Darth Nihilus Vs Darth Sidious

Originally posted by Based
Right, as a wound in the force caused by the deaths of billions of people. This wound did not manifest in a Jedi and you know it. C'mon that's a reach.

Personally I don't see the distinction.

Originally posted by Based
Well yes, any freak accident would have "weird things" happen to them. Except these "weird" things were negated by force bonds and the only times these wounds had any affect on the story was a shield against the Triumvirate.

I'll clarify though. The original concept of a force wound is not stupid. What was stupid is how it was used in this game.

No I mean the Exile has weird things about her. Her mysterious reconnection to the Force for one thing. On Telos theres parts where you get into fights and Atton freaks out because his body moved without him wanting to do anything, indicating you're dominating his will somehow. The Jedi Council talks about you having a strange presence in the Force, as if you were already dead. The Exile learns things at an accelerated rate. These little things and others are all pieces of the mystery that builds up over the game. And no, the Wounds have huge effects on the story AND are hugely related to Force bonds. Force bonds and wounds are the twin focuses for the entire game. You just have to engage with the plot to parse this.

You mean how its used masterfully? Your definition of dumb must be different than mine.

I have mixed views on this.

Here are a few assumptions that I make about this:

1) Nihilus' Force Drain is fast and devastating.
2) While Vitiate's feat on Nathema and Sidious' feat on Byss may be even more devastating, those took a lot more time to conjure compared to Nihilus' feat.

Here's my interpretation of Nihilus:

For the most part, Sidious outclasses Nihilus (sabers, knowledge of the force, etc), but I'm not sure if that would actually matter.

I don't think people like Vitiate or Sidious can match the killing speed of Nihilus' Force Drain. I think they would have to become Nihilus in order to do that. And knowing that the Sith pride themselves on being masters of the force, rather than servants, I don't think Vitiate or Sidious would ever choose to take their force drain to that level and become slaves to their hunger.

As for who would win:

The first post states that neither has knowledge about the other. I think this gives Nihilus an advantage. I think you have to know what Nihilus is and be prepared for him to stand a chance. This is somewhat a stretch, but look at how well Savage did against his opponents when they weren't used to him. I think Nihilus has that same edge, just magnitudes even more so.

If Sidious knew about Nihilus and was prepared for him, I'm sure Sidious could come up with something and defeat him. Kreia managed to come up with something, so I'm sure Sidious wouldn't have a problem.

One thing that makes me somewhat doubt Nihilus' power though, is that he teamed up with Sion to take on Kreia. Was he just biding his time or did he actually need Sion to overthrow Kreia? I don't remember the exact details. Kreia said that Nihilus did not care for the Sith teachings, so why would he need Sion as an apprentice? It's been a while since I played KotOR2 so I have forgotten a lot.

Originally posted by red8
I have mixed views on this.

Here are a few assumptions that I make about this:

1) Nihilus' Force Drain is fast and devastating.
2) While Vitiate's feat on Nathema and Sidious' feat on Byss may be even more devastating, those took a lot more time to conjure compared to Nihilus' feat.

Here's my interpretation of Nihilus:

For the most part, Sidious outclasses Nihilus (sabers, knowledge of the force, etc), but I'm not sure if that would actually matter.

I don't think people like Vitiate or Sidious can match the killing speed of Nihilus' Force Drain.

Sidious, Dooku, and Anakin could match the killing speed of the Dark Reaper, which was akin to Nihilus's.

This is based on...?

The fact that the Dark Reaper and Nihilus's powers with drain are practically identical?

Practically? Unless you prove they're identical, there's nothing to discuss. It was also stated that Anakin could combat the effects of the Dark Reaper for a short time.

A short time is, given his speed, more than enough for him to successfully kill Nihilus.

There's no guarantee that Nihilus' drain is the same as the Dark Reaper's, so there's no proof he can combat it. Therefore, speed doesn't matter here.

Good to see you're still schizophrenic on all things Sidious, Beefy.

Prove his drain is different.

His drain works through Force bonds, which I'm fairly sure the Reaper doesn't utilise. Its also faster and has different physical properties i.e. Nihilus' drain looks like black smoke.

It doesn't matter. The sources say Anakin is immune to the "life draining effects" of the Reaper.

Not sure why he wouldn't be able to resist Nihilus's. In fact, with Avellone's commentary about the technique and the origins of the Dark Reaper, it seems to be for all intents and purposes an answer to the technique's drawbacks.

Originally posted by Nephthys
His drain works through Force bonds, which I'm fairly sure the Reaper doesn't utilise. Its also faster and has different physical properties i.e. Nihilus' drain looks like black smoke.

Yoda blocks Sidious's blue lightning in ROTS. Sidious uses purple lightning in TFU. Prove Yoda can block purple lightning.

Maybe he can't????

Because Sidious has grown more powerful in 20 years or because of a crippling weakness to certain shades on the color wheel?

Prove his drain is different.

Good to see you're still schizophrenic on all things Sidious, Beefy.

It doesn't matter. The sources say Anakin is immune to the "life draining effects" of the Reaper.

Not sure why he wouldn't be able to resist Nihilus's. In fact, with Avellone's commentary about the technique and the origins of the Dark Reaper, it seems to be for all intents and purposes an answer to the technique's drawbacks.

No, the OP says all three Sidious's are used here. And nowhere did you specify ROTS Sidious.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Good to see you're still schizophrenic on all things Sidious, Beefy.

Beefy, translate the nature of your current anti-Sidious crusade. Don't think I haven't noticed.

Day 1: "yeah, Sidious is the most powerful Sith ever"

Day 2: "lol Nihilus pwnz0rz!"

What will day 3 bring me, Beefy?

Beefy, translate the nature of your current anti-Sidious crusade. Don't think I haven't noticed.

Day 1: "yeah, Sidious is the most powerful Sith ever"

Day 2: "lol Nihilus pwnz0rz!"

What will day 3 bring me, Beefy?

As I recall, not more than 3-4 days ago I stated that because we're talking about ROTS Sidious and DE Sidious is the most powerful in my mind, there is no contradiction. Add to the fact that just because there is a technique Sidious can't necessarily counter, doesn't mean the other guy is more powerful.

Like I said, early stages of Alzheimer's.

Aaaand again, the OP clearly says three incarnations of Sidious are in play. You nor anyone else ever claimed to be referring just to ROTS!Sidious.

So again, explain your anti-Sidious crusade.