Chaos King vs Lucifer Morningstar

Originally posted by Epicurus
By incinerating him to back to being the subskyfather level weakling which was imprisoned by the Japanese gods.

The only way they beat him was by giving him what he always wanted, to be alone again.

As an aspect of Oblivion, probably his most powerful ever depicted on panel, he's not being killed by anything short of a trans-multiversal power. SuperGod Herc, that RESTORED 98.75% of the multiverse, couldn't do it. Lucifer isn't doing anything but dying painfully.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Yeah, zop is being zop again.

Lucifer wins handily

Originally posted by zopzop
To those saying Lucifer, how?

As for the quote under your sig: you realize there isn't an "ass" in "chaos", right? It's pronounced 'kay-oss', not 'kay-ass'. Food for thought. 👆

Originally posted by Galan007
Simple, by BFR'ing CK into a void... That's how they did it on earth, after all.

As for the quote under your sig: you realize there isn't an "ass" in "chaos", right? It's pronounced 'kay-oss', not 'kay-ass'. Food for thought. 👆

A

J
O
K
E

Originally posted by zopzop

You realize there were special circumstances behind that right?

It's a joke.

A

J
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K
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Jokes are for rich people. 👇

Originally posted by Mr Master
Oblivion is not empowered by the void. (well, at-least he never was before)

I was not referring to Oblivion being empower, but Lucifer likely not being able to work his mojo. His thing is manipulating reality, not creating. The latter role belongs to Michael. I don't know what he could or couldn't do to the Chaos King in a void, but that's exactly why he had to free Michael from Sandalphon and detonate him in the void so that he could create his own multiverse.

Originally posted by zopzop
He started out that way but apparently became much more. It took Lucifer and Michael combined to create a universe.

While there is evidence to suggest it was a universe, the stronger evidence alludes to it being a multiverse. Lucifer: Nirvana outright says it, and the fact that it's completely separated from Yahweh's creation (which is a multiverse on its own), further supports this case.

Just like there's evidence suggesting that CK only destroyed the majority of a single universe, but the stronger evidence saying that it was a multiverse.

Originally posted by zopzop
CK was/is a confirmed multiversal power.

Lucifer is multiversal as well.

And his scale of influence is greater. He managed to give Elaine's adoptive father (who was in Yahweh's multiverse) a heart attack with a mere gesture, while being in his own creation. That's trans-multiversal scale of control.

I still haven't read the relevant issues but ... How was CK defeated?

Was it simple bfr ... or was he 'tricked' (pis) somehow to leave, or allow the bfr?

If he was never defeated vs an opponent or more,
and he wasn't bfr'd, and instead plot got em trapped in that disconnected reality,
then imo, sayin he can just be bfr'd is out of the question.

Also, why can't he leave/escape this reality he's trapped in?

Originally posted by operator616

And his scale of influence is greater. He managed to give Elaine's adoptive father (who was in Yahweh's multiverse) a heart attack with a mere gesture, while being in his own creation.

That's trans-multiversal scale of control.

Cool feat, but I wouldn't label that as trans-multiversal scale of control.
(makes it read like he's controlling an actual multiverse and more)
When I think you didn't mean that.

Ey, for the innocent onlookers lest they be confused. 🙂

Originally posted by Mr Master
I still haven't read the relevant issues but ... How was CK defeated?

Was it simple bfr ... or was he 'tricked' (pis) somehow to leave, or allow the bfr?

If he was never defeated vs an opponent or more,
and he wasn't bfr'd, and instead plot got em trapped in that disconnected reality,
then imo, sayin he can just be bfr'd is out of the question.

Also, why can't he leave/escape this reality he's trapped in?

He was BFRed into a lifeless universe that existed outside the mainstream multiverse. He loved it and said he was finally at peace or something to that effect.

If he wants to get out, I don't think ANYTHING is stopping him (the LT is out of action) and the mainstream Marvel multiverse would be phucked.

Originally posted by zopzop

It wasn't PIS believe it or not.
They "beat" him by giving him what he wanted all along, to be left alone.

He was BFRed into a lifeless universe that existed outside the
mainstream multiverse. He loved it and said he was finally at peace
or something to that effect.

'Plot induced stupidity' doesn't necessarily need to be "stupid."
It can also be a cheesy/or easy way out to end the story when you can't defeat a villain.

If you're right about what happened, then he was never defeated, never bfr'd,
and he won't come back cause he's happy there. (pis)

You know, for a sub-skyfather level beginning,
this guy has some incredible absorption capabilities.

Although, he wasn't able to suck in a universe off the bat, he had to increase in power to do so,
I'm wondering, along his trail of misery, was he ever stalled,
did anyone give him trouble?
Also, when he battled Herc, (who was multiversal I hear) what happened?

Originally posted by Mr Master
I still haven't read the relevant issues but ... How was CK defeated?

Was it simple bfr ... or was he 'tricked' (pis) somehow to leave, or allow the bfr?

If he was never defeated vs an opponent or more,
and he wasn't bfr'd, and instead plot got em trapped in that disconnected reality,
then imo, sayin he can just be bfr'd is out of the question.

Also, why can't he leave/escape this reality he's trapped in?

Here's the scene from CW #5:

http://i.imgur.com/eeWEJyo.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RCJJTO3.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Q0WeOMA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/iRVBQKm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/K1Q0hUp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/8NWYdnL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/VhVQdiW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RJpJyZk.jpg

Hercules punched CK into that bubble universe where he returned to his primordial state. But CK didn't know that he was bfr'ed, he thought that (due to the bubble universe's emptiness) he consumed the entire multiverse, and returned into his primordial state. The handbook clarifies this:

http://i.imgur.com/A6aW4Sc.jpg

Originally posted by Mr Master

I believe Zop meant someone who has trans-multiversal scale of control over space-time,
not just affecting a single individual across a trans-multiversal distance.

Cool feat, but I wouldn't label that as trans-multiversal scale of control.
(makes it read like he's controlling an actual multiverse and more)
When I think you didn't mean that.

Ey, for the innocent onlookers lest they be confused. 🙂

I know what he meant, which is why i didn't quote that part of his response (cause Lucifer didn't display trans-multiverse space-time control), i was just saying that Lucifer's range, is greater than the CK's (who never affected anything/anyone outside the mainstream multiverse).

Can't believe nobody's mentioned that Lucifer already 1 shot an abstract, Fenris.

And that Fenris was at the peak of his power at the time, while Lucifer was at his second weakest (weakest being de-winged, of course)

^ Fenris is no abstract. Come on. Sure, he was stated to be an embodiment of destruction, but his portrayal was certainly not abstract-level.

Originally posted by Galan007
A special circumstance not beyond Lucifer's ability to duplicate.

First off, scans of him creating anything universal in scale under his own power?

Secondly, scans of him going up against a being of CK's level. Keep in mind it took SuperGod Herc to punch him in the gate in the first place and SuperGod Herc is a confirmed MULTIVESAL power (he restored 98.75% of the multiverse and resurrected all the dead heroes/mortals/Gods/etc.. that CK destroyed).

Originally posted by operator616

Here's the scene from CW #5:

http://i.imgur.com/eeWEJyo.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RCJJTO3.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Q0WeOMA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/iRVBQKm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/K1Q0hUp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/8NWYdnL.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/VhVQdiW.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RJpJyZk.jpg

Hercules punched CK into that bubble universe where he returned to his primordial state. But CK didn't know that he was bfr'ed, he thought that (due to the bubble universe's emptiness) he consumed the entire multiverse, and returned into his primordial state. The handbook clarifies this:

http://i.imgur.com/A6aW4Sc.jpg

CK also laughed off Herc's punch, had it not been calculated perfectly
for CK to end up falling through rift, he wasn't gonna be stopped,
it was stated in the end, and Herc looked like he took the worst of it, while CK was laughing.

Interesting.

This guy is bad ass, and that's a pis defeat, he was never defeated.

Now let me see Herc remaking the Multiverse. 😄

Originally posted by operator616

I know what he meant, which is why i didn't quote that part of his response (cause Lucifer didn't display trans-multiverse space-time control), i was just saying that Lucifer's range, is greater than the CK's (who never affected anything/anyone outside the mainstream multiverse).

Originally posted by Mr Master
👆

CK also laughed off Herc's punch, had it not been calculated perfectly
for CK to end up falling through rift, he wasn't gonna be stopped,
it was stated in the end, and Herc looked like he took the worst of it, while CK was laughing.

Interesting.

This guy is bad ass, and that's a pis defeat, he was never defeated.

Now let me see Herc remaking the Multiverse. 😄

Here's Herc remaking reality:

http://i.imgur.com/FvpXobR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/6u3We4R.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/sHVM1Hf.jpg

Originally posted by operator616
Here's Herc remaking reality:

http://i.imgur.com/FvpXobR.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/6u3We4R.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/sHVM1Hf.jpg

I've said for many years, that the term "universe"
can mean "Multiverse" depending on the context of the story.
Although the term "multiverse" (infinite universeS) will never mean "Universe." (single reality)

Originally posted by zopzop
Seriously? Lucifer can create an empty universe outside the mainstream multiverse and BFR CK there?

Originally posted by Galan007
Why does he need to create a void when they already exist in his creation..?

The universe they tricked CK into existed OUTSIDE and was SEPARATE from the multiverse.

Lucifer dies.

Originally posted by zopzop
See the problem? They exist IN his creation which would get devoured by CK.

The universe they tricked CK into existed OUTSIDE and was SEPARATE from the multiverse.

Lucifer dies.