
It was just for a joke! D:
Then again, a light appearing out of nowhere would look like a giant explosion. If anyone were around to watch it I guess.
Originally posted by Q99
I don't think that's the case, considering that mangaka sprung for a sequel too.It was probably some minor Tennis series we never heard of (there's many sports manga in Japan, of course).
(Sidenote- I rather like Prince of Tennis! It just takes it's over-the-top tennis so seriously!)
He started to appreciate it. uhuh
Indeed. Hmm...I kinda want Kishi to write more Bench! honestly. I liked it. :T
And I never read or watched it lol. May in the future but I'll take Beyblade as my over the top sports thing. Watch it, is funny.
Originally posted by AuraAngel
And I never read or watched it lol. May in the future but I'll take Beyblade as my over the top sports thing. Watch it, is funny.
The funny thing is how some of it is based on real tennis moves, then it just starts getting more and more turned up as time goes on.
It's not that they get magic powers like some supernatural sports manga, they're just really good at tennis!
Lol you're thinking of the old show, where they tried to explain it. The new show cares not for such things. The strength of a beyblade comes from the Bladers spirit! Put another way, it's handwaved the same way Sanji not being burnt by his Blaze kick. I.e, his heart his burning far more intensely.
Though there is some mystical power at work with regards to the bad guys and some beyblades have special origins to help deal with the silliness of it all(the faster than light beyblade is one of these but the reason it is so fast is because of the tip).
Edit: It also has this battle. Which is amazing.