Originally posted by AsbestosFlaygon
We've never been able to gauge the power level of The Fulcrum.
Nobody really knows what or who he is.I don't believe he was explicitly stated to be Kirby. He probably wasn't.
All we know is that he is above even the strongest of Celestials.
He was also stated by Tiamut to be omnipotent and omniscient, and that its essence is what holds reality in its place. Which kind of implies that he's the creator, especially when we know that he existed before the current reality, when he said that he was searching for a companion since the "Big Crunch".
As for the battle, Fulcrum wins.
Originally posted by Jynocidus"Creators" shouldn't have to search for anything.
A real "creator" should remain unchanging, and cause big crunches.
TOAA's drawings also can never be its equal. (Taimut is as powerful as the Fulcrum) ... "ascension" my ass.
TOAA isn't only directly linked to Celestials, Watchers or the Horde.
TOAA is linked to all Marvel's creations.
The Fulcrum's essence is supposed to hold reality in it's place. According to who? Taimut?
Anyway, ... guess there's a new Galactus in town. (who's existence coincidentally holds reality in place likewise)
The Fulcrum thought/spoke like just another character full of fantasies with no indication of 4th wall sprinkles on it.
Finally, it's name is the "Fulcrum," ... and not TOAA, the Supreme being, or God,
and while that may not explain it all I didn't even see an allusion of a 4th wall story taking place here.
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In a setting that truly includes TOAA,
there would be at the very least hints we are dealing with 4th wall scenarios.
4th wall involved stories are almost comedic, they don't take themselves too seriously,
and there's always dialogue or ridiculous actions that highlight to us we're in a 4th wall book.
Originally posted by Jynocidus
"Creators" shouldn't have to search for anything. A real "creator" should remain unchanging, and cause big crunches.CA Supes ftw
Creators shouldn't have to search for anything as much as mysteries shouldn't intrigue those "Creators":
http://i.imgur.com/84Il1kz.jpg?1
Big crunch is also a natural process of a universe. So no one should technically cause it. And even then, there's no indication that he specifically didn't cause it to begin with.
Fulcrum stomps, though. Since Thought Robot is nowhere near Supreme being-level.
Originally posted by Mr Master
... TOAA also does not consider itself "omnipotent or omniscient" or any other said-type terms.
(since it knows it's nothing but a human mind with a role to play like every other drawing)
Neither does Fulcrum as far as i recall. But others do consider it omnipotent just like others consider TOAA omnipotent and refer to him as such.
Originally posted by Mr Master
The Fulcrum thought/spoke like just another character full of fantasies with no indication of 4th wall sprinkles on it.
So did TOAA in certain instances.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Finally, it's name is the "Fulcrum," ... and not TOAA, the Supreme being, or God,
Actually, it's the all-high Fulcrum:
Originally posted by operator616Creators shouldn't have to search for anything as much as
mysteries shouldn't intrigue those "Creators":
The artist in your scan hasn't drawn the story yet, which is why it's a mystery to him.
TOAA is not referring to something located somewhere like this Fulcrum is. (heck, TOAA draws the location and item)
TOAA is referring to actual stories that make up comics, histories.
Here's TOAA's "collaborator" (writer obviously) giving him real world ideas to draw in comics:
Here's the full scan of your linked crop that elaborates on the context:
The artist (half of TOAA) is explaining how the evolving lives of the FF (stories in comics) intrigues him.
And I agree, since he only draws while the writer thinks up the stories.
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This is an unquestionable portrayal of real humans (writer/artist) being portrayed as TOAA.
In the same fashion it's not surprising they're limited like real world humans.
But they have no limits when it comes to stories already written that are situated in comics.
They can do whatever they like since it's just ink and paper to them.
So, if Fulcrum is TOAA, then stating Taimut is as powerful as him, has to be taken as a joke: (like She-Hulk killing TOAA)
Which makes the whole story a joke!
Or, the Fulcrum is not TOAA and instead a powerful cosmic that came out of nowhere.
Originally posted by operator616Neither does Fulcrum as far as i recall. But others do consider it omnipotent just like others consider TOAA omnipotent and refer to him as such.
That right there, makes this Fulcrum a character based on absolute fiction.
TOAA, is always portrayed as based on a real human being. (not fiction)
(there's always some indication we're dealing with a 4th wall atmosphere)
Originally posted by operator616So did TOAA in certain instances.
Originally posted by operator616Actually, it's the all-high Fulcrum:
Originally posted by LeonBuco666That is a no limits fallacy. You not understanding what it means doesn't change the fact.
Im not relying on anything shithead.Anything The Fulcrum throws at him, he can counter.
Same goes for the fulcrum.
I change my mind, stalemate.
I don't care for your language here.
If we're going by 'comic logic', then Superman is unbeatable.
He will never be TRULY defeated or killed. This is a fact that is undeniable. He is basically DC's (or probably the entire comicdom's) ultimate hero. Yes, his existence in comicdom is even greater than Thor or Batman. And no, I'm not even a fan of Supes.
Anyways, I think the Thought Robot will adapt to The Fulcrum's powers.
Superman's STORY is greater than The Fulcrum, and that is enough to defeat it.
