Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
The fact? As if Disney have issued a certification of Anakin Skywalker's infallibility to telepathic subjugation?Breaking Anakin Skywalker wouldn't be so difficult for a Force-user who have demonstrated the capability to telepathically subjugate a planet's entire populace.
Originally posted by AncientPowerProof that Vitiate knows the Force storm technique? You can't just (erroneously) equate Vitiate with DE Sidious and then ascribe him his abilities.
Force Storm? Yeah neither of them are defending against that. Same for Vitiate's planet killing drain.
Secondly on what basis are you assumi ng Vitiate's Force drain will be effective against them?
P.S. Yoda should be able to use Force light to purge Anakin of the Emperor's influence, assumi ng he's strong enough to dominate him, which is speculation.
Anyway Team wins, both Yoda and Sidious know techniques that will be effective against Vitiate's spirit and Anakin can provide support against any Sith spawn he summons.
Sidious possesses the ability to "channel Sith spirits" and while we don't know exactly what that entails, it's probably similar to the Force walking technique which is essentially the channeling of spirits. In that way Sidious should be able to assault, drain and bind Vitiate.
Then we have Yoda who knows the Force light, an offensive power that withers entities of the dark side so that they can be destroyed. So it's basically a one-two punch, Yoda wears him down with Force light until he succumbs to Sidious and is devoured, while again Anakin covers them.
And when being assaulted in this manner Vitiate will probably be too entangled to perform any big attacks.
Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Why you mad, tho? That you need to bring Disney in to a Legends debate?
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Anakin Skywalker can be manipulated and influenced by telepathic powers. He isn't among the most resolute Jedi in the matters of mental fortitude.
As an example:
Palpatine conducted Sith rituals on Coruscant that radiated unnerving ripples in the Force, which caused anxiety among most Jedi throughout the galaxy, but also served to increase Anakin Skywalker's hunger for power.
Taken from Star Wars: The Ultimate Visual Guide
On the other hand:
The Emperor can wither and ruin even the strongest Jedi's connection to the light side.
Taken from Star Wars: The Old Republic
The aforementioned revelation implies that even the likes of Master Yoda are not immune to telepathic powers of Vitiate.
Originally posted by AncientPower
Legend, 'simultaneously' means at the same time, he's laughing at your equivalent of a 'double negative'(e.g; irregardless).
My point is that Vitiate can attack multiple individuals with his powers at the same time.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Anyway Team wins, both Yoda and Sidious know techniques that will be effective against Vitiate's spirit and Anakin can provide support against any Sith spawn he summons.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Sidious possesses the ability to "channel Sith spirits" and while we don't know exactly what that entails, it's probably similar to the Force walking technique which is essentially the channeling of spirits. In that way Sidious should be able to assault, drain and bind Vitiate.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Then we have Yoda who knows the Force light, an offensive power that withers entities of the dark side so that they can be destroyed. So it's basically a one-two punch, Yoda wears him down with Force light until he succumbs to Sidious and is devoured, while again Anakin covers them.
Also, provide evidence of Force Light working on Vitiate.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
And when being assaulted in this manner Vitiate will probably be too entangled to perform any big attacks.
The idea of Vitiate possessing Anakin isn't something I'd considered and I think it actually is a genuine avenue for victory. Considering that Anakin has no defense against this beyond Freshest's obvious horseshit, it's certainly in his power to do so (quite easily) and Anakin's power wielded by an actually competent force user could pose a threat even to Sidious and Yoda together.
@Legend
We've already ridden this merry-go-round on your spite/'gayism' discussion thread, so I'll just jog your memory.
Originally posted by BeniboyblingThe same logic can be used for Sidious' ability to channel spirits, as Vitiate is one, so I'd like those proofs in it's context as well. Have fun.
Correct. You're making a claim without proof *opens proverbial trashcan* - and there it goes.I on the other hand, am reaching a logical conclusion, it's called deductive reasoning:
1. Wall of Light and Force Light powers are effective against spirits.
2. Vitiate is a spirit.
3. Wall of Light and Force Light powers are therefore effective against Vitiate.You claimed Vitiate isn't a normal spirit. Prove it.
You claimed Wall of Light and Force Light are conventional powers. Prove it.
And for the record, Nox is not comparable to Sidious as a Force user, nor did he ever locate the Sith Emperor's spirit, so that's a moot point.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDThe OP didn't specify a location or scenario so I assumed the standard neutral terrain, several meters apart, and will continue to do so unless he states otherwise. 👆
The Strike Team needs to figure out how to contend with Vitiate first. They cannot defeat something that they cannot even sense or see.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
@LegendWe've already ridden this merry-go-round on your spite/'gayism' discussion thread, so I'll just jog your memory.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
The same logic can be used for Sidious' ability to channel spirits, as Vitiate is one, so I'd like those proofs in it's context as well. Have fun.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
And for the record, Nox is not comparable to Sidious as a Force user, nor did he ever locate the Sith Emperor's spirit, so that's a moot point.
Locate Vitiate's spirit? Vitiate have 'directly' interacted with protagonists on several occasions.
From 1:31 to 2:22
From 29:25 to 30:25
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You can also notice how actual spirits (Force ghosts) are depicted in SWTOR content.
Example 1: Revan
Example 2: Meetra Surik
In contrast, Vitiate appears to be utterly formless.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
The OP didn't specify a location or scenario so I assumed the standard neutral terrain, several meters apart, and will continue to do so unless he states otherwise. 👆
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDA logical deduction is not speculation bro, there is no element of conjecture involved. I accept your concession.
Aside from speculations, you can offer nothing in your arguments regarding stopping formless incarnation of Vitiate.
The ability to channel spirits implies what exactly?The ability to control/manipulate their power a la Force walking i.e. an effective means of dealing with a spirit.
This is a lame lowballing attempt. Darth Nox have demonstrated Dark Side talents that Darth Sidious haven't; [B]Force Walking is a good example. Try again.[/b]Except Sidious can channel spirits. So what exactly puts Nox in Sidious' league?
Locate Vitiate's spirit? Vitiate have 'directly' interacted with protagonists on several occasions.Appearing as a disembodied voice is not direct interaction, it is indirect, in none of those situations did Vitiate actually manifest before them and in fact his lack of appearance is pointed out several times.
You can also notice how a actual spirits are depicted in SWTOR content.
No he just did not appear before them, as you've proven by citing examples of what a direct manifestation looks like. You'll find its not the first time a spirit has manifested as a disembodied voice.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
A logical deduction is not speculation bro, there is no element of conjecture involved.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
I accept your concession.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
The ability to control/manipulate their power a la Force walking i.e. an effective means of dealing with a spirit.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Except Sidious can channel spirits. So what exactly puts Nox in Sidious' league?
"The spirits of Korriban are quite real, on one occasion they nearly killed me." (Darth Sidious)
In contrast, Darth Nox succeeded at binding several spirits to himself.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Appearing as a disembodied voice is not direct interaction, it is indirect, in none of those situations did Vitiate actually manifest before them and in fact his lack of appearance is pointed out several times.No he just did not appear before them, as you've proven by citing examples of what a direct manifestation looks like. You'll find its not the first time a spirit has manifested as a disembodied voice.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDCorrection. As Sel says there is no empirical proof Force light should be effective against Vitiate, but the logical proof I have provided is just as valid. Unless you're going to start claiming TK doesn't work on those we've never seen it used against before?
It is not 'proven' that Force light power works on [B]Vitiate. Get it?[/b]
Don't get mad because you can't disprove my argument. 👆
Their will be no concession from me in the absence of evidence of options that have been officially established to be effective against formless incarnation of Vitiate.Cry all you like but the fact is you have no leg to stand on. And you're inability to provide a counter argument is a concession in itself.
So according to you, Darth Sidious is a practitioner of Force Walking technique. If this is correct then what went wrong on Korriban?Key word being "nearly" - so looks like it turned out fine. Not that Nox has ever faced the spirit of a Dark Lord.FYI:
"The spirits of Korriban are quite real, on one occasion they nearly killed me." (Darth Sidious)
In contrast, Darth Nox succeeded at binding several spirits to himself.
So how the Strike Team is supposed to fight formless incarnation of Vitiate since he doesn't prefers to manifest himself like a person? Or maybe Vitiate is more complex then just being a typical spirit?Again assuming standard circumstances Vitiate would have manifested before them. And he'd likely have to if he wanted to bring the full extent of his powers to bear. If you don't like those rules make you're own thread.
Oh wait you did and it flopped 😂
Originally posted by Selenial
No, it's not proven that Force Light works on Vitiate via an actual feat, it's proven by all encompassing canon statements.You need to prove that Vitiate is somehow special enough to resist it, which you can't.
Vitiate is an extraordinarily powerful Force-user and is expected to have considerable defensive abilities.
So far, Vitiate have not been stopped with use of Force powers in any situation.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Correction. As Sel says there is no empirical proof Force light should be effective against Vitiate, but the logical proof I have provided is just as valid. Unless you're going to start claiming TK doesn't work on those we've never seen it used against before?Don't get mad because you can't disprove my argument. 👆
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Cry all you like but the fact is you have no leg to stand on. And you're inability to provide a counter argument is a concession in itself.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Key word being "nearly" - so looks like it turned out fine.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Not that Nox has ever faced the spirit of a Dark Lord.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Again assuming standard circumstances Vitiate would have manifested before them. And he'd likely have to if he wanted to bring the full extent of his powers to bear. If you don't like those rules make you're own thread.Oh wait you did and it flopped 😂
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDSo your saying that the combined powers of Yoda and Sidious isn't enough to overcome Vitiate? On what basis?
Logical proof? Provide an example in which a target as powerful and capable as Vitiate have been destroyed with use of the referred power.You cannot prove my stance wrong in this topic.
Turned out fine? Darth Sidious ended-up mortally wounded from the referred encounter and was revived in a bacta tank afterwards. He did not manage to bind any spirit to himself.Have you got a source for that?
Lord Ergast?Lord Ergast is not a Dark Lord of the Sith. 👆
Originally posted by Beniboybling
So your saying that the combined powers of Yoda and Sidious isn't enough to overcome Vitiate? On what basis?
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Have you got a source for that?
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Lord Ergast is not a Dark Lord of the Sith. 👆
Dark Lord of the Sith and Sith Lord are same titles or have same meaning.
Originally posted by S_W_LeGenDThis is a different line of argument entirely, instead it's the same one you've been clinging desperately to from the beginning.
Depends upon the assumptions of the contest. If Vitiate possesses a sentient host, the referred duo might be capable of defeating it in a confrontation. However, this contest assumes disembodied Vitiate and it is officially stated that he cannot be restrained or destroyed by conventional means in this condition. In addition, neither Yoda and nor Sheev have demonstrated the capability to tackle disembodied threats and/or even confirmed to have proficiency in techniques that grant them a chance towards this end. I am simply pointing out the fact that disembodied Vitiate is a threat to the entire galaxy and possesses the capability to consume/kill any sentient Force-user, even in large numbers.
Yoda and Palpatine have abilities that can tackle disembodied forms, they are proficient in these techniques and you've failed to provide a scrap of credible evidence that suggests they will not be effective against Vitiate nor that Palpatine and Yoda are not strong enough to defeat him.
You're boring me, find some proof to the contrary and come back when you have.
The Emperor's Pawns - Star Wars Gamer 5.Are you seriously telling me you don't know what a Dark Lord of the Sith is?Lord Ergast was a Sith Lord.
Dark Lord of the Sith and Sith Lord are same titles or have same meaning.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
This is a different line of argument entirely, instead it's the same one you've been clinging desperately to from the beginning.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Yoda and Palpatine have abilities that can tackle disembodied forms, they are proficient in these techniques and you've failed to provide a scrap of credible evidence that suggests they will not be effective against Vitiate nor that Palpatine and Yoda are not strong enough to defeat him.
1. Yoda is not officially confirmed to be a master of Force Light technique.
2. Sheev is not officially confirmed to be a master of Force Walking technique.
3. Force Light and Force Walking techniques are not officially established as options that are effective against a disembodied threat as powerful, capable, and dangerous as Vitiate.
Your concession is due.
Originally posted by Beniboybling
Are you seriously telling me you don't know what a Dark Lord of the Sith is?