Originally posted by Omega Vision
It's worth noting that Egypt was equipped with crappy export-model T-62s and T-72s (which are basically only good for killing barefoot rebels) the last time they fought. Now they have world class tanks.
It wouldn't be as one-sided as it was before, though, I still think Israel would get air superiority on Egypt... let me look this up...
jeez, maybe not even. Ya, it would be a much different fight today.
Israel sort of has the ace in the hole though. If there were ever a real existential threat to the nation of Israel, America would provide assistance as needed.
Originally posted by inimalist
It wouldn't be as one-sided as it was before, though, I still think Israel would get air superiority on Egypt... let me look this up...jeez, maybe not even. Ya, it would be a much different fight today.
Israel sort of has the ace in the hole though. If there were ever a real existential threat to the nation of Israel, America would provide assistance as needed.
Originally posted by inimalist
oh ya, I wouldn't say Israel has the second best overall. maybe for what they are designed for, but certainly not when compared to just the raw strength of other western nations.Honestly, I tend to think Israel would have a lot of issues in a full scale war against Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, and for sure Turkey. The Seven Days war was a different era, Isreal is powerful in the region, no doubt, but the occupation has changed the priorities of the military so much that I'd be skeptical of their abilities in conventional battle against militaries where the same type of tactics that were so dominant in the 60s won't be insta-wins for the Israelis.
👆
The small war or skirmish with Hizbollah in 2008(?) sort of proved that Israel will have a difficult time, also in conventional battles, though throwing Turkey and Pakistan against Israel along with Saudi Arabia, is a bit unrealistic imo. I don't think Turkey being a member of Nato will attack a close friend of the US. I also don't think that Pakistan will dare such a move either given the increasing tension with India who will see such a move from Pakistan as hostile. And lets be honest there is really none of Israels neighbours that have the military might to challenge Israel, atleast not imo.
Originally posted by Utrigita
👆The small war or skirmish with Hizbollah in 2008(?) sort of proved that Israel will have a difficult time, also in conventional battles, though throwing Turkey and Pakistan against Israel along with Saudi Arabia, is a bit unrealistic imo. I don't think Turkey being a member of Nato will attack a close friend of the US. I also don't think that Pakistan will dare such a move either given the increasing tension with India who will see such a move from Pakistan as hostile. And lets be honest there is really none of Israels neighbours that have the military might to challenge Israel, atleast not imo.
After looking it up, I'd suggest Egypt would probably give them enough of a run that neither side would risk conflict, but sure, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Israel isn't threatened by them to any serious degree, at least in conventional war. Hezbollah has given them a couple bloody noses in their conflicts recently, maybe not winning them all, but certainly doing very well for the type of asymmetric warfare they use.
I also agree it isn't very realistic that Pakistan or Turkey would engage in an all out war against Israel, though, with the Turkish-Israeli relations souring as quickly as they are, I wouldn't be surprised if it was discovered that Turkish intelligence had been supporting Hamas or Hezbollah, though I don't suspect it is happening, especially with the Iranian connection.
The Saudis are a more interesting case, as I honestly think they are at least as strong as the Israelis are, minus the nukes, and are potentially the most likely/capable to attack them (minus Turkey I guess). The problem is, the only thing that makes them so powerful is the support of the US and European nations, which would be lost instantly in a conflict with Israel, so there would be no realistic "win" condition for the Saudis.
Certainly, though, the combined force of the GCC could probably dominate the region militarily with the exception of Egypt (who is friendly to the GCC anyways) and Turkey.... Pakistan/India if we include South Asia.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
People are underestimating Turkey. It is one of the strongest members of NATO.
But Turkey doesn't have a hundred or so nuclear weapons like Israel.
That skews things a bit.
Also Turkey has the second largest military in NATO, but in terms of strongest...I would never give them the nod over France, UK, Germany, or Italy.
Mahmoud Ahmedinijad, Iran's President, called George W. Bush on the phone late one night.
"I've had a remarkable dream, Mr. Bush", he said, "and it's something you should know about."
"Well Mr. Mindinajar, what was your dream all about?", queried the former President.
"I dreamed that the USA had gone through an enlightening reformation", he said, "and in front of every house was a huge banner."
"That's intriguing, Mr. Mindinajar. Tell me, what did it say on these banners?", asked Bush.
"They all said the same thing: Allah is God, Allah is great", stated Mahmoud, as if he could taste victory.
"It's quite odd that you should call me about a dream, as I had one the other night as well", said Bush.
"And what was your dream about, Mr Bush?
"I dreamed that Iran had gone through a reformation as well, and on every house was a flagpole."
"So, what was on the flags?", asked Ahmedinijad.
"I have no idea", said Bush, "I can't read Hebrew."
News flash! Israel "borrowed" 6 F-22s and bought 6 German built submaries capable of firing nuclear tipped cruise missiles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dolphin_class_submarine). The Israeli Air Force is one of the best in the world with the best fighter aircraft in the world supplied by yours truly the United States. Israel wins any fight in the middle east . . . probably even against European countries (no offense to the UK).
Like us, the UK's military budget has been slashed and many new weapons that should have been deployed or developed haven't. The only notable ones are the Virginia class subs, the Zumwalt class stealth destroyers and the JSF-35 that the UK, France and U.S. field. Our fighter aircraft is a bit dated, the Abrams tank is due to be retired in 2017. American and British forces are exhuasted from 10 years of war. Simple logistics.
Originally posted by Darth Truculent
If you're from the UK I don't mean no offense. I'm from the U.S. and I seriously doubt at this point America can beat Israel. They already have their guns loaded and ready to kill Iran. The American and UK militaries aren't ready yet due to exhuastion.
wait...
you think Israel is stronger than America? w-where do you possibly get this idea from? Do you know why Israel is pushing for America to strike Iran?
I'm not British at all...