Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Yeah, I think AoU is going to be like Kingdom of Heaven or Heaven's Gate where the addition of extra footage will uplift it from a problematic movie to a great movie.One thing that bugged me: Why is Ultron insane? Ultron in the comics is insane because his personality is based on Hank Pym, who is mentally unstable too, but MCU Tony Stark isn't close to being that.
He was insane because he was almost immediately self aware and had full access to pretty much every shred of information ever. Also he was based off of Tony who hasn't had the best mental health record in the MCU. Imagine if a guy was born blind, and then suddenly he can see and the first thing he does is look up at the sun.
Originally posted by KingD19
He was insane because he was almost immediately self aware and had full access to pretty much every shred of information ever. Also he was based off of Tony who hasn't had the best mental health record in the MCU. Imagine if a guy was born blind, and then suddenly he can see and the first thing he does is look up at the sun.
Tony has problems with PTSD and being a narcissist, but it's not like he's as close to as unstable as comic book Hank Pym is.
I can kind of understand Ultron freaking out over waking up being a discorporate consciousness, but J.A.R.V.I.S/Vision had no problem with it, so why does Ultron?
Okay time for my in depth review of Avengers Age of Ultron after my second viewing. So it does not seem like people are having problems posting spoilers so I won't either. So warning there will be spoilers below.
Once again there will be Spoilers Below if you do not want to read them skip this post.
Now that is out of the way let us talk Avengers. Now I will have to compare this to the original Avengers. Normally I try to avoid comparing movies but I've made the statement, and continue to believe this statement, that this is better than the original Avengers. I will explain why. Now the criteria I judge this on could be different than another's as most of this is all opinion based anyways.
So I thinkhow the characters were handled in this movie was much better than in the Avengers. Yes Whedon tried to give every Avenger one shining moment and some time but in the end I honestly felt like Avengers 1 was the Tony Stark/Bruce Banner show. They seemed to get the best everything from scenes/interactions/good comedy/etc.
I'm going into more detail about the above comment so I can further explain why I think AoU did such a better job juggling the characters.
First major selling point to me was I thought character interactions in this movie were leaps and bounds better than the first. One of my biggest gripes was how stupid Captain America seemed compared to Tony. In Avengers they tried to show how different the two were but it really just came off as Steve seemingly looking pompous and Tony just squashing him verbally. They did a much better job in AoU of having Captain America not only being able to hold his own against Tony but actually making valid and intelligent counter points.
And this goes for all of the characters. Their interactions seemed natural, genuine, and it actually felt like time and effort had been put in to making each character interesting when interacting with another. There is not one scene in the Avengers that comes close to capturing the chemistry of the party scenes in AoU. Not even one on one interactions with characters. And it is not like the party scenes were the only good interactions in AoU it pretty much continued throughout the story.
I also felt, minus Tony/Banner, that the different characters not only did better interacting with each other but that each character was written better in this movie and they each had more impact. In Avengers 1 each character had their moment but often times it was only briefly until Tony/Hulk filled in the rest.
In AoU I felt everyone had much more chance to shine. Now AoU did not perfectly balance every character which is probably impossible and honestly some characters need slightly better scenes and dialogue to be more important like Hawkeye. Or to get them up to speed if they are newcomers like Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver. So adding a little extra focus is okay but I never felt like the other characters were backups to them. Which like I said in Avengers 1 I felt like you could have titled the movie Iron Man/Hulk and friends and no one would have second guessed it.
Now with that being said I did not really like the Black Widow Brice Banner romantic subplot. Although it wasn't nearly as bad on second viewing. Mostly because they did have some tender moments which helped. Still it did seem somewhat forced.
Now I'm going to go over Villains. I actually liked Ultron a lot and think Spader did a fantastic job with this character. The almost child-like way Ultron interacted with the world mixed with a cunning computer was great. Especially the scene where he gets compared to Tony Stark or when he first comes online. Was he has good as Loki probably not but at the same time Tom had already had one movie under his belt to refine the character.
Action wise I think this movie outshines Avengers by leaps and bounds. Every character gets a chance to be awesome over and over. The opening battle sequence was amazing. The Hulkbuster/Hulk fight was great. The final battle I was never bored for a second. Of course this movie did not have the defining Leviathan punch scene like the original Avengers had.
These are the reasons I think AoU is better than Avengers.
Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Tony has problems with PTSD and being a narcissist, but it's not like he's as close to as unstable as comic book Hank Pym is.I can kind of understand Ultron freaking out over waking up being a discorporate consciousness, but J.A.R.V.I.S/Vision had no problem with it, so why does Ultron?
Not all consciousnesses are the same, just like not all people are the same
Also keep in mind Jarvis was designed by Tony, built and upgraded for years and treated like one of Tony's closest friends despite being just a AI computer program.
Ultron was essentially a highly advanced bio-computer imprint that was lifted from the Mind Stone and instantly made self aware with no one to guide his knowledge intake or growth. As Jarvis pointed out, he was in distress only moments after he was born due to all the knowledge he was being exposed to, all the atrocities humanity had committed and such.
He was so frightened of Jarvis that he killed him. His emotions were all over the place.
Saw this at a Drive In Theater (I mention it because I think I wasn't able to appreciate the action and kinetic parts as well), so that being said...
Obviously it's highly impressive filmmaking here, but on another level Joss Whedon never fails to juggle a large, complex cast. Although I'm sure it helps that there are multiple previous films that have already developed characters. But still impressive. Another entertaining marvel from Marvel. I didn't realize Paul Bettany was the voice of Jarvis all this time. I thought it was Jude Law for some reason... lol. They must have been planning
Spoiler:from the beginning! Cool to see him, I like him as an actor.
his appearance as Vision
Originally posted by Patient_Leech
Saw this at a Drive In Theater (I mention it because I think I wasn't able to appreciate the action and kinetic parts as well), so that being said...Obviously it's highly impressive filmmaking here, but on another level Joss Whedon never fails to juggle a large, complex cast. Although I'm sure it helps that there are multiple previous films that have already developed characters. But still impressive. Another entertaining marvel from Marvel. I didn't realize Paul Bettany was the voice of Jarvis all this time. I thought it was Jude Law for some reason... lol. They must have been planning
Spoiler:from the beginning! Cool to see him, I like him as an actor.
his appearance as Vision
they still have drive-in theaters 😛
Originally posted by KingD19
Also keep in mind Jarvis was designed by Tony, built and upgraded for years and treated like one of Tony's closest friends despite being just a AI computer program.Ultron was essentially a highly advanced bio-computer imprint that was lifted from the Mind Stone and instantly made self aware with no one to guide his knowledge intake or growth. As Jarvis pointed out, he was in distress only moments after he was born due to all the knowledge he was being exposed to, all the atrocities humanity had committed and such.
He was so frightened of Jarvis that he killed him. His emotions were all over the place.
So basically Jarvis is a better AI than Ultron? Jarvis doesn't go insane with the vast knowledge of mankind. Jarvis out hacked Ultron for the nuclear codes. Jarvis has controlled multiple Iron Man suites as well. So, why did Tony need to build Ultron for again? He has a superior AI named Jarvis.
Originally posted by Dr Will Hatch
Exactly. I don't see why Whedon or Marvel had to make all of these convoluted changes to Ultron's origins. Just say that he was based on an old program that Hank Pym started but never finished.
That's what I thought it was. They threw out so many false leaks. I thought Pym's old program as discovered by Tony and he messes with it only for Ultron to take over everything. An insane Ultron based off the mind of the Pym makes more sense. They can still have the Mind Gem involved with Ultron learning about it and decides to create a body with the Mind Gem only for Jarvis to take over the build and become the Vision.
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
That's what I thought it was. They threw out so many false leaks. I thought Pym's old program as discovered by Tony and he messes with it only for Ultron to take over everything. An insane Ultron based off the mind of the Pym makes more sense. They can still have the Mind Gem involved with Ultron learning about it and decides to create a body with the Mind Gem only for Jarvis to take over the build and become the Vision.
No, Ultron is based on a reactor found inside Loki's scepter that Tony found at the HYDRA base. Hank's not involved whatsoever. He was supposed to be an upgrade over a bunch of drones that Tony made up called the Iron Legion.