Originally posted by FreshestSlice
End of the novel Sidious is weaker than Plagueis, significantly. How can he take Orbalisk Bane?
Except that he isn't weaker at all, and sources have already stated that Sidious killed Plagueis upon receiving the power to do so. Not only that, but his power increased immediately after his master's death. Anyway, he's just much faster than Bane, and could overwhelm him with Lightning as well.
Originally posted by Nargaroth
Except that he isn't weaker at all, and sources have already stated that Sidious killed Plagueis upon receiving the power to do so. Not only that, but his power increased immediately after his master's death. Anyway, he's just much faster than Bane, and could overwhelm him with Lightning as well.
Anyway, being faster than Bane won't be enough. Raskta was faster, more skilled, and landed more blows than Bane, and she hardly touched him. Lightning is the only thing Sidious has going for him, and I don't think his TPM incarnation is powerful enough in that aspect.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
In the novel, Sidious doesn't even pretend to be stronger than Plagueis. "Only more clever. "
Sidious boasts that he's "equally powerful" to Plagueis at the time of their final confrontation and he does indeed Force choke him to death even as Plagueis tries to resist the effects. When Luceno was asked on Facebook, he alluded that Plagueis would be the victor in a fair fight, but nothing was implied by him or the book that it would be a stomp.
But it doesn't matter, because Bane's pretty far beneath Plagueis anyway.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
He couldn't resist because he was drunk and Sidious hitting his breathing device with lightning. 😬
Sidious did indeed disable Plagueis's respirator, but Plagueis tried to resist Sidious Force-choking him.
With respect to Plagueis's intoxication, this is the same guy who, in a weaker incarnation, systematically manhandled two dozen Maladian assassins barehanded despite cardiac arrest and extensive bodily mutilation. I doubt a healthy buzz is going to make much difference.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Source for Sidious being more powerful?Anyway, being faster than Bane won't be enough. Raskta was faster, more skilled, and landed more blows than Bane, and she hardly touched him. Lightning is the only thing Sidious has going for him, and I don't think his TPM incarnation is powerful enough in that aspect.
Here's your answer:
In truth, Palpatine was well versed in the ways of the Force, having been apprentice to Darth Plagueis the Wise, a Sith Lord who was a master of arcane and unnatural knowledge. In true Sith tradition, Palpatine murdered his Master upon receiving the skill and ability to do so.
And here's the quote from the novel proving that he became more powerful immediately after his master's death:
A tremor took hold of the planet.
Sprung from death, it unleashed itself in a powerful wave, at once burrowing deep into the world’s core and radiating through its saccharine atmosphere to shake the stars themselves. At the quake’s epicenter stood Sidious, one elegant hand vised on the burnished sill of an expansive translucency, a vessel filled suddenly to bursting, the Force so strong within him that he feared he might disappear into it, never to return. But the moment didn’t constitute an ending so much as a true beginning, long overdue; it was less a transformation than an intensification—a gravitic shift.
A welter of voices, near and far, present and from eons past, drowned his thoughts. Raised in praise, the voices proclaimed his reign and cheered the inauguration of a new order. Yellow eyes lifted to the night sky, he saw the trembling stars flare, and in the depth of his being he felt the power of the dark side anoint him.
Slowly, almost reluctantly, he came back to himself, his gaze settling on his manicured hands. Returned to the present, he took note of his rapid breathing, while behind him the room labored to restore order. Air scrubbers hummed—costly wall tapestries undulating in the summoned breeze. Prized carpets sealed their fibers against the spread of spilled fluids. The droid shuffled in obvious confliction. Sidious pivoted to take in the disarray: antique furniture overturned; framed artwork askew. As if a whirlwind had swept through. And facedown on the floor lay a statue of Yanjon, one of four law-giving sages of Dwartii.
A piece Sidious had secretly coveted.
Also sprawled there, Plagueis: his slender limbs splayed and elongated head turned to one side. Dressed in finery, as for a night on the town.
And now dead.
Or was he?
Uncertainty rippled through Sidious, rage returning to his eyes. A tremor of his own making, or one of forewarning? Was it possible that the wily Muun had deceived him? Had Plagueis unlocked the key to immortality, and survived after all? Never mind that it would constitute a petty move for one so wise—for one who had professed to place the Grand Plan above all else. Had Plagueis become ensnared in a self-spun web of jealousy and possessiveness, victim of his own engineering, his own foibles?
If he hadn’t been concerned for his own safety, Sidious might have pitied him. Wary of approaching the corpse of his former Master, he called on the Force to roll the aged Muun over onto his back. From that angle Plagueis looked almost as he had when Sidious first met him, decades earlier: smooth, hairless cranium; humped nose, with its bridge flattened as if from a shock-ball blow and its sharp tip pressed almost to his upper lip; jutting lower jaw; sunken eyes still brimming with menace—a physical characteristic rarely encountered in a Muun. But then Plagueis had never been an ordinary Muun, nor an ordinary being of any sort.
Sidious took care, still reaching out with the Force. On closer inspection, he saw that Plagueis’s already cyanotic flesh was smoothing out, his features relaxing.
Faintly aware of the whir of air scrubbers and sounds of the outside world infiltrating the luxurious suite, he continued the vigil; then, in relief, he pulled himself up to his full height and let out his breath. This was no Sith trick. Not an instance of feigning death, but one of succumbing to its cold embrace. The being who had guided him to power was gone.
Wry amusement narrowed his eyes.
The Muun might have lived another hundred years unchanged. He might have lived forever had he succeeded fully in his quest. But in the end—though he could save others from death—he had failed to save himself.
A sense of supreme accomplishment puffed Sidious’s chest, and his thoughts unreeled.
Well, then, that wasn’t nearly as bad as we thought it might be...
Rarely did events play out as imagined, in any case. The order of future events was transient. In the same way that the past was reconfigured by selective memory, future events, too, were moving targets. One could only act on instinct, grab hold of an intuited perfect moment, and spring into action. One heartbeat late and the universe would have recomposed itself, no imposition of will sufficient to forestall the currents. One could only observe and react. Surprise was the element absent from any periodic table. A keystone element; a missing ingredient. The means by which the Force amused itself. A reminder to all sentient beings that some secrets could never be unlocked.
Confident that the will of the dark side had been done, he returned to the suite’s window wall. Two beings in a galaxy of countless trillions, but what had transpired in the suite would affect the lives of all of them. Already the galaxy had been shaped by the birth of one, and henceforth would be reshaped by the death of the other. But had the change been felt and recognized elsewhere? Were his sworn enemies aware that the Force had shifted irrevocably? Would it be enough to rouse them from self-righteousness? He hoped not. For now the work of vengeance could begin in earnest.
His eyes sought and found an ascending constellation of stars, one of power and consequence new to the sky, though soon to be overwhelmed by dawn’s first light. Low in the sky over the flatlands, visible only to those who knew where and how to look, it ushered in a bold future. To some the stars and planets might seem to be moving as ever, destined to align in configurations calculated long before their fiery births. But in fact the heavens had been perturbed, tugged by dark matter into novel alignments. In his mouth, Sidious tasted the tang of blood; in his chest, he felt the monster rising, emerging from shadowy depths and contorting his aspect into something fearsome just short of revealing itself to the world.
The dark side had made him its property, and now he made the dark side his.
Breathless, not from exertion but from the sudden inspiration of power, he let go of the sill and allowed the monster to writhe through his body like an unbroken beast of range or prairie.
Had the Force ever been so strong in anyone?
Sidious had never learned how Plagueis’s own Master had met his end. Had he died at Plagueis’s hand? Had Plagueis, too, experienced a similar exultation on becoming a sole Sith Lord? Had the beast of the end time risen then to peek at the world it was to inhabit, knowing its release was imminent?
Regardless, Palpatine is much faster and much more skilled than Raskta, and the fact that she could land quite a few hits on Bane only further proves that Sidious would overwhelm him. It wouldn't be a speedblitz, but Bane would only survive for some time thanks his armor. Sidious would still be able to take his head, and he knows the properties of Orbalisks as per the Book Of Sith, so he won't waste time slashing Bane's body.
Sidious' training was already accomplished by that point. He didn't practice sourcery much at the time but one does not need to be a sorcerer to reach his prime. Also, after killing Plagueis he just continued dedicating most of his time to politics. There is no reason to assume that Palpatine improved even marginally since death of Plagueis. Sidous would beat Bane at the time plain and square.
"Plagueis the Wise, who forged the most powerful Sith Lord the galaxy has ever known, and yet who forgot to leave a place for himself; whose pride never allowed him to question that he would no longer be needed.
While Sidious' own opinion is not a proof, I don't think he would make such assumptions for no reason.