The Avengers or The Justice League ?

Originally posted by carver9
This is what happens when she is prepared.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/13461816/VS-Zone-002.jpg.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/13461817/VS-Zone-003.jpg.html

Ok.

Darkseid allows the Avengers time to prepare, whilst he uses his OBs on the weakest members of the Avengers first. Despite there being prior knowledge (so knowing what Scarlet Witch/Thor/Hulk etc can do) he instead will focus all his energies on fighting Spiderman and Cap first. Once Wanda is ready for him, then he will oblige, and fight them on their terms 👆

Originally posted by DarkSaint85

In the DCnU? Or are you allowing ALL of Darkseid's feats? That opens up the Great Darkness Saga, when he effortlessly mind controlled 3 billion Daxamites across the galaxy. But of course, that's not the latest versions of the characters, right?

Considering you thought Aquaman's stabbing of Darkseid was fan art, and thought that Cyborg didn't use his white noise cannon in the comics, you are hardly one to talk about reminders.

In any case,

http://media.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/22178/justice-league-5-02.jpg
http://media.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/22178/justice-league-5-03.jpg
http://media.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/22178/justice-league-5-04.jpg

You can see that Superman was up, and ready for a fight ('I'm up. But not to talk'😉. The OBs were still so fast, Barry was the one who had to pull him up - but he was hardly helpless. The OBs are JUST THAT FAST.

It doesn't make sense, because you are a bit slow. Do you think someone like, say, Batman can sucker punch Flash? Say they are just chatting, like friends. Flash doesn't know Batman is going to punch him. Do you think he can punch Flash?

Of course he can't. For all of his training, he is just a human level athlete. Flash is a lightspeeder. Batman CAN, however, sucker punch human level characters (Hal Jordan, for example). How does this tie in with my argument?

Wanda is human level in her reaction speed. Whether she was expecting it or not, she is human level. IF she was faster than a human, than all the suckering in the world wouldn't work on her. You could TRY and catch her by surprise, but if she had faster reflexes than you, you'd fail.

The OBs are Flash level (whilst slower, they aren't THAT much slower - Flash had to for the first time in his life, catch his breath). Even if Wanda is staring at them, it wouldn't help her one bit. [/B]

I guess you didn't see Batman's recent fight against Darkseid. Gotcha.

And we still see Superman damaged on the ground. He wasn't ok. The Omega's is inconsistent (using your argument here) and has been blocked.

So if Batman had flash powers would he be able to sucker punch a Flash that isn't paying attention? Yes, he could.

Wanda probabilities powers are active during the onset of the battle. Start from there. Even though I disagree with her reactions etc being human level.

Lol...Flash didn't even know how to use the force during those instances. Good luck on guessing how fast he was going during that scene. I say he is going Mach 3. Prove me wrong.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Ok.

Darkseid allows the Avengers time to prepare, whilst he uses his OBs on the weakest members of the Avengers first. Despite there being prior knowledge (so knowing what Scarlet Witch/Thor/Hulk etc can do) he instead will focus all his energies on fighting Spiderman and Cap first. Once Wanda is ready for him, then he will oblige, and fight them on their terms 👆

Her abilities are thought based. Darkseid attack isn't covering the distance that fast. Sorry.

Originally posted by carver9
Her abilities are thought based. Darkseid attack isn't covering the distance that fast. Sorry.

Roger dodger?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=608492&pagenumber=7#post15076902

Originally posted by carver9
I guess you didn't see Batman's recent fight against Darkseid. Gotcha.

And we still see Superman damaged on the ground. He wasn't ok. The Omega's is inconsistent (using your argument here) and has been blocked.

So if Batman had flash powers would he be able to sucker punch a Flash that isn't paying attention? Yes, he could.

Wanda probabilities powers are active during the onset of the battle. Start from there. Even though I disagree with her reactions etc being human level.

Lol...Flash didn't even know how to use the force during those instances. Good luck on guessing how fast he was going during that scene. I say he is going Mach 3. Prove me wrong.

Originally posted by carver9
Her abilities are thought based. Darkseid attack isn't covering the distance that fast. Sorry.

But Hope's fist can?
https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/hope-summers-vs-scarlet-witch-4.jpg

How about her headbutt?

http://www.abload.de/img/vs-zone-005t4cx9.jpg

Btw, glad you brought up the point about Barry not knowing how to use the Speed Force.

Here, he's contributing to the Hellbat armour, USING the Speed Force. Does it make Batman faster? I leave you, dear carver, to decide:

http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff516/Henchman4Hire/HellbatArmor01.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85

Oh, in the Hellbat armour, which granted him unknown abilities and powers? Gotcha.

Sure he wasn't - even though we see him flying just fine away from them. I didn't know the Avengers had Hellbat armours on. What inconsistency?

👆 We agree. So they have to be on the same level. Wanda's speed was on the same level as Hope; i.e., human level.

She can turn them on and off? And I'm sure her powers were still active when Hope headbutted her - she still needs to consciously affect them. Think of it like Zatanna. Her powers are always active - but if she doesn't know what to affect with her powers, it's useless.

Mach 3 is fine. It's still faster than Wanda (although Flash was pretty fast by then; remember how he toyed with Superman earlier?) IOW, Flash is miles above Wanda in terms of reflex speeds - and he was still barely able to outrun them. [/B]

Lol...so we are granting Batman abilities he has not shown? Gotcha. Even though Parademons and Kalabak sint have any issues tagging him? Is this version of Batman faster than thought?

He still was hurt moments beforehand.

The same level as the speed of thought.

Yes she can turn them on and off. Look at the scan above. Her eyes are normal, she brings up her probability powers. Her eyes glow and that's when it is in effect.

It isn't covering the distance before Wanda activates her powers. Sorry.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol...so we are granting Batman abilities he has not shown? Gotcha. Even though Parademons and Kalabak sint have any issues tagging him? Is this version of Batman faster than thought?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Btw, glad you brought up the point about Barry not knowing how to use the Speed Force.

Here, he's contributing to the Hellbat armour, USING the Speed Force. Does it make Batman faster? I leave you, dear carver, to decide:

http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff516/Henchman4Hire/HellbatArmor01.jpg

He still was hurt moments beforehand.

The same level as the speed of thought.

Yes she can turn them on and off. Look at the scan above. Her eyes are normal, she brings up her probability powers. Her eyes glow and that's when it is in effect.

It isn't covering the distance before Wanda activates her powers. Sorry.

Lol, or when Darkseid activates his powers. What inconsistencies in speed have you got for the OB? I have shown at least that Barry added his Speed Force powers to the armour.

Ultimately, you are merely grasping at straws here. Neither team is beating Darkseid.

The premise is whod do better not whod beat him. Neither team would win but jl have better odds

Originally posted by DarkSaint85

Lol, or when Darkseid activates his powers. What inconsistencies in speed have you got for the OB? I have shown at least that Barry added his Speed Force powers to the armour.

Ultimately, you are merely grasping at straws here. Neither team is beating Darkseid. [/B]

One inconcistency. Darkseid was able to get off some words even though Darkseid shot the Omega's and it still didn't hit Batman and he had enough time to raise his hand and stop the attack.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/21501263/Batman_and_Robin_037-012.jpg.html

Is he somehow faster than Superman?

Mr. Miracle was temporarily able to outpace them and Darkseid wad able to talk while the beams were out and before they ruched Miracle. Miracle was able to fly in between the spears before being touched.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/21501320/Earth_2_-_Worlds_End_2014-_011-005.jpg.html

Darkseid voice is either FTL or his Omegas isn't as fast as you are making them out to be.

Originally posted by carver9
One inconcistency. Darkseid was able to get off some words even though Darkseid shot the Omega's and it still didn't hit Batman and he had enough time to raise his hand and stop the attack.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/21501263/Batman_and_Robin_037-012.jpg.html

Is he somehow faster than Superman?

Mr. Miracle was temporarily able to outpace them and Darkseid wad able to talk while the beams were out and before they ruched Miracle. Miracle was able to fly in between the spears before being touched.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/21501320/Earth_2_-_Worlds_End_2014-_011-005.jpg.html

Darkseid voice is either FTL or his Omegas isn't as fast as you are making them out to be.

Speedforce imbued armour:
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff516/Henchman4Hire/HellbatArmor01.jpg

Not to mention, READ your own bloody scan, lol. Darkseid says:

'They were ATTRACTED to the chaos shard like a magnet'.

They were NEVER going to hit Bats, lol. They were attracted to the shard.

Mr Miracle....the greatest escape artist.....escaped them.....

Yeah, that's kinda his power...
😕

PLUS, attracted once more, to the Boom spheres.

Not to mention, that's the Omega Effect, not Omega Beams.

Jeez you're terrible at this.

👆

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Speedforce imbued armour:
http://i1239.photobucket.com/albums/ff516/Henchman4Hire/HellbatArmor01.jpg

Not to mention, READ your own bloody scan, lol. Darkseid says:

'They were ATTRACTED to the chaos shard like a magnet'.

They were NEVER going to hit Bats, lol. They were attracted to the shard.

Mr Miracle....the greatest escape artist.....escaped them.....

Yeah, that's kinda his power...
😕

PLUS, attracted once more, to the Boom spheres.

Not to mention, that's the Omega Effect, not Omega Beams.

Jeez you're terrible at this.

Makes sense...thats why Batman lifted his arm in the air, because the beams wasn't going to hit him. Great.

Mr. Miracle still outpaced them before they hit him.

So the speed of his blasts are different. Prove it.

The Omega Beams/Omega Effect go as fast as Darkseid wants them to.

Originally posted by carver9
Makes sense...thats why Batman lifted his arm in the air, because the beams wasn't going to hit him. Great.

Mr. Miracle still outpaced them before they hit him.

So the speed of his blasts are different. Prove it.

So Darkseid's words mean nothing now? Note how the Effect races UPWARDS, TOWARDS the shard. Had he not lifted his arm, they would have still been attracted to it. He lifted his arm because the artist wanted to draw a cool pose, that's all. Jeez.

Mr Miracle had the Boom spheres between him and the OE - unless you think the spheres are gigantic??? Look at the first image. Once the OE got within range of the spheres, they were bounced around all three. The art is so clear. You can even see Miracle looking over his shoulder as the spheres trap the OE.

Originally posted by -Pr-
The Omega Beams/Omega Effect go as fast as Darkseid wants them to.

This...

Getting off topic though

Did Carver post the Wonder Woman OE scans yet?

Nope...that's all they are going to say is she is FTL which would make her faster than both Superman and Flash. Whatever, I'm done here.