Quoted, so you do not miss it:
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
This is BEFORE Apollo sunblasts them. When Apollo says he powered them up more quickly than they otherwise might have been.Your post does clarify it somewhat, though. Faora and Zod WEREN'T amped before Apollo blasted them, as they did not have the red transformation rays around them.
If you want true clarification, Dark, you need to go back to the original statement made by Carver.
Which is as follows:
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"She handled both Zod and Faora.
The second time she fought them, they were heavily amped by Apollo to the point that he shot a beam of sun light from the heavens that made both Faora and Zod light up like the sun itself. Before that, Wonder Woman was stomping them...to the point that Zod himself didn't deny that WW could kill him."
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This is actually quite accurate. The problem, however, is how a given reader treats the saga of these combatants.
Carver is taking the stance that Superman and Wonder Woman fought the Kryptonians in 2 overall battles.
In the first, Zod and Faora got the better of Superman until Wonder Woman showed up. Whereupon she began taking charge.
Until Superman, inexperienced in fighting at this point, motivated by who knows what, winds up squaring off against Zod and gets his arm broken, while Wonder Woman is shown fairly thoroughly beating Faora.
Zod calls a truce, which Wonder Woman agrees to. End of Battle 1.
In what Carver is considering the 2nd battle however, the heroes, aided by gifts from Hephaestus, give a first strike stealth assault. The villains respond and actually SEEM to get the upper hand after a reasonably lengthy engagement. We're told, in fact, by the Faora and Zod team, that the villains have landed on the heroes roughly a hundred times.
It's a "Gotcha" ruse, though.
Superman and Wonder Woman reveal Heph gave them a suit that returns the energy of strikers as a single, cumulative knockout flash.
That's the infamous Golgotha/Calvary/Crucifix/Cross scene. I really wonder who was in charge of shaping the scene that way.
At any rate, that counter temporarily knocks the Kryptonians out of the fight and into the drink.
Apollo says some debate-able things to Strife, then supercharges the Kryptonian villains by sending that MASSIVE sun-power bolt from Heaven/Olympus/whatever.
They stomp the heroes, arguably to a far greater degree than Superman did Apollo when HE was supercharged by Apollo.
End Battle 2.
Carver's opponent is undoubtedly treating the Heph-ruse portion of Battle 2 as some sort of counter to Battle 1.
It's not.
Wonder Woman handled Faora and Zod in Battle 1.
For the return engagement, taking hits was part of the hero team's STRATEGY. They expected the Heph-ruse to work and it did.
The only reason they got back in the fight was because Apollo did what he did. Carv gave a pretty accurate summation when he said what I quoted above.
True clarification can be taken from the ORIGINAL question, posed by me, which predates your 'original' statement.
Which is as follows. I've edited it a bit, so that the pertinent statements are made for your edification:
This was the response to my question, from carver:
Originally posted by carver9
Sigh...Apollo was feeding them power throughout the issue. He even tells us this. He then decided to just overload them with power so that they can stomp Superman and Wonder Woman.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I thought he only fed them power to get them up to 100%?
Originally posted by carver9
Nope. Never said. Zod was already powerful enough to stomp Martian Manhunter. He was powerful enough to break Superman arm effortlessly. What more do you need.
My question, using the same phrasing as carver, was referring to the same incident, that of the fight when Faora/Zod had been fed by Apollo. BEFORE the bolt of sunlight from the heavens.
Originally posted by DarkSaint85True clarification can be taken from the ORIGINAL question, posed by me, which predates your 'original' statement.
Which is as follows. I've edited it a bit, so that the pertinent statements are made for your edification:
This was the response to my question, from carver:
My question, using the same phrasing as carver, was referring to the same incident, that of the fight when Faora/Zod had been fed by Apollo. BEFORE the bolt of sunlight from the heavens.
Dark, your question came AFTER what I've quoted from Carver.
Check page 1 for yourself if you don't believe me.
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Dark, your question came AFTER what I've quoted from Carver.
Check page 1 for yourself if you don't believe me.
True, but the clarification question is, I feel, the starting point to the discussion. Especially as I asked a question that specifically questioned the timing of the amp.
In any case, your scans have been helpful. As per my original question, which was developed in response to a post by carver, Apollo was NOT amping them PRIOR to the Heph armour explosion. As evidenced by you, there is no glowy red energy surrounding them
AFTER the explosion, Apollo hits them with the sun bolt, and they emerge, amped - just like Superman did before when he first fought Apollo. But BEFORE that, they just looked normal. Apollo only fed them enough energy for them to be in tip top 100% condition.
Thanks 👆.
Originally posted by abhilegend
So Blue is still twisting facts now. See what happens when Superman is bound in her lasso.He just bitchslaps her and gets out of the lasso.
Even if she still has her strength/durability, since she can't attack with anything but the lasso, this makes it look like a lock for Superman against her.
Originally posted by Delta1938
Even if she still has her strength/durability, since she can't attack with anything but the lasso, this makes it look like a lock for Superman against her.
Be interested to know what supposed facts you think I'm twisting in this thread, Delta. You more than most should be able to confirm everything I've said before now regarding Apollo, Zod, and Faora with your own readings.
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Be interested to know what supposed facts you think I'm twisting in this thread, Delta. You more than most should be able to confirm everything I've said before now regarding Apollo, Zod, and Faora with your own readings.
😕 I'm saying you're twisting facts because I quoted Abhi?
Originally posted by Delta1938
Even if she still has her strength/durability, since she can't attack with anything but the lasso, this makes it look like a lock for Superman against her.
Is Riv of the mind that Diana merely tossing her lasso over someone ends a fight? The closest I've seen regarding a post-1985 Wonder Woman doing something like that was not actually Diana directly doing that but Green Arrow snaring Captain Marvel with her lasso and freeing Marvel from demon possession by asking Marvel the name of the wizard that gave him his powers. He replies Shazam, which causes the transformative bolt to strike and revert Marvel back into Billy Batson. The sudden shock also frees him of the possession. JLA/JSA Vice and Virtue.
Outside of that, nearly every win I know of Diana getting via Lasso takes the form of her success against Supergirl prior to Kara's heat flash, where she quickly tied the girl up, the form of the Artemis fight where she does exactly what you saw her do on the previous page or pages, or the following, which I trust will be horribly misconstrued but nonetheless commented on sufficiently enough to give readers a general sense of what is going on here:
Originally posted by carver9
Diana could beat Clark but under these conditions, it ain't happening.
Originally posted by bluewaterrider
Is Riv of the mind that Diana merely tossing her lasso over someone ends a fight? The closest I've seen regarding a post-1985 Wonder Woman doing something like that was not actually Diana directly doing that but Green Arrow snaring Captain Marvel with her lasso and freeing Marvel from demon possession by asking Marvel the name of the wizard that gave him his powers. He replies Shazam, which causes the transformative bolt to strike and revert Marvel back into Billy Batson. The sudden shock also frees him of the possession. JLA/JSA Vice and Virtue.Outside of that, nearly every win I know of Diana getting via Lasso takes the form of her success against Supergirl prior to Kara's heat flash, where she quickly tied the girl up, the form of the Artemis fight where she does exactly what you saw her do on the previous page or pages, or the following, which I trust will be horribly misconstrued but nonetheless commented on sufficiently enough to give readers a general sense of what is going on here:
But that's you in the nutshell.
Originally posted by Delta1938
I get the impression she has her strength/durability, but can only use the lasso, not strike or grapple, and Aquaman still has his strength/durability, but can only at least attack with telepathy(assuming Riv didn't mean Aquaman can only stand there, but can try to avoid attacks, but maybe he did mean Aquaman can only stand there and attack with telepathy).Riv, is that what you mean?
