Originally posted by ILS
Ventress already won. 😖hifty:
No she didn't. That was a mock battle in which neither Sora nor Asajj were actually trying to kill each other. The little graze Sora took was just to sell the deception.
Mace drove off Asajj easily, while Sora put up a fairly even fight against him. That alone shows that Sora outclasses Asajj.
Originally posted by chilled monkeyI was kidding, lol.
No she didn't. That was a mock battle in which neither Sora nor Asajj were actually trying to kill each other. The little graze Sora took was just to sell the deception.Mace drove off Asajj easily, while Sora put up a fairly even fight against him. That alone shows that Sora outclasses Asajj.
Except a source has told us that Mace required all of his skill in order to defeat Ventress, and Ventress left the fight early because she knew this. It wasn't her being stomped like so many people manage to perceive, she was just being smart. Also, the reason Sora did so well against Mace was very likely due to their intrinsic knowledge of each other's fighting style, because you don't go from being disarmed by Dooku in one move while you have back up, to stalemating Mace Windu. So yeah, Ventress is actually better than Bulq, in all reality.
Originally posted by Fated XtasyI don't think Ventress has ever been considered equal to Grievous except in Filoni's opinion, which he hasn't put forward as fact. In Dooku's opinion, and I believe a sourcebook I'll need to dig for, Grievous has been stated as being Ventress's superior (and Dooku's most formidable acolyte), and he stomped her in Rogue's Gallery.
And Ventress at her prime was considered an equal to Grevious and actually beat him.
And, you know, Ventress was on Dathomir when she beat Grievous, where she was amped, and this was also coming from a medium which portrays Force Users/Grievous as far less fast/strong/powerful than in EU comics, novels ect.
Pretty much all of his defeats can be justified in-universe, though. His cybernetics needed recharging when he fought Kit Fisto because he had been cut in half not too long ago, and Fisto has a form advantage against multiple blades. Before that, Grievous had fought Kit Fisto and his apprentice (who fodderized several MagnaGuards) at the same time while clones attacked him. His fight with Ventress - she was amped. Then there are things like the Eeth Koth fight which people bend out of shape and try to assert that Grievous was losing against Koth and needed his MagnaGuards' help, when really he was just trying to capture Koth. Then of course there are the Gungans, which partly I see as a result of Lucas' stupidity (or just an inconsistent low showing), and partly because Grievous isn't nearly as fast as he is in the EU, where he has fodderized literally hundreds of clone troopers with his bare hands in one sitting. And it's also inconsistent with the ROTS novel, where Grievous states that he has armed his MagnaGuards with weapons that couldn't possibly hurt him - Electromagnetic staffs - which are the exact weapons the Gungans incapacitated him with.
And then, he's stomped Kenobi twice during TCW, which is always nice.
Originally posted by ILS
It's not a lowball just because you say it is, bro.He says "perhaps you're a match for me", to paraphrase, and he said it mockingly. I wouldn't take it too seriously given the overwhelming amount of evidence suggesting Grievous > Ventress we already have.
Grevious hasn't taken on Obi-Wan and Anakin Simultaneously 😐 nor did he duel with Savage and Maul
Originally posted by Fated XtasyAnd Ventress was clearly on the backfoot 😕 Ventress has never fought as an equal for Mace Windu whilst hindered by having her feet magnetized to the ground, and Grievous was only using two lightsabers in that fight. In contrast Ventress caused Windu a lot of bother but the winner was still clear between them in the end, the same wasn't the case with Windu and Grievous.
Grevious hasn't taken on Obi-Wan and Anakin Simultaneously 😐 nor did he duel with Savage and Maul
Originally posted by Fated XtasyVentress was losing to Savage, though, and her fights with Maul were so brief they're hardly worth noting - and fighting Maul and Savage isn't a sign of superiority anyway. Also, you're forgetting that Grievous does fight Maul properly in SOD #4, where they appear to fight off-panel for a while and then Maul chooses to BFR Grievous. Make of that what you will.
Grevious hasn't taken on Obi-Wan and Anakin Simultaneously 😐 nor did he duel with Savage and Maul
I could easily say Ventress has never stomped Kenobi twice, has never performed as well against Mace, never fought five Jedi at once ect, but that's not really an argument because you don't need to carry out identical feats in order to be comparable to someone. Name dropping isn't going to do it, Fated.
Originally posted by ILS
Ventress was losing to Savage, though, and her fights with Maul were so brief they're hardly worth noting - and fighting Maul and Savage isn't a sign of superiority anyway. Also, you're forgetting that Grievous does fight Maul properly in SOD #4, where they appear to fight off-panel for a while and then Maul chooses to BFR Grievous. Make of that what you will.
So her fighting Maul+Savage along side kenobi on screen - even for a few moments, is not worth noting, but Maul's fight with Grevious off panel is? in spite of the fact that we know how that fight went? Like, come on. she held her own against Savage and Maul, and Grevious did the same against Maul. Don't be so dismissive
I could easily say Ventress has never stomped Kenobi twice,
Most of the time she was a distraction, and she fought evenly with Anakin on Kamino, she even kicked his butt solidly during that fight.
has never performed as well against Mace,
Well there's the out of universe statement from fact file and then there's the statement from the comic. Make of that what you will.
never fought five Jedi at once ect,
but that's not really an argument because you don't need to carry out identical feats in order to be comparable to someone. Name dropping isn't going to do it, Fated.
Agreed, that isn't my intention though.
So her fighting Maul+Savage along side kenobi on screen - even for a few moments, is not worth noting, but Maul's fight with Grevious off panel is? in spite of the fact that we know how that fight went? Like, come on. she held her own against Savage and Maul, and Grevious did the same against Maul. Don't be so dismissiveI didn't say it wasn't worth noting, I said it wasn't a sign of superiority. Given Grievous' own ability to combat multiple opponents, and his comparable skill and physical ability to Kenobi and Anakin, I have no doubt in my mind he could fight them both at the same time whilst on the backfoot. I'm not being dismissive, you're just misinterpreting my points.
Most of the time she was a distraction, and she fought evenly with Anakin on Kamino, she even kicked his butt solidly during that fight.She kicked him down once, and this was pre-prime Anakin. Good feat because she's comparable to Anakin? Yes. Conclusive evidence of her being > Anakin or Grievous? Nah, because Anakin has also bested her, and so have Grievous and Mace already without circumstances.
Well there's the out of universe statement from fact file and then there's the statement from the comic. Make of that what you will.What I make of it is that Ventress couldn't perform as well as Grievous against a common opponent even though Grievous even had circumstances riding against him.
Exhausted Jedi, three of which are the only warriors of note.Obviously, but Ventress hasn't ever replicated this level of multi-tasking or dexterity.