KMC Mid-Herald Belt Battlezone: Abhilegend vs Smurph

Originally posted by abhilegend
Then perhaps you should read carefully my argument. A portion of Krypton Man used T-vo and I don't give a phuck about how much time passed in between, its still usable for Krypton Man. You don't like it, I don't care. But passing your own objections like they are ABSOLUTE TRUTH? No thanks.

It is absolute truth, and my skills of reading and comprehension are quite impeccable, as they have to be for my profession. You drafted Krypton Man for this match, not Eradicator. Krypton Man is a specific iteration of Eradicator from a specific arc (Superman Vol. 2 #42 to Action Comics Vol. 1 #667) with unique properties. You conflated Krypton Man with all of Eradicator's subsequent incarnations, primarily Reign of Superman Eradicator and afterwards. If you had drafted Eradicator outright I wouldn't have taken issue, but you didn't, you specifically drafted Krypton Man, so by forum rule, not simply my opinion, you're limited to that specific arc, just like if you had, for example, drafted Supernova, you would not have access to all of Booster Gold's subsequent feats from later arcs as well, you'd be limited to that specific arc in 52 when he was actually Supernova. Now, as I said before, this is not to insult you or an indictment of your character. I'm just pointing out an actual issue with the manner in which this thread transpired. Your flippancy is wasted on me and doesn't change the facts of this matter. I'm not saying you intentionally cheated, I'm saying that there are technical issues and outright rule breaks with the argument you presented.

Originally posted by abhilegend
And LMAO @ quanchi. What a bitter, bitter man, following me everywhere like a little dog and trying to catch my attention.

😂

This was stolen from Smurph IMO.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
It is absolute truth, and my skills of reading and comprehension are quite impeccable, as they have to be for my profession. You drafted Krypton Man for this match, not Eradicator. Krypton Man is a specific iteration of Eradicator from a specific arc (Superman Vol. 2 #42 to Action Comics Vol. 1 #667) with unique properties. You conflated Krypton Man with all of Eradicator's subsequent incarnations, primarily Reign of Superman Eradicator and afterwards. If you had drafted Eradicator outright I wouldn't have taken issue, but you didn't, you specifically drafted Krypton Man, so by forum rule, not simply my opinion, you're limited to that specific arc, just like if you had, for example, drafted Supernova, you would not have access to all of Booster Gold's subsequent feats from later arcs as well, you'd be limited to that specific arc in 52 when he was actually Supernova. Now, as I said before, this is not to insult you or an indictment of your character. I'm just pointing out an actual issue with the manner in which this thread transpired. Your flippancy is wasted on me and doesn't change the facts of this matter. I'm not saying you intentionally cheated, I'm saying that there are technical issues and outright rule breaks with the argument you presented.

And the difference between Supernova and Eradicator is that Supernova was an amped Booster Gold, here I used a specific issue from which the version of Eradicator I chose reappeared. You didn't see me using feats from David Conner or Fortress Eradicator, did you? So why all this bitching?

And everyone is surprised that Quan would vote opposite me./sarcasm

BTW, cry more quan. I won.

fu

I just want to make it perfectly clear to you Abhi, I don't have any issues with you personally, so please don't take this as an attack. As a judge I need to do what's right in the interest of fairness, impartiality, and the established rules. That is why I'm pointing this out. If these kind of matches are going to be taking place everyone involved, both participants and judges, need to be operating under the same set of rules and understand the rules.

Originally posted by abhilegend
I picked Eradicator and very specifically produced scans to prove that the left over consciousness of that version used T-vo and hence it was perfectly legal for me to use. That's why I don't give a shit about what you think is "absolute truth".

And the difference between Supernova and Eradicator is that Supernova was an amped Booster Gold, here I used a specific issue from which the version of Eradicator I chose reappeared. You didn't see me using feats from David Conner or Fortress Eradicator, did you? So why all this bitching?

And everyone is surprised that Quan would vote opposite me./sarcasm

BTW, cry more quan. I won.

fu

No, per the OP, you picked Krypton Man, not Eradicator. It's in the OP of this thread that Psycho Gundam posted. You argued for Eradicator, but you had Krypton Man.

Krypton Man is an arc specific iteration of Eradicator, just as Supernova is an arc specific iteration of Booster Gold.

For reference, see below:

Originally posted by psycho gundam
This is a battlezone between abhilegend and Smurph for the KMC Mid-herald belt.

Rules:

1. No posting limit (free form posting, instead).

2. No time manipulation.

3. No insta-kill tactics such as teleporting into solid objects. Even if an attack isn’t instantaneous, any attack that could, as a matter of its nature, not be defended against is considered this.

3. Characters will not have knowledge of who they are fighting pre-fight. In battle, they will only be able to know things if the two characters already knew each other.

4. Non-offensive matter manipulation is allowed.

5. No duplication.

6. No power copying in any way.

7. Only experience carries from previous fights, and only information you could have reasonably discovered in the fight is learned.

8. No immortal characters. Characters should be able to be defeated by reasonably accessible means. Healing factors strong enough to blur the line with this are also banned.

9. While battlefields will change, it is assumed that nobody can leave the whole of the battlefield by any means. This also means no BFR or self-BFR. If you fly too far, you hit an impenetrable wall.

10. No reality warping.

11. Rules may be changed if certain strategies become an obvious problem.

12. Matches last 14 days.

13. ( Prep) You will receive a 5 minute briefing about your opponent. You cannot gather gear that would not be considered standard gear.

Smurph is using God Cable

vs

Abhilegend's Krypton man

The fight is in a super walmart parking lot

^Krypton Man.

Originally posted by abhilegend
I picked Eradicator and very specifically produced scans to prove that the left over consciousness of that version used T-vo and hence it was perfectly legal for me to use. That's why I don't give a shit about what you think is "absolute truth".

And the difference between Supernova and Eradicator is that Supernova was an amped Booster Gold, here I used a specific issue from which the version of Eradicator I chose reappeared. You didn't see me using feats from David Conner or Fortress Eradicator, did you? So why all this bitching?

And everyone is surprised that Quan would vote opposite me./sarcasm

BTW, cry more quan. I won.

fu

Originally posted by MF DELPH
I just want to make it perfectly clear to you Abhi, I don't have any issues with you personally, so please don't take this as an attack. As a judge I need to do what's right in the interest of fairness, impartiality, and the established rules. That is why I'm pointing this out. If these kind of matches are going to be taking place everyone involved, both participants and judges, need to be operating under the same set of rules and understand the rules.

Anyway, all you're doing here is bitching IMO that not everyone sees the things you do, no offense. You could make the rules clear the next time if you like.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
No, per the OP, you picked Krypton Man, not Eradicator. It's in the OP of this thread that Psycho Gundam posted. You argued for Eradicator, but you had Krypton Man.

Krypton Man is an arc specific iteration of Eradicator, just as Supernova is an arc specific iteration of Booster Gold.

Originally posted by MF DELPH
For reference, see below:

^Krypton Man.

abhilegend wrote on Jun 15th, 2014 11:42 PM:
My character is Krypton Man version of Eradicator. If you want additional information about him, just click at the respect thread I've made for Eradicator in my sig.

Anything done by Krypton Man or its programming/consciousness is fair game by match rules. If not, point me to the rule which denies that.

It's pretty hilarious that all Quan needs to do is post a thumbs up, and people flip their shit as if he's done anything different than a series of other posters in this thread.

I've avoided posting about the judgement because tourney experience teaches me that it's not the place of a battlezone competitor to publicly call out judges. If something's amiss about the way a match is handled, it's best brought up by a separate third party, hopefully a judge - so thanks Delph for taking the time to do that.

Also thanks to others who read and posted their opinion - it's actually refreshing to have this kind of heat after a match, feels like some life is back in the forum. That being said, battlezones are meant to be fun, not a headache, and I hope this match is having a net positive benefit on the battlezone forum. Definitely, everybody should be encouraged to go for a belt title- we have only 3 out of 9 filled.

I think the best takeaway from this match is: Clearly there are some bumps to iron out for future belt matches, and now some of them are really obvious. Abhi benefited from some serious judge/host/participant confusion about prep rules, standard equipment, duplication, character drafting etc. This is shit that we used to be relatively on top of in tournaments, so hopefully we get some more matches going and judging these things starts to feel a little more familiar to everybody. I'm not writing this to harp on judges because, as I posted in the discussion thread, I'm satisfied with my own performance in the match either way - but there obviously shouldn't be this much contention between judge rulings regarding a couple black-and-white rules.

I'm not diving back into a debate in this thread. I think the following is worth clearing up though, for future mid-herald battlezone matches, and this is all I have to say on it.

-------------------------------

Originally posted by abhilegend

Anything done by Krypton Man or its programming/consciousness is fair game by match rules. If not, point me to the rule which denies that.

Ok.

abhilegend wrote on Jun 14th, 2014 11:03 AM:
In case you think this version of Eradicator is above mid herald range, here is the herald list.

High
Baron Zemo (w/ Moonstones), Cyborg Superman, Dr. Strange (classic), Doomsday (Gog Wars), The Eradicator (Fortress Mode), Genis-Vell, Green Lantern (Hal, Kyle, Alan), Infinity-Man, Majestic, Moonstone (w/ both stones), Quasar, Qztr, Silver Surfer, Sinestro, Spartan 3.0, Stardust, Superman, Swamp Thing, Talisman, Thor, Zoom II (Hunter Solomon)

That's Eradicator with two major amps, a clone body of Superman and merging with Fortress of Solitude. So this would make this version a solid mid herald IMO.

Clearly you were willing to recognize and affirm that Krypton Man was a different version with a different power level when it suited you. The above quote is your PM to me stating your character draft. When it came down to the match, however, you immediately blurred the lines of Eradicator versions to attempt to 'trick me' into battling a character with T-Vo.

Further, when attempting to draft Krypton Man in the mid herald category, you pointed myself and PG to your own respect thread to see Krypton Man's feats. Neither of your T-Vo feats are listed under Krypton Man, but instead under Kem-L and Fortress, the same persona you emphasize is above KM in the PM I quoted. You could maybe make a case that Krypton Man may be capable of the same thing (you wouldn't have much evidence, but you could try and make a case), but to argue that a later version of Eradicator is Krypton Man is directly contradicting two pieces of argument that you used to get Krypton Man as a mid herald character in the first place. Certainly, at the very least, it's violating the spirit with which you drafted him, and I'm curious to see how the next mid herald battlezone goes down with Krypton Man as the belt holder.

Originally posted by leonidas
👆

i'm curious--what is the battlefield going to be in this low herald match that will take place eventually? smurph, any thoughts?

sneer

My bad.

I think there are lots of Low Herald characters with powers specific to battlefields, which is why I didn't reply before. Somewhere generic on Earth might be best. Maybe we should have the host choose a place?

Originally posted by Existere
My bad.

I think there are lots of Low Herald characters with powers specific to battlefields, which is why I didn't reply before. Somewhere generic on Earth might be best. Maybe we should have the host choose a place?

sure, but it would help to know in advance is all. it would suck to take someone and find out they were limited suddenly by a random choice of BF. an empty city like detroit (wait, is that redundant...? nyuck-nyuck!) sound fair? or we can have a host choose, that's fine, just a BF that allows for lots of options would be cool.

To be honest this was mostly my fault for not being a hard ass.
Contemplating if this should be a wash.

Next match will be NO TOLERANCE.

Deadass

Originally posted by leonidas
👆

i'm curious--what is the battlefield going to be in this low herald match that will take place eventually? smurph, any thoughts?

Send me your pick, or whoever is challenging either/or Smurph and Digi

Originally posted by MF DELPH
For reference, see below:

^Krypton Man.

Nobody ever wants loopholes where you get feats ffrom newer version for older versions

Not insulting anyone here but Galan should've been a judge along with operator, ODG, Leo, and Pr (the judges that were here could have stayed as well, the people I've named are additions). Things would have went a lot differently imo. I agree with everything DELPH said. He is on point. Don't think things were explored/analyzed as much as DELPH looked at everything. ABHI won, good job buddy but sorry to say this but if we get another group to come in here and vote i think things would be a lot different. Overall, good job team.

Originally posted by Existere
I'm not diving back into a debate in this thread. I think the following is worth clearing up though, for future mid-herald battlezone matches, and this is all I have to say on it.

-------------------------------

Ok.

Clearly you were willing to recognize and affirm that Krypton Man was a different version with a different power level when it suited you. The above quote is your PM to me stating your character draft. When it came down to the match, however, you immediately blurred the lines of Eradicator versions to attempt to 'trick me' into battling a character with T-Vo.

Further, when attempting to draft Krypton Man in the mid herald category, you pointed myself and PG to your own respect thread to see Krypton Man's feats. Neither of your T-Vo feats are listed under Krypton Man, but instead under Kem-L and Fortress, the same persona you emphasize is above KM in the PM I quoted. You could maybe make a case that Krypton Man may be capable of the same thing (you wouldn't have much evidence, but you could try and make a case), but to argue that a later version of Eradicator [b]is Krypton Man is directly contradicting two pieces of argument that you used to get Krypton Man as a mid herald character in the first place. Certainly, at the very least, it's violating the spirit with which you drafted him, and I'm curious to see how the next mid herald battlezone goes down with Krypton Man as the belt holder. [/B]

Hey everyone, how's the match goi-

😂