Drew Karpyshyn's Revan (KotOR vs TOR) Revelation

Spoiler:
Sorry Sas, I had to post it .

"[...] On some days, the younger, pre-rebirth Revan might be stronger, on other days the wiser, more mature older Revan might have the upper hand. It depends on all sorts of circumstances. The example I give is with pro athletes. Is Tiger Woods from 2000 better than Tiger from 2006? One was younger and hit the ball farther, the other was wiser and had more control of his game. If they played a match, who knows who would win? If they played 10 matches, I doubt one version would win them all. So, really, who is stronger? I feel the same way about Revan."
―Drew Karpyshyn (Author)
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Darth Malak's Combat Overview Thread [UPD 7/21/2014]:
http://www.comicvine.com/profile/darthant66/blog/darth-malaks-combat-overview/97192/

I knew you'd post this. Though, you really misunderstood the question I asked, as did Karpyshyn.

To be honest, I could really care less what was your original question to Drew Karpyshyn.
All that matters was his answer, which was more beneficial then any email from him ever.

I guess I'm not aware of the story behind this, but what does Drew's answer prove?

Nah.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nah.

Originally posted by Kalen Sykes
I guess I'm not aware of the story behind this, but what does Drew's answer prove?

I questioned Drew on the effects the regaining of his mask [and thus, his memories] had on Revan as a character and forceful, and how dramatic they were. I was curious to hear whether or not his regained knowledge of the Dark Side had heightened his potency with the Force overall, as the novel seemed to imply that.

He apparently took that as me asking who was stronger between KotOR Revan and SWTOR Revan, which wasn't exactly what I was asking.

Ant is arguing that the answer provided proves KotOR Revan may have been physically superior to SWTOR Revan, whilst the latter wiser and more controlled.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66

Spoiler:
Sorry Sas, I had to post it .

Drew Karpyshyn was asked by NewGuy01 the power difference between Revan as of Knights of the Old Republic and Revan as of The Old Republic to help us grasp a better understanding on Darth Malak's power. Here is his response:

[B]"[...] On some days, the younger, pre-rebirth Revan might be stronger, on other days the wiser, more mature older Revan might have the upper hand. It depends on all sorts of circumstances. The example I give is with pro athletes. Is Tiger Woods from 2000 better than Tiger from 2006? One was younger and hit the ball farther, the other was wiser and had more control of his game. If they played a match, who knows who would win? If they played 10 matches, I doubt one version would win them all. So, really, who is stronger? I feel the same way about Revan."
―Drew Karpyshyn (Author)
- - - - -
Darth Malak's Combat Overview Thread [UPD 7/21/2014]:
http://www.comicvine.com/profile/darthant66/blog/darth-malaks-combat-overview/97192/ [/B]

Such a bullshit political answer from Drew.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
I questioned Drew on the effects the regaining of his mask [and thus, his memories] had on Revan as a character and forceful, and how dramatic they were. I was curious to hear whether or not his regained knowledge of the Dark Side had heightened his potency with the Force overall, as the novel seemed to imply that.

He apparently took that as me asking who was stronger between KotOR Revan and SWTOR Revan, which wasn't exactly what I was asking.

Ant is arguing that the answer provided proves KotOR Revan may have been physically superior to SWTOR Revan, whilst the latter wiser and more controlled.

Ahh, got it. Thanks for the clarification.

Really, Revan was ever learning according to Kreia, ever seeking more knowledge more secrets the force had to reveal, he was a master duelist, malak was powerful but his tactics by attacking his master in battle ship to ship reveals his lack of confidence and therefore in my mind his personal belief that revan would smite him.

Originally posted by Salthasha
Really, Revan was ever learning according to Kreia, ever seeking more knowledge more secrets the force had to reveal, he was a master duelist, malak was powerful but his tactics by attacking his master in battle ship to ship reveals his lack of confidence and therefore in my mind his personal belief that revan would smite him.

I'd say it was more of Malak being a cunning tactician. He (almost) killed two birds with one stone. Even if Malak is considered the brawns of the duo, he still had to at some point start plotting Revan's downfall.

Originally posted by red8
I'd say it was more of Malak being a cunning tactician. He (almost) killed two birds with one stone. Even if Malak is considered the brawns of the duo, he still had to at some point start plotting Revan's downfall.

"His stratagems were painfully obvious, intending to crush all resistance everywhere. There was little thought beyond the complete destruction of anything that opposed him." --GOTO

Originally posted by Salthasha
malak was powerful but his tactics by attacking his master in battle ship to ship reveals his lack of confidence and therefore in my mind his personal belief that revan would smite him.

"You betrayed me from afar. You were afraid to face me, Malak."
"No! I was prepared to face you, Revan. But fate presented me with a better option. I saw my opportunity and seized it."
--Revan and Darth Malak on the Star Forge (Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic)

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Do not forget that shortly before this, Darth Malak dueled Darth Revan in his first attempt to defeat him.
He was able to press the confrontation until both opponents were "desperate", not Darth Revan ultimately prevailed, slicing off Darth Malak's jaw.

"Malak's most distinguishing feature, his steel jaw, disguises a vicious lightsaber wound inflicted by his former Master in their desperate final battle."
―Star Wars Insider 88: Virtual Sith

That being said, I'm sure canonically Revan goes on about how great redemption is instead, and since that prolongs the conversation, a lot of people pick it more. I believe the betray from afar option shortens the dialogue.

I think what makes most people assume Malak is weak comes from the fact that Revan and co fights through armies of battle droids and Dark Jedi, fights Bastila three times(canonically), fights through a droid factory, and then fights Malak. Sure, "in a book that battle would have been a brutal, hard fought affair spread over multiple pages," but Revan still had to fight through the entire Star Forge, a nexus, through amped Jedi and super droids, just to fight an amped Malak anywhere from two-six times. No ones going to think highly of someone after that.

In total there were 8 captive Jedi on the Star Forge, not 6. Educate yourself.

Assuming full Lightside completion, you fight him 3 times.
Assuming full Darkside completion, you drain 5 of the Jedi for yourself.

That being said, it is unlikely Revan defeated Darth Malak fully every-time. He was most likely only half-injured.
A mere Jedi's left-over Force reserve is not going to be able to fully replenish Darth Malak on the brink of death.
---- ---- ----
"You must go now, Revan. The Star Forge feeds the power of your old apprentice. If you do not stop him soon he will become too powerful for even you to stop."
--Elder Council (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic)

Once.

👆 I no longer consider the two times Darth Malak replenished his health from the Jedi and then Revan forcing him to replenish another Jedi as a decisive defeat. I honestly doubt the leftovers of one of the Jedi's force reserve even equivalent to a half of Darth Malak's. His power on the Star Forge came from the dark energies of the space-station itself, not the Jedi.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
In total there were 8 captive Jedi on the Star Forge, not 6. Educate yourself.

Assuming full Lightside completion, you fight him 3 times.
Assuming full Darkside completion, you drain 5 of the Jedi for yourself.

That being said, it is unlikely Revan defeated Darth Malak fully every-time. He was most likely only half-injured.
A mere Jedi's left-over Force reserve is not going to be able to fully replenish Darth Malak on the brink of death.
---- ---- ----

"You must go now, Revan. The Star Forge feeds the power of your old apprentice. If you do not stop him soon he will become too powerful for even you to stop."
--Elder Council (Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic)

I doubt that Revan would be able to fight Malak 9 times after traveling through the Star Forge, which is why I gave an estimate.

These are just your theoretical numbers of times Revan fights Malak. I've never seen a =ny definite number given. As I've said before, I also don't believe the fight goes exactly as it's shown in game, so you already know how I feel about these numbers anyway.

"The Sith Lord had grotesquely adapted the Rakatan device to draw energy directly from chained Jedi captives. He replenished his life force from the captives by draining theirs."
―Star Wars Databanks: Darth Malak

Due to the fact he drained a plural amount of Jedi canonically, the minimum amount of times Darth Malak had to fight Revan is 3 (one time without drain, two with drain). However, to achieve a full lightside character, (which is recognized by Drew Karpyshyn and other sources as the canonical version of Knights of the Old Republic Revan) you free the other Jedi captives so they don't get drained by Darth Malak.

No one's going to think as highly as you do when he's gone through armies prior.

Malak was still beaten multiple times after traveling through the Star Forge with only two other people. The point is, Malak looks less impressive given that combined with the fact that he is amped, not that Malak isn't impressive.

Actually, in fact, the Knights of the Old Republic Prima Guide recognizes that if Revan didn't intervene with Darth Malak draining the Jedi, survival was highly unlikely.

"Normally, Malak’s “regeneration” from the life of the imprisoned Jedi would mean you’d face him in combat until he snapped the last of your powers and then defeated you, but you have options."
―Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic Prima Guide