Did Luicfer MorningStar create_Multiverse? Or he create?_Universe???

Hey guys I just don't understand here about Luicfer MorningStar. Did he create_Multiverse or_Universe???? I seen People on one side says Luicfer create_Multiverse. Then I seen people in other side says lucifer create_Universe...

So what it is????

It all started when I was reading__Michael Demiurgos respect thread made by Air legend. He clam that Lucifer only create _Universe. And I think someone show him of a scan of lucifer talking to_Nirvana and clam he did not create one_universe. But a _Multiverse. But Air Legend said__ That's just one example. And ask Do you even know what the word abundant means??? CAnt remember what he says after that.. But it clear that he did not Believe that Luicfer did not create_Multiverse..

So what going here? Did Luicfer create_Multiverse? Or he create?_Universe???

Witch one is right answer????

Forgive me if this thread is wrong place. I don't where to put it.. I just want the answer I am looking for..

It been bothering me in weeks

I think to find the answer you have to look inside yourself

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I think to find the answer you have to look inside yourself

Lol what???

@TheDarkestKing1:

it really depends on what you choose to go with.

initially it was stated that he created a universe (which happened in issue 13). However, Lucifer: Nirvana says that what he created is a multiverse. While several other issues which, chronologically take place after lucifer nirvana say that it was only a universe, along with a 2008 bio:

http://i.imgur.com/IVi9jvn.jpg?1

in short, everything apart from lucifer nirvana says that what he created is a universe, so you can either go with what was stated in lucifer nirvana (that it was a multiverse) or with the other issues and bios which state it was a universe.

one thing's for sure though, lucifer's creation is completely separated from yahweh's multiverse, since it can only be accessed through the letter of passage (which creates a gateway leading outside of yahweh's creation).

also, Lucifer along with michael were the ones who created yahweh's creation, which is confirmed to be a multiverse (though this is contradicted in the issues toward the end of swamp thing volume 2 which says that the presence/voice is what brought creation into existence (and several other issues state the same thing) so again, take your pick).

When in doubt, go with the character's account. Lucifer said himself he created a multiverse.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1174994-lucifermultiverse.jpg
"and what I've created is not a realm, it is a totality, a multiverse."

yeah, the idea was a new 'creation', emulating but differing from our own. lucifer's as well as the intent behind, well, the whole fricking series, clearly point to the idea that he created a multiverse. ignore bios though. they are very rarely ever a good idea.

Lucifer in and of himself created nothing. With his brother Micheal, he created a multiverse. It required both of them.

Originally posted by Cogito
When in doubt, go with the character's account. Lucifer said himself he created a multiverse.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1174994-lucifermultiverse.jpg
"and what I've created is not a realm, it is a totality, a multiverse."

Lucifer also mentioned that what he created was a universe (lucifer #20)

http://i.imgur.com/rfc8GOA.jpg?1

im pretty sure if i continue to look through the pages of the series, ill find at least half a dozen more coming from lucifer's own mouth.

so as i said before, it's up to you to go with what you want.

It was referred to as a multiverse in Nirvana. Universe in the main series. Both were written by Mike Carey, so it's best you clarify it with him.

Originally posted by operator616
Lucifer also mentioned that what he created was a universe (lucifer #20)

http://i.imgur.com/rfc8GOA.jpg?1

im pretty sure if i continue to look through the pages of the series, ill find at least half a dozen more coming from lucifer's own mouth.

so as i said before, it's up to you to go with what you want.

I'd say most if not all of the times Lucifer referred to a universe he could have been merely referring to the universe he was presently in, rather than the totality of his creation.

Originally posted by operator616
@TheDarkestKing1:

it really depends on what you choose to go with.

initially it was stated that he created a universe (which happened in issue 13). However, Lucifer: Nirvana says that what he created is a multiverse. While several other issues which, chronologically take place after lucifer nirvana say that it was only a universe, along with a 2008 bio:

http://i.imgur.com/IVi9jvn.jpg?1

in short, everything apart from lucifer nirvana says that what he created is a universe, so you can either go with what was stated in lucifer nirvana (that it was a multiverse) or with the other issues and bios which state it was a universe.

one thing's for sure though, lucifer's creation is completely separated from yahweh's multiverse, since it can only be accessed through the letter of passage (which creates a gateway leading outside of yahweh's creation).

also, Lucifer along with michael were the ones who created yahweh's creation, which is confirmed to be a multiverse (though this is contradicted in the issues toward the end of swamp thing volume 2 which says that the presence/voice is what brought creation into existence (and several other issues state the same thing) so again, take your pick).

I would think Michael, Lucifer and Gabriel were there near the beginning but it seems they just played a small part in the process. The Presence/The Voice was the one who created the DCU. All they did was just watch it happen.

Originally posted by kevdude
I would think Michael, Lucifer and Gabriel were there near the beginning but it seems they just played a small part in the process. The Presence/The Voice was the one who created the DCU. All they did was just watch it happen.

no, it's stated that lucifer and michael are the ones who created it, but the presence could have done it without them, he had them do it to teach them their skills (lucifer #39):

http://i.imgur.com/NOyEdDY.jpg

bio says that michael brought creation into being while lucifer's will was used to form creation:

http://i.imgur.com/lfrDAlz.jpg?1

though i do understand what you're referring to, which is lucifer #75, when the presence says that he created everything, or something like that.

no one in comics has ever created anything.

btw, just to point something out:

as i posted above, the lucifer series says that lucifer and michael created the universe.

--

while swamp thing #166 tells us that the voice was the one who brought it into existence:

http://i.imgur.com/rb8BTqZ.jpg

swamp thing, sandman,lucifer and the like should be closely associated with each other, and shouldn't contradict each other. Other series (see ahead) is understandable.

--

Preacher #66 (random example) has their own God who created the universe:

http://i.imgur.com/6FCACOf.jpg?1

bio confirms:

http://i.imgur.com/u9OALvR.jpg?1

--

the invisible series have a completely different cosmology altogether in which - reality is a hologram, which was created as a result of overlaping of 2 meta universes (2008 encyclopedia)

http://i.imgur.com/i1YqB2j.jpg?1

the invisibles v3 #12: it's all a hologram:

http://i.imgur.com/GqrzwFr.jpg?1

4 different vertigo series, with 4 different creation stories, no? do note that this is just a few, i could cite more.

same thing with dc, synnar was shown creating it in rann/thangar #6, another one shown to be creating the universe in warlord #132, yet the presence is established as being its creator.

so, nobody knows what creation story we should go with

Originally posted by Cogito
I'd say most if not all of the times Lucifer referred to a universe he could have been merely referring to the universe he was presently in, rather than the totality of his creation.

👆

Originally posted by operator616
no, it's stated that lucifer and michael are the ones who created it, but the presence could have done it without them, he had them do it to teach them their skills (lucifer #39):

http://i.imgur.com/NOyEdDY.jpg

bio says that michael brought creation into being while lucifer's will was used to form creation:

http://i.imgur.com/lfrDAlz.jpg?1

though i do understand what you're referring to, which is lucifer #75, when the presence says that he created everything, or something like that.

They merely took a small part in the process, it makes no sense for them to actually have been the ones that created it when YHWH/The Presence/The Voice is the Creator and taught them (Michael, Gabriel and Lucifer) their power's.

"He (Lucifer) has never made a universe before"

"He gave us power as great as his own--and then when he was done with world-making, he forbade us to use it".

All credit is given to The Presence/The Voice, even Michael, Lucifer and Gabriel know He is the Creator and admit it several times.

Originally posted by Cogito
I'd say most if not all of the times Lucifer referred to a universe he could have been merely referring to the universe he was presently in, rather than the totality of his creation.

Originally posted by kevdude
They merely took a small part in the process, it makes no sense for them to actually have been the ones that created it when YHWH/The Presence/The Voice is the Creator and taught them (Michael, Gabriel and Lucifer) their power's.

"He (Lucifer) has never made a universe before"

"He gave us power as great as his own--and then when he was done with world-making, he forbade us to use it".

All credit is given to The Presence/The Voice, even Michael, Lucifer and Gabriel know He is the Creator and admit it several times.

your scans don't contradict anything. In fact, it speaks the truth, Yahweh was the one who created the world (earth), and the host, but the rest of the universe was created by lucifer and michael (lucifer #26):

http://i.imgur.com/Sv0IZh9.jpg?1

Although the fact that Yahweh's (brief) bio doesn't mention anything about him creating the universe........

http://i.imgur.com/xAP3988.jpg?1

......while lucifer's bio does (which i already posted) does tell us something, no? which is - lucifer and michael were the ones who created the universe (or most of it)

on a side note, Mike Carey does say that there was a creation before yahweh's, which wasn't created by him ( from Lucifer #29 letter's page)

http://i.imgur.com/QxS09l6.jpg?1 (continued in the following scan)
http://i.imgur.com/KG4RAWd.jpg?1

i have no idea what he's referring to, because im pretty sure nowhere in the series was it mentioned that there was an earlier creation.

In any case, this creation story isn't more true than any other in the other vertigo titles, i already posted 3 other apart from lucifer, and i assure you there are more, and shouldn't be disregarded.

Originally posted by operator616
your scans don't contradict anything. In fact, it speaks the truth, Yahweh was the one who created the world (earth), and the host, but the rest of the universe was created by lucifer and michael (lucifer #26):

http://i.imgur.com/Sv0IZh9.jpg?1

Although the fact that Yahweh's (brief) bio doesn't mention anything about him creating the universe........

http://i.imgur.com/xAP3988.jpg?1

......while lucifer's bio does (which i already posted) does tell us something, no? which is - lucifer and michael were the ones who created the universe (or most of it)

on a side note, Mike Carey does say that there was a creation before yahweh's, which wasn't created by him ( from Lucifer #29 letter's page)

http://i.imgur.com/QxS09l6.jpg?1 (continued in the following scan)
http://i.imgur.com/KG4RAWd.jpg?1

i have no idea what he's referring to, because im pretty sure nowhere in the series was it mentioned that there was an earlier creation.

In any case, this creation story isn't more true than any other in the other vertigo titles, i already posted 3 other apart from lucifer, and i assure you there are more, and shouldn't be disregarded.

He gave them roles to fulfill but he is the maker of everything, they are not, they do not worship themselves but The Voice. Preacher is not in DC continuity so I know that doesn't count and don't know anything about the invisibles so idk. Synnar tells the story so its hard to believe him from what we already know.

Mike Carey showed it a few times in the Lucifer comic where another creation before Gods creation, but those failed creations do not matter any longer since YHWH/The Presence is eternal and creates perfect one's. Just 2 instances of the other creations. 👆

Originally posted by Branlor Swift
I think to find the answer you have to look inside yourself

QFT.

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