Originally posted by Dampyre
I don't see Superman beating a Surfer with CIS/PIS off. He simply has too many ways to beat Superman in this scenario. Still, I wouldn't be surprised if Superman somehow wins because, well, he's 'Super'.
Surfer still fights in character with CIS off, he's just more ruthless. In the same scenario, Superman could get some wins too.
Surfer's ways of beating Superman aren't as numerous as people would like to think, tbh.
Originally posted by -Pr-
Surfer still fights in character with CIS off, he's just more ruthless. In the same scenario, Superman could get some wins too.Surfer's ways of beating Superman aren't as numerous as people would like to think, tbh.
The Surfer certainly has more ways to beat Superman than vice-versa. The only way Superman can beat the Surfer is through brute force. The Surfer has raw power as well as many more exotic ways to beat Superman, not limited to just energy drain or manipulation.
Originally posted by Mindset
Elaborate.
Kryptonite won't work. Magic is a no-go. That leaves red-sun radiation, and even that would have to be a pretty extreme example to put him down.
Now, if you want to talk black holes or something, that's fine, but it's little more than a bfr.
Wearing him down with blasts could work, obviously.
Sure, forum avatar surfer has a million ways he could do it, but this isn't forum avatar surfer. he's still bound by his own mind and personality.
Originally posted by Dampyre
The Surfer certainly has more ways to beat Superman than vice-versa. The only way Superman can beat the Surfer is through brute force. The Surfer has raw power as well as many more exotic ways to beat Superman, not limited to just energy drain or manipulation.
i know what he's capable of, but a physical confrontation is a bad idea.
Originally posted by -Pr-Why wouldn't kryptonite work?
Kryptonite won't work. Magic is a no-go. That leaves red-sun radiation, and even that would have to be a pretty extreme example to put him down.Now, if you want to talk black holes or something, that's fine, but it's little more than a bfr.
Wearing him down with blasts could work, obviously.
Sure, forum avatar surfer has a million ways he could do it, but this isn't forum avatar surfer. he's still bound by his own mind and personality.
Originally posted by Digi
No one's winning 10/10. That's almost objectively false. Look at the number of combatants. Statistical inevitability alone ensures no one character would even win 5/10. We're talking about percentages and likelihoods.No less than 2-3 months ago, Thor fought Surfer to a standstill. Both fought dumb, of course, but that's 1v1, not a multi-person cluster****
Anyway, lowest Vegas payout would be on Surfer. I'd put the next lowest odds on either Hal (pre-FP), Thor, or Superman. Supes might be the most powerful overall, but also has more exploitable weaknesses than the others.
My wild card pick would be J'onn. Intangibility + TP, and he could outlast a lot of the bigger guns before swooping in for a late victory.
Points for no Hulk in the OP.
They're close enough to provide a challenge.
This man told the truth.
Great answer, sir.
Originally posted by Mindset
There is no alt universe, if they fight it's a shared universe.
But Superman isn't from Surfer's universe. Even if they're sharing a universe now, they are technically from different ones with different Earths.
I mean, sure, you can disagree and that's fine, it's just how I see it.
Then of course there's the argument that Surfer can/would even make it at all.
Originally posted by -Pr-If SS makes kryptonite it will be kryptonite derived from their shared universe.
But Superman isn't from Surfer's universe. Even if they're sharing a universe now, they are technically from different ones with different Earths.I mean, sure, you can disagree and that's fine, it's just how I see it.
Then of course there's the argument that Surfer can/would even make it at all.
There isn't any other way for him to make it. Even if the fight were to take place in the MU, he would still be making kryptonite that will affect Supes, because he will be ascertaining how to make it from Superman's body.
Originally posted by Mindset
If SS makes kryptonite it will be kryptonite derived from their shared universe.There isn't any other way for him to make it. Even if the fight were to take place in the MU, he would still be making kryptonite that will affect Supes, because he will be ascertaining how to make it from Superman's body.
Which wouldn't be the universe that Superman hails from. shrug
That's assuming you believe his cosmic awareness allows him the ability (or the mindset, pun unintended) to do so.
I realise I'm being off topic; I am talking about Preboot Superman, who isn't the Superman in this thread (even though I will admit I can see Surfer getting a slight majority). I'd say Surfer would beat DCNU Superman for the majority.
Originally posted by -Pr-A shared universe has exactly the same properties of Superman's universe, so anything made in said universe would have exactly the same properties as Superman's own universe. Which means the kryptonite would work, because that's what was decided with the amalgam universe idea was made.
Which wouldn't be the universe that Superman hails from. shrugThat's assuming you believe his cosmic awareness allows him the ability (or the mindset, pun unintended) to do so.
I realise I'm being off topic; I am talking about Preboot Superman, who isn't the Superman in this thread (even though I will admit I can see Surfer getting a slight majority). I'd say Surfer would beat DCNU Superman for the majority.
We aren't discussing if he would, but if he could. I don't see any reason why it wouldn't.
SS would shove kryptonite up Superman's paynuss, blast him in the butt with red sun radiation, then turn into Batman and kick him in the face.
I just can't see Norrin suddenly going, "I sense that you're vulnerable to red sunlight". Frankly I'd see Thor using Mjolnir to drain Supes before I see Norrin surmising a red sunlight weakness.
Likewise I don't buy the idea of anyone at this level of speed, where you have multiple dudes that routinely achieve speeds that exceed light many times over while reacting etc, are going to get blitzed by a dude moving faster then they can react to. Not happening imo.