DS Sentry vs. LF Rulk

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Scans of Rulk beating Sentry? o.O

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-97oxdNzklJA/T76Zm0XnFhI/AAAAAAAAlQw/dV8uPBNNU7U/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-aXMiSTHXGfs/T76ZoDwX9iI/AAAAAAAAlRU/4PuWxwNo0LA/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR2.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-K4w7HpS5-O4/T76ZnjaS0WI/AAAAAAAAlRA/7DQBs7Ao9Ms/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR3.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-P7skTAsktps/T76ZoFZ38cI/AAAAAAAAlRQ/VFUaRa22MEE/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR4.jpg

Rulk

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Yes Carver because like I mentioned he was losing control. Not because he wasn't holding back he was losing control. I wrote a whole huge post explaining the preceding events and you like The_Sorrow, seem to be disregarding probably the hugest point for the whole Robert Reynolds character to increase the showing of the Hulk.

He was depowered you are now choosing to be ignorant, read the post I made and I mean read it. Don't look at it then disagree because a character you like is mentioned. Not I never lowballed Hulk I explained the story, you are just choosing to warp the outcome to further suit your ends.

The reason he done that was because and again he was losing control. If he is mentally unstable he at a greater risk like said in a scan so don't say I am wrong.

This is how the fight ended. Sentry was at the point of killing everything and everyone and said to Hulk that he can't seem to stop (i.e losing control due to him being unstable) and Hulk says "Saviour, Destroyer, what matters is th choice you make" or something like that. Afterwards one last massive punch was thrown and WWH fell back to Bruce and thanks in part to Hulk he convinced Robert to be the Saviour.

If he hadn't then Hulk would've been knocked into Banner and Sentry would have still been Sentry waiting to pummel Banner to death.

This debate will end the same way as me and you in the Sentry vs Starbrand thread. It will end up with you threatening to leave if I message you again then you will concede. Stop mixing up the story to paint Hulk as the main thing when that wasn't the case.

I never said you lowballed the Hulk, what I said was, Sentry pretty much let loose all he had against the Hulk. I know about that scene you posted but on that same page Sentry knew he had to exert everything he had in order to beat a character this powerful. Again, he used so much power against the Hulk that he reverted back to Banner. You can accept this two ways. Hulk either beat him so bad that he turned him Back to his human form or he exerted himself to the point, gave everything he had in his tank which reverted him back to Reynolds. Your choice but either way, it depleted him of everything he had in his tank. Every drop of his power.

It can't get any clearer than this tbh. Is this a low ft for Robert, hell Naw because Hulk is and was during that time, EXTREMELY powerful and Sentry gave him a better fight than anyone. Did Bob appear confident that he could take Hulk, he sure did and I can post scans proving it. There was nothing displayed during that fight that made it appear as if Bob was mentally compromised.

you are lowballing sentry if you think that is the best he can dish out

Originally posted by carver9
I never said you lowballed the Hulk, what I said was, Sentry pretty much let loose all he had against the Hulk. I know about that scene you posted but on that same page Sentry knew he had to exert everything he had in order to beat a character this powerful. Again, he used so much power against the Hulk that he reverted back to Banner. You can accept this two ways. Hulk either beat him so bad that he turned him Back to his human form or he exerted himself to the point, gave everything he had in his tank which reverted him back to Reynolds. Your choice but either way, it depleted him of everything he had in his tank. Every drop of his power.

It can't get any clearer than this tbh. Is this a low ft for Robert, hell Naw because Hulk is and was during that time, EXTREMELY powerful and Sentry gave him a better fight against anyone. Did Bob appear confident that he could take Hulk, he sure did and I can post scans proving it. There was nothing displayed during that fight that made it appears as if Bob was mentally compromised.

Don't worry I wasn't accusing you of saying that, more to make a point of I wasn't lowballing Hulk. I was giving him praise.

Like I have said it is either this way for me.

Both Sentry and Robert exerted so much power that they both turned back.

Or (what I believe to be true) Sentry was just about to kill everyone and luckily for Hulk he was beaten back into Banner instead of being obliterated along with everyone on Earth, thanks to him convincing Sentry to be the Saviour.

Coming to think of it the writer explains it here.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/10/102593/3288874-greg.jpg

And don't forget in the fight Sentry was saying "Just once more" while he let Hulk hit him so he could prevent himself killing everyone akin to Siege but that didn't work until Hulk luckily convinced Robert otherwise. It's the same way in Siege Robert said to Thor "Kill me" but anyway that's more off topic but it gives more reasoning to what I was saying.

It isn't a low feat for Robert, it's a low form of Robert compared to others. I haven't once said pfft stalemating WWH that's nothing. I was just saying in terms of the Sentry for him he was at one of his lowest points.

Others being like when he was just about to fight the Collective where he was weakened due to his illness. Don't get me wrong I have the scans myself.

Just to make the emphasis again. In terms of a low feat, it's in the sense that Robert on that fight, he was ill, and unstable so he wasn't capable in that fight of destroying entire worlds while holding back, he wasn't stable enough to do so. So that's what I meant in terms of a low showing.

Again I don't think it was confidence that lead him to that. It's more of him thinking well f*** it I can't stop myself, I've tried my hardest but it's gone too far. He wasn't confident in that sense. He had just lost it to the point that he didn't care.

Like the Ultron fight. Lindy had been murdered in cold blood and he just didn't care. If you remember he just backhanded Simon. Almost like he was a villain.

Again I can only point you to the huge post I made, to be honest Carver you can either read mine or Enzeru's post in the respect thread.

Just because Robert was weakened going into the fight doesn't worsen the Hulk, it's like the writer said more to do with Robert almost losing control and nearly becoming the villain of WWH.

Carver and Sorrow are so funny...

For some reason, they don't have problems understanding that a calm Hulk generates less power than an enraged Hulk, because that's the nature of the character.
But when it comes to the Sentry they absolutely refuse to understand, but probably more so accept that a mentally unstable Sentry generates less power than a mentally stable Sentry.

When Hulk is calm, his power, strength and durability decrease and when Sentry is unstable his power, strength and durability decrease. It's something that happens passivly. It's not up to them if all of their power goes up or not. It's up to their emotional / mental state at that point.
And while the Hulk can go from calm to angry in a short period of time, the Sentry does not have such luxury and has to deal with being weakened, since we saw him staying for days in his house and he would have continued to stay there, if the Hulk didn't threaten to kill the heroes and ultimately FORCED the Sentry to intervene.

So why are Carver and Sorrow being so stubborn? Because their favorite character the Hulk is being threatened here.
If we go by the events in comics, then we've seen an enraged and overall more powerful Hulk (World War) going fairly even with an unstable and overall less powerful Sentry.
And while the Hulk was supposedly pulling his punches in the entire arc, the Sentry was being dumbed down big time by the writer, who negated Sentry's superior speed so that the Hulk would have a chance.

Regarding the speed... Look at this comparison:

Hulk gets teleported few miles away and his enemies are super chilled out and continue to talk, because Hulk needs more than half a minute to run back:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/108566/4016401-01.jpg

And then we have the Sentry standing few miles away from the Punisher and appearing behind him, before Punisher even manages to finish his thought:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/116291/2179458-4.jpg

And you can't even make the argument that it's only limited to traveling speed, because Sentry has massivly better reaction and movement speed showings than the Hulk overall and everyone knows it.

Back to the topic of overall power:
We've seen a super enraged, not holding back Hulk completely unleashing (World Breaker) and destroying planets, while colliding with Red She-Hulk and we've seen a stable Sentry refusing to fight Genis-Vell on Earth, because he knew it would destroy the planet. When Genis-Vell teleported them to a more neutral battleground, they started fighting and destroying planets, while still holding back.

WW Hulk fought Sentry at his lowest. It doesn't take a genius to recognize that, only a hater or simply fanboy of threatened characters like Hulk / Thor.

@ One_Angry_Scot: THAT WAS REALLY IT!

Originally posted by carver9
But yet he goes all out against the Hulk and admits that he isn't holding back on more than one occasion. Telling Hulk how good it feels to finally let loose, not worry about killing the people around him. SMH. He was not depowered. The showings before that where he actually cared about the damage he caused contradicts what happened in New York when he nearly wiped out the entire city and was hitting Hulk with everything he had to the point that he reverted back to Robert.

...Really. Are you honestly going to be this ignorant. How many times have we been over this matter, what about 100 times now? We already established ages ago that Sentry was depowered and at his weakest.... Dude the writer even said that Sentry was depowered during this arc. So are you going to be ignorant enough to ignore the actual writers words? Come on I know you're better than that. And it doesnt matter that Sentry said he can finally cut loose. Michael Jordan always gives his all during his games but remember when he had a flu and was mentally and physically drained yet he still had an amazing performance? That is pretty much what happened with Sentry when fighting WWH. Also I told you this before, never go off of dialogue but on actual proof via on panel actions. Reed Richards said he has never seen Sentry cut loose like that before. That doesn't mean that was the end all be all of Sentrys power at that point add to the fact that he WAS depowered meaning that wasn't his true power. Hell throughout the entire WWH story arc they kept saying this is the angriest and most powerful Hulk has ever been and they were right in that moment. So does that mean Hulk was at his highest potential? Again no because Hulk went Worldbreaker at the end of the arc and that was his most powerful. Dialogue is irrelevant at times and can be mere speculation or Theory. Sad that I have to say this to you but please go off of character history, familiarity of their abilities and feats... Not by he say she say. This is all common sense. Carver first the Thanos/Gladiator debacle now this... You are starting to become worse than h1...

Originally posted by leonidas
the guy who punches out watchers wins. 😐

Against a guy that stalemated Galan... Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm NOPE

Originally posted by carver9
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-97oxdNzklJA/T76Zm0XnFhI/AAAAAAAAlQw/dV8uPBNNU7U/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-aXMiSTHXGfs/T76ZoDwX9iI/AAAAAAAAlRU/4PuWxwNo0LA/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR2.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-K4w7HpS5-O4/T76ZnjaS0WI/AAAAAAAAlRA/7DQBs7Ao9Ms/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR3.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-P7skTAsktps/T76ZoFZ38cI/AAAAAAAAlRQ/VFUaRa22MEE/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR4.jpg

🤣 So RULK punching SENTRY 1 time is RULK dominating him?

Mmmmmmk...

Loeb Rulk still stomps

Originally posted by carver9
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-97oxdNzklJA/T76Zm0XnFhI/AAAAAAAAlQw/dV8uPBNNU7U/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-aXMiSTHXGfs/T76ZoDwX9iI/AAAAAAAAlRU/4PuWxwNo0LA/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR2.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-K4w7HpS5-O4/T76ZnjaS0WI/AAAAAAAAlRA/7DQBs7Ao9Ms/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR3.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-P7skTAsktps/T76ZoFZ38cI/AAAAAAAAlRQ/VFUaRa22MEE/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR4.jpg

Wow.

Thanks buddy, the artwork is horrible but nice feat. ^^

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
I didn't say it invalidated previous showings, so you're wrong there.

I didn't just say about his fear of going outside, I wrote a huge post explaining everything but you have for some reason skipped through it and decided to respond on one thing, so you either haven't read it or you have and your choosing to misunderstand therefore trying to put your argument forward.

Again his mental stability does lower his power level, if you didn't know that here it is for confirmation.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/101942/3189038-1234124.jpg

So you again either haven't researched the Sentry or you're choosing to be ignore it for the sake of the debate.

I know Sentry has always been unstable, I never said otherwise. In fact I said this.

"He has hardly ever been back to normal in his whole career."

DS Sentry would be the most stable of the versions of Sentry currently (like I said due to him not having Agoraphobia) if you notice he screams I am Apocalypse so he may be still slightly affected but again I never stated otherwise, just said he is the most stable version currently. So again you are generalizing without any proof. If you don't believe he is more powerful then I truly cannot help you. In the scans I showed the Sentry states that the Agoraphobia is what worries him and he could lose control. Robert states that in UA Thor cleansed him of his Agoraphobic nightmare. He also doesn't have the Void persona inside him either. Only Death so most of the things he says i.e "I AM APOCALYPSE" are most likely driven by his Death persona with it guiding him to human protection. I can only suggest for you to see feats that he has performed otherwise I can't help you any more than that.

In Siege that was Voidtry and both times both DS Sentry and Voidtry performed great feats.

DS Sentry ko'd Thor with heat vision, then on their 2nd fight he ko'd him with punches. You seem to know your Voidtry feats so I don't need to explain.

I agree that they fought to a stalemate like I said in the beginning Sentry was weakened and luckily for Hulk it was a stalemate. If Sentry was more mentally focused i.e Genis-Vell Sentry then Hulk would be nought but ash.

Again Hercules wasn't putting up a fight, at first he was protecting Amadeus Cho. In the end he was going to join Hulk and Hercules was just saying "no" and "no more Hulk" as Hercules wasn't putting up a fight. If Hercules was going to take WWH on then it wouldn't have ended like it did. Remember Herc didn't set out to defeat Banner but to join him.

Ironically this was Ben Grimms EXACT assessment of Sentrys power output against Hulk:

http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/HulkvsSentry12.jpg.html

Notice Reeds comment: "He's NEVER unleashed it like this before." This was Sentry finally overcoming his fears and "finally letting go" after always having to hold back. This was a message we were hit with REPEATEDLY throughout the WWH story, yet this message is somehow being dismissed in favour of a THEORY that Sentry was weakened when this was at no point ever mentioned or even hinted in at. My stance has nothing to do with trying to downplay a character over another, I'll leave that to the true fanboys of this board. It 's based on my knowledge of Sentry as a character at his core and because it was what the story outright spelled out for us several times. That it was THE most powerful Sentry vs THE most powerful Hulk up to that point.

Greg Pak is a feat-whore but he was really good when it came to continuity and liked to reference past events for characters he wrote for, through various characters including Sentry himself, he told us this was THE most powerful Sentry, and the MOST energy he EVER had to expend, yes sorry Enzeru & BBrem this includes his "Zomg! Sentry destroyzz worldzzz while holding bakkk!!!!1!1!" feat with Photon.

I'm well aware that his mental instability has hindered him on occasions but that was more a case of Sentry 2nd guessing himself leaving openings for people or outright being afraid to fight, not "weakening" him specifically. Make no mistake about it, once he decided it was "time to play god" this was a Sentry that was afraid no longer and was prepared to do what it took to stop the Hulk:

http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media-full/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/HulkvsSentry05.jpg.html
http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/HulkvsSentry06WWH5.jpg.html

Clearly a fight between them would play out differently now that Sentry understands his own powers better and is arguably more powerful than before but this doesn't mean his old superhero version was always "weakened" by proxy.

Originally posted by Bentley
LF Rulk would kill Sentry even if he was unkillable as you claim, because he just doesn't give a f*ck.

Originally posted by The Sorrow
I didn't dismiss your posts but I didn 't ask for another long-winded explanation on why you THINK Sentry was weakened, I asked for PROOF and FACTS. This back and forth is fast becoming tedious so I'll break it down for you best I can; handbook quotes are NOT proof, BUT even using your own scan it basically states when STABLE, he is "equal" to a million exploding suns.

Ironically this was Ben Grimms EXACT assessment of Sentrys power output against Hulk:

http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/HulkvsSentry12.jpg.html

Notice Reeds comment: "He's NEVER unleashed it like this before." This is was Sentry finally overcoming his fears and "finally letting go" after always having to hold back. This was a message we were hit with REPEATEDLY throughout the WWH story, yet this message is somehow being dismissed in favour of a THEORY that Sentry was weakened when this was at no point ever mentioned or even hinted in at. My stance has nothing to do with trying to downplay a character over another, I'll leave that to the true fanboys of this board. It 's based on my knowledge of Sentry as a character at his core and because it was what the story outright spelled out for us several times. That it was THE most powerful Sentry vs THE most powerful Hulk up to that point.

Greg Pak is a feat-whore but he was really good when it came to continuity and liked to reference past events for characters he wrote for, through various characters including Sentry himself, he told us this was THE most powerful Sentry, and the MOST energy he EVER had to expend, yes sorry Enzeru & BBrem this includes his "Zomg! Sentry destroyzz worldzzz while holding bakkk!!!!1!1!" feat with Photon.

I'm well aware that his mental instability has hindered him on occasions but that was more a case of Sentry 2nd guessing himself leaving openings for people or outright being afraid to fight, not "weakening" him specifically. Make no mistake about it, once he decided it was "time to play god" this was a Sentry that was afraid no longer and was prepared to do what it took to stop the Hulk:

http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media-full/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/HulkvsSentry05.jpg.html
http://s388.photobucket.com/user/OneDumbG0/media/Hulk%20Fights%20N-S/HulkvsSentry06WWH5.jpg.html

Clearly a fight between them would play out differently now that Sentry understands his own powers better and is arguably more powerful than before but this doesn't mean his old superhero version was always "weakened" by proxy.

Again you're dismissing my explanation for why he is weakened. You have my explanation or Enzeru's to pick from. To be honest if you want to be ignorant and not read it it's up to you, Sentry was weakened and you should just deal with it.

So what if Ben Grimm stated that it doesn't really validate what he is saying does it? Does that compare to his Genis-Vell fight? Now you have resorted to basing your argument on something that Ben Grimm said and if you saw he said, If I had to guess. Like I have explained to Carver he was losing control, like I showed you in the post you haven't bothered to read. He hasn't overcame his fears and you know that's rubbish so just read through my post again and hopefully it's explained to you.

"I'm well aware that his mental instability has hindered him on occasions"

This is the 1st shred of sense but then you go back into being delusional. Sentry was unstable and weakened he was due to him being unstable could risk killing Hulk and everyone. Sentry intervened because he had no choice. People were going to die, it's pretty obvious there.

In short you are being delusional and twiting every scene to suit your needs. If the Sentry is weakened that makes Hulk look less impressive as Hulk only stalemated at best. So you have to make up a story to make Sentry look full powered to give Hulk more respect. You do the Hulk more harm by making him something that he wasn't in that story.

I have explained everything to you clearly and each thing is shown to be right, you resort to misinterpreting statements and saying things like this.

"Zomg! Sentry destroyzz worldzzz while holding bakkk!!!!1!1!" feat with Photon."

In the crowd of Hulk lovers there is probably 2 people at the top with you and Carver. At least when he knew he was wrong he was prepared to concede but you take it to the extreme, stop coming up with a new story each time and just admit that Robert was weakened and therefore didn't perform as well during the fight, thankfully for that Hulk wasn't killed as he convinced Sentry to be the Saviour.

Now read this and don't come back to me with something else.

Do yourself a favour and read this.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=585162&pagenumber=2

Now kindly stop coming up with rubbish to support your claims.

lol@crowd of hulk losers

Its on now

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Again you're dismissing my explanation for why he is weakened. You have my explanation or Enzeru's to pick from. To be honest if you want to be ignorant and not read it it's up to you, Sentry was weakened and you should just deal with it.

So what if Ben Grimm stated that it doesn't really validate what he is saying does it? Does that compare to his Genis-Vell fight? Now you have resorted to basing your argument on something that Ben Grimm said and if you saw he said, If I had to guess. Like I have explained to Carver he was losing control, like I showed you in the post you haven't bothered to read. He hasn't overcame his fears and you know that's rubbish so just read through my post again and hopefully it's explained to you.

"I'm well aware that his mental instability has hindered him on occasions"

This is the 1st shred of sense but then you go back into being delusional. Sentry was unstable and weakened he was due to him being unstable could risk killing Hulk and everyone. Sentry intervened because he had no choice. People were going to die, it's pretty obvious there.

In short you are being delusional and twiting every scene to suit your needs. If the Sentry is weakened that makes Hulk look less impressive as Hulk only stalemated at best. So you have to make up a story to make Sentry look full powered to give Hulk more respect. You do the Hulk more harm by making him something that he wasn't in that story.

I have explained everything to you clearly and each thing is shown to be right, you resort to misinterpreting statements and saying things like this.

"Zomg! Sentry destroyzz worldzzz while holding bakkk!!!!1!1!" feat with Photon."

In the crowd of Hulk lovers there is probably 2 people at the top with you and Carver. At least when he knew he was wrong he was prepared to concede but you take it to the extreme, stop coming up with a new story each time and just admit that Robert was weakened and therefore didn't perform as well during the fight, thankfully for that Hulk wasn't killed as he convinced Sentry to be the Saviour.

Now read this and don't come back to me with something else.

Do yourself a favour and read this.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=585162&pagenumber=2

Now kindly stop coming up with rubbish to support your claims.

Again you added nothing. Concession accepted 👆

To Sorrow and Carver, what is it you need to see to affirm Enzeru's and Stoic's argument?

Originally posted by The Sorrow
Lol talk about e-meltdown.

Again you added nothing. Concession accepted 👆

I say one more thing. Not once did I concede. Conceding would be saying

"The_Sorrow you were right all along"

Which I didn't. And the fact that you say "Concession accepted 👆" doesn't make you look like a good debater. In fact it's quite the opposite. It's only a meltdown to you because you dislike what I'm saying.

The Sorrow. Please read my last post. It explains why Sentry was depowered.... Please don't be another one of those guys who ignores everything regarding character facts and history.

Originally posted by carver9
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-97oxdNzklJA/T76Zm0XnFhI/AAAAAAAAlQw/dV8uPBNNU7U/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR.jpg
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-aXMiSTHXGfs/T76ZoDwX9iI/AAAAAAAAlRU/4PuWxwNo0LA/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR2.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-K4w7HpS5-O4/T76ZnjaS0WI/AAAAAAAAlRA/7DQBs7Ao9Ms/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR3.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-P7skTAsktps/T76ZoFZ38cI/AAAAAAAAlRQ/VFUaRa22MEE/s1600/HULKSMAVN2012005_int_LR4.jpg

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Wow. Thanks buddy, the artwork is horrible but nice feat. ^^

Ask Carver to post the entire fight.