Originally posted by BackFire
I know. Another smart thing Sony did, not try to force some pointless peripheral with every system.
Possibly, I mean the argument against the Kinect and the Move last gen was that they weren't available with every console. We'll see, I guess, I mean I personally find motion gaming fundamentally terrible, though at least the games at E3 used it in somewhat interesting supplementary roles (calling archers, shaking off zombies)
Originally posted by Ushgarak
I am one of those who thinks the idea of IP will change, though how fast it will be is another thing.I'm actually a straight arrow when it comes to purchasing media, though I don't listen to much music, I only buy films I've already seen so I know I like them anyway and I barely ever buy a game and feel I wasted my money or that the publishers and programmers did not deserve a cut, so it's an easy decision for me regardless of my moral stance. But in a broader sense, the idea of IP is already under vast attack from ease of data transfer. With books and music, it's already virtually dead in the water and the only thing slowing it with films and games is internet infrastructure. As soon as you can transmit films and games, globally, in seconds then they will be in the same situation as music now.
IP was created for a time of physical media. It also has a very strong moral case for existing, but it's fundamentally incompatible with a high-speed data age. Information will flow; the public pressure behind it will be unstoppable. The two things just don't logically co-exist. Hence the notion of ownership and the rights of creators will have to evolve to fit how the world works.
It will be publishers that lose out the most, I'd have thought. The creators will always have a moral case for getting revenue, even if it just comes down to voluntary donations, but publishers will get screwed.
I also act like a "boyscout" with my media consumption. I don't pirate games or TV Shows (though I do download the current episodes of Game of Thrones until HBO releases the Blu-rays).
And, yes, it is the publishers/distributors that will lose the most to the evolving intellectual property movement. That is good for the "artists". Cutting out the "middle-man" is what I look forward to, the most. This is already happening. I just wish it would happen, sooner.
Direct publishing of media? Hot damn.
This up and coming generation of consoles will not really take advantage of that. But I would like to see third party devs directly publish games for digital download onto consoles rather than having to go through a Nazi market.
Originally posted by dadudemon
This up and coming generation of consoles will not really take advantage of that. But I would like to see third party devs directly publish games for digital download onto consoles rather than having to go through a Nazi market.
Well, we don't know Microsofts plans yet. We might find out a lot more at Build next week though.
Originally posted by S_D_J
Resident Evil 6, Tomb Raider, Dead Space 3, Hitman are the ones that come to mind. You yourself said some games, so I can interpret just as well you knew what games I was talking about. My point is Publishers deeming said games as failures when clearly they aren't.
How do you determine profit? this benchmark isn't disclose as to make proper comparison.So what happens with a game you didn't like or thought was too short or simply are done with it as is likely you won't go back to it later.Are you just stuck with it? If microsoft were to have its way, that would have happen. I'm not talking about games you don't purchase cuz obviously you won't waste money on them and have little to complain about, I'm not taking about digital either with this point. It's physical copies they aren't ready to kill yet.
Even Steam is considering sharing games, and it might have something to do with that Germany lawsuitDLC is not consider or done just after games going gold, they're too thought of and develop while the game is being develop as well. This does not apply to all developers, but it is happening.
About Gamestop, not just some publishers, all of them do, all of them are in bed with Gamestop, Developers are told to make this preorder things, and most are for Gamestop exclusively.
You talk about the dead of Gamestop with an all digital future, why hasn't that happen now? What if Sony were to have gone the Microsoft way with the PS4, their policies would have been pretty much the same as the Xbone, and guess what?, one of those "participating retailers" would have been Gamestop (if not primarly) so what would have happen with, like it's put mostly, pops and moms stores? what would have happen with selling your games at Amazon or Ebay? they would be gone.They would have willingly eliminated Gamestop competition, not Gamestop itself.
Yes, they don't price digital accordingly because of retailers like Gamestop, because they are afraid of them, but this gen the gun was loaded and handed to both Sony and M$ to go all digital and outright kill Gamestop, they didn't. The infrastructure exist already and they don't use it, why?
Poor developers, even when they complain about used games, when they are gone it would Publishers benefiting from it, not the ones that make the game.
I don't like an all digital future to be honest, but it's inevitable. As long as convenience is more luring than proprietorship, I'm willing to buy digital, Steam gives you that, PS+ sales gives me that. Heck GOG is entirely DRM free and is great at it.
Again, just because those games you mentioned sold a few million copies doesn't mean they were a success. They may still have lost money. And if a game loses money it's a failure, no matter the sales. While I'm not saying used games are to blame for all the woes of the industry, they do contribute. If even a small portion of used game buyers are customers who would buy a game new, then it's costing the people who make games money.
I rarely buy a game I don't like. I research games before I purchase them. There's a lot of ways to see if a game you're thinking about buying is actually good. Gameplay videos, reviews, word of mouth, demos. If you buy a game and it ends up being shit, it's rarely anyone's fault but yours. I don't sell my games, I keep them. I have a collection. I think you should have the right to sell your physical copy of a game if you wish. That's not really what I have a problem with. I have a problem with the way Gamestop does business. They suck money from both the consumer and the industry and offer nothing in return.
Like I said, just because some/most/all publishers make deals for pre-order exclusives with gamestop and other retailers (it's not just Gamestop, they have pre order exclusives with bestbuy and others as well) doesn't mean Gamestop is now a boon to the industry. The publishers do this to try and get more people to buy their games NEW. Gamestop's used game trade is the very reason the publishers do this. They have to maximize profit on new games and get as many people to buy them new as possible in the first week or two of release, because after that used copies of that game will be available. It's part of that vicious cycle I mentioned. And Xbox One's various restrictions were the wrong way to go about trying to fix the problem. They focused too much on limiting the consumer while still bending over backwards for Gamestop. That's why there was the backlash. And they did this not because they love Gamestop, but because Gamestop holds a lot of power, currently.
You ask why they didn't just go full digital. They couldn't just yet. It would have been to sharp a transition seeing as most people are still used to buying their games in physical form, and there's still a lot of people who don't have the bandwidth to download all their games in a timely manner. This is what they're moving towards, though. Make no mistake. The announcement that all games for both systems will come out digitally on launch day didn't get a whole lot of press but is actually a really big deal. It's the start of the transition to fully/mostly digital and is very damaging to retailers like Gamestop.
You say that publishers will be the ones making the extra money. True. But what you don't seem to understand is if publishers make extra money from a game from a particular development team, then that development team will likely get more money for their next game. If publishers make more money, then the developers will also make more money.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Well, we don't know Microsofts plans yet. We might find out a lot more at Build next week though.
I am 1000% sure they will not allow an open-market for installing applications and games on their console. Just like now, they will have to publish it through the "Live" program.
Sources: I'm just that awesome.
Originally posted by dadudemon
I am 1000% sure they will not allow an open-market for installing applications and games on their console. Just like now, they will have to publish it through the "Live" program.Sources: I'm just that awesome.
Probably not an "open" market. But they could potentially become considerably more indie friendly.
Originally posted by BackFire
Again, just because those games you mentioned sold a few million copies doesn't mean they were a success. They may still have lost money. And if a game loses money it's a failure, no matter the sales. While I'm not saying used games are to blame for all the woes of the industry, they do contribute. If even a small portion of used game buyers are customers who would buy a game new, then it's costing the people who make games money.I rarely buy a game I don't like. I research games before I purchase them. There's a lot of ways to see if a game you're thinking about buying is actually good. Gameplay videos, reviews, word of mouth, demos. If you buy a game and it ends up being shit, it's rarely anyone's fault but yours. I don't sell my games, I keep them. I have a collection. I think you should have the right to sell your physical copy of a game if you wish. That's not really what I have a problem with. I have a problem with the way Gamestop does business. They suck money from both the consumer and the industry and offer nothing in return.
Like I said, just because some/most/all publishers make deals for pre-order exclusives with gamestop and other retailers (it's not just Gamestop, they have pre order exclusives with bestbuy and others as well) doesn't mean Gamestop is now a boon to the industry. The publishers do this to try and get more people to buy their games NEW. Gamestop's used game trade is the very reason the publishers do this. They have to maximize profit on new games and get as many people to buy them new as possible in the first week or two of release, because after that used copies of that game will be available. It's part of that vicious cycle I mentioned. And Xbox One's various restrictions were the wrong way to go about trying to fix the problem. They focused too much on limiting the consumer while still bending over backwards for Gamestop. That's why there was the backlash. And they did this not because they love Gamestop, but because Gamestop holds a lot of power, currently.
You ask why they didn't just go full digital. They couldn't just yet. It would have been to sharp a transition seeing as most people are still used to buying their games in physical form, and there's still a lot of people who don't have the bandwidth to download all their games in a timely manner. This is what they're moving towards, though. Make no mistake. The announcement that all games for both systems will come out digitally on launch day didn't get a whole lot of press but is actually a really big deal. It's the start of the transition to fully/mostly digital and is very damaging to retailers like Gamestop.
You say that publishers will be the ones making the extra money. True. But what you don't seem to understand is if publishers make extra money from a game from a particular development team, then that development team will likely get more money for their next game. If publishers make more money, then the developers will also make more money.
I have little faith in Publishers rewarding development teams properly. Granted this does not happen with all publishers, I've seen way to many times Studios closing or disbanding after being suck in by these publishers, it's a shame really.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Probably not an "open" market. But they could potentially become considerably more indie friendly.
Hopefully they do. M$ brought Indie development to consoles, can't deny that. But the bubble burst too soon, and their corporate greed showed up anyways.
"Xbox One preorders jump past PlayStation 4 after Microsoft drops DRM."
http://news.yahoo.com/xbox-one-preorders-jump-past-playstation-4-microsoft-142532847.html
Let the rabid seizures begin ...
Originally posted by FistOfThe North
"Xbox One preorders jump past PlayStation 4 after Microsoft drops DRM."http://news.yahoo.com/xbox-one-preorders-jump-past-playstation-4-microsoft-142532847.html
Let the rabid seizures begin ...
Good. This will teach them that you catch more flies with honey than a flamethrower. If they're rewarded for treating the consumer well they'll be more inclined to do so in the future.
Although why do you suppose they're ahead now? From what I've seen the PS4 looked better even without the DRM scandal. Is CoD truly that big of a draw?
Originally posted by FistOfThe North
"Xbox One preorders jump past PlayStation 4 after Microsoft drops DRM."http://news.yahoo.com/xbox-one-preorders-jump-past-playstation-4-microsoft-142532847.html
Let the rabid seizures begin ...
The Xbone has been in the top spot at Amazon since the launch PS4 sold out and drop in the listing (sitting currently at 19). Thing is, there are 5 different SKU PS4 (bundles actually) hovering the top spot as well because the launch editon is no longer avilable.
On day one (after prce anouncement) the Launch PS4 sold out while the Xbone day one edition is still available for pre-order.
Nice try though 😉
Originally posted by Bardock42
Worse. It's only referencing Amazon's change of rate of sales (or at least to a significant part). Amazon's best seller list is not an absolute number of sales list
^This
There were rumblings about the 10 family members being not entirely accurate
the rumor (that since has been denied) was that those "family members" had access to a "demo" version of the game for a timed period, before being asked to purchase it.
I don't think the rumor is true, but given how trustworthy M$ can be, it could have happened
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/21/on-xbox-ones-social-network-canceled-family-share-demos
Originally posted by Nephthys
Good. This will teach them that you catch more flies with honey than a flamethrower. If they're rewarded for treating the consumer well they'll be more inclined to do so in the future.Although why do you suppose they're ahead now? From what I've seen the PS4 looked better even without the DRM scandal. Is CoD truly that big of a draw?
You have a really optimistic view of Microsoft.
I'm still leery on the whole thing.