Majestic VS Thor( Slugfest)

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't think Superman intended to kill Orion at any point. But compare the haymaker he threw and then the barrage he unleashed in effectiveness.

What? That part has me confused.

For example
Stand still a swing your arm without using your body.
Stand still, use your body/shoulders/legs//etc to swing.

totally different energy. That I can understand. I can't understand you saying because a character is using Superspeed, we have to treat the attacks weaker because otherwise, it's too godly powerful... 😉

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Yes.

Well done. One down one to go.

Will you please describe super speed?

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Superman vs Probes come to mind...

Superman vs. a Probe:
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172a.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172b.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172c.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172d.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172e.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172f.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Battles/villains/superman172g.jpg

http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Speed/combat/superman153b.jpg

Exactly my point. Look at that shit. When he speed blitzes, he's blows are a lot less effective in comparison to his attacks when he stands his ground. At least imo.

YOu understand that the entire fight was a speedblitz, from the start!

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Yes, a haymaker, charged punch is much different then a punch which doesn't have the same momentum.

For example
Stand still a swing your arm without using your body.
Stand still, use your body/shoulders/legs//etc to swing.

totally different energy. That I can understand. I can't understand you saying because a character is using Superspeed, we have to treat the attacks weaker because otherwise, it's too godly powerful... 😉

I'm not talking a charging punch. I'm talking about Superman standing there and throwing a punch vs. many super speedblows.

I'm not saying it makes sense. I'm just telling you what I've seen based in comics. You want me to ignore the evidence I've seen just because its inconvenient and does not conform to real life logic?

Originally posted by xJLxKing
YOu understand that the entire fight was a speedblitz, from the start!

What? That's not making any sense. Elaborate more, it's late and I'm tired.

Agree to disagree then.

No point to continue. This isn't something I plan on changing my mind on. And it's getting late. Maybe tomorrow we will continue

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
What? That's not making any sense. Elaborate more, it's late and I'm tired.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Agree to disagree then.

No point to continue. This isn't something I plan on changing my mind on. And it's getting late. Maybe tomorrow we will continue

Fair enough but do you have any fights that come to mind that support your point?

Any fights that have a strongman using a super speed barrage to take out an opponent? The only thing that comes to mind is this:
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa469/R-O-O/Thor/Non%20Cannon/KillsSentry3.jpg
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa469/R-O-O/Thor/Non%20Cannon/KillsSentry4.jpg

And even then, that haymaker he threw seemed to be a lot more effective then the jabs. Which is my entire point.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
THe entire fight, Superman was using his superspeed to fight the probe. He got caught when the probe said, "enough". He breaks the lock and continues to blitz him. Lands a charged punch which breaks the armor

Hmm? I'm not saying Superman was slow at any point but there's a clear difference between his initial attacks and his last blow and then super speed barrage in the middle.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Wait.. A handful of showings cement that he's more durable than his preboot version? 😮

I meant compared to WW.

Originally posted by Golgo13
I meant compared to WW.

As he should be!

😄

Yepers. 😮‍💨

Originally posted by xJLxKing
THe entire fight, Superman was using his superspeed to fight the probe. He got caught when the probe said, "enough". He breaks the lock and continues to blitz him. Lands a charged punch which breaks the armor

Looks to me more like Superman used his heat vision and freeze breath to weaken the armor by making it brittle then broke it with one aimed power punch to that same spot. The blitz punches looked more like he was trying to keep the Probe off balance with them than to do any real damage.

shrug

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Fair enough but do you have any fights that come to mind that support your point?

Any fights that have a strongman using a super speed barrage to take out an opponent? The only thing that comes to mind is this:
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa469/R-O-O/Thor/Non%20Cannon/KillsSentry3.jpg
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa469/R-O-O/Thor/Non%20Cannon/KillsSentry4.jpg

And even then, that haymaker he threw seemed to be a lot more effective then the jabs. Which is my entire point.

Hmm? I'm not saying Superman was slow at any point but there's a clear difference between his initial attacks and his last blow and then super speed barrage in the middle.

I'm curious. In both cases, how do we know that the final punch isn't at super speed?

Nothing suggests to me that they are not anymore than they are.

Originally posted by ares834
I'm curious. In both cases, how do we know that the final punch isn't at super speed?

Nothing suggests to me that they are not anymore than they are.

By the art.

Artists tend to be very explicit when they try to illustrate an attack as a speed attack or when it's not.

You have to produce evidence that something is a blitz attack (art, statements or narration will do tho) ppl don't have to produce evidence that it isn't (proving a negative and all that).

Except the art doesn't indicate anything either way and in both cases they are both coming after a clear speed blitz. In all honesty, I think one would have to prove that the character suddenly decided to slow down.

Heck, if anything in the Orion case the art seems to indicate the punch is at super speed.

Originally posted by ares834
Except the art doesn't indicate anything either way and in both cases they are both coming after a clear speed blitz. In all honesty, I think one would have to prove that the character suddenly decided to slow down.

Heck, if anything in the Orion case the art seems to indicate the punch is at super speed.

Again, burden of proof is on you as you can't have people try and prove a negative. If art (or any on panel evidence) isn't explicit about demonstrating super speed, it is assumed it isn't.

It was definitely thrown with a lot of speed behind it. But "blitz punches" aren't about the speed of one punch but the application of multiple punches at once. At least, that's how it looks like ppl are using it.

The art is very specific here. One panel shows Orion throwing many punches applied in a short time based on the art and SFX. The other panel is one big power punch.

Originally posted by Nibedicus
Again, burden of proof is on you as you can't have people try and prove a negative. If art (or any on panel evidence) isn't explicit about demonstrating super speed, it is assumed it isn't.

It was definitely thrown with a lot of speed behind it. But "blitz punches" aren't about the speed of one punch but the application of multiple punches at once. The art is very specific here. At least, that's how it looks like ppl are using it.

One panel shows Orion throwing many punches applied in a short time based on the art and SFX. The other panel is one big power punch.

Burden of proof tends to rely on the one making the claim. Claiming that the punch is at normal speed after a blitz, IMO, requires proof; and no it isn't proving a negative.

If that's what he was arguing for fair enough. Of course a haymaker is gonna cause more damage than a jab. But I don't see why haymaker thrown at super speed would be any weaker than those at normal speed.

Originally posted by ares834
Burden of proof tends to rely on the one making the claim. Claiming that the punch is at normal speed after a blitz, IMO, requires proof; and no it isn't proving a negative.

If that's what he was arguing for fair enough.

No one is arguing that the punch was thrown at "normal speed". Hell, wouldn't that make the punch weaker? He's arguing that blitz punches tend to be much less effective individually vs a power punch due to the character putting much more force in a single power punch than he would his individual blitz punches.

Which makes sense and is also corroborated by comics.