Originally posted by AstnerGuts can swing his sword with the strength of a cannonball when in Berserker Armor, at the cost of a broken arm.
Guts got wrecked by Rosine. The only reason he managed to get the upper-hand and eventually kill her was because she's an idiot and decided to pick him up.Anyway Rosine like cannonballs travel at transsonic speeds, so Kenshin should've been able to cut her down at her top speed during her dive.
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Guts can swing his sword with the strength of a cannonball when in Berserker Armor, at the cost of a broken arm.
But even that's up for debate since there's no confirmation of this beyond Guts' quote "it felt like getting hit by a cannon."
But Kenshin still has comparable feats. Here he cuts down a lamp post and launches it into Kanryū's mansion.
If Guts fights for prolonged periods of time using the Berserk Armor he dies, and considering Kenshin's speed and stamina and ability to sense chi (life-force) it would not be in Guts' best interest to do so.
And if Guts does not use the Berserker Armor then his head is exposed in which case it comes down to speed.
Originally posted by AstnerI have a hard time believing that Kenshin can even significantly hurt Guts.
If Guts fights for prolonged periods of time using the Berserk Armor he dies, and considering Kenshin's speed and stamina and ability to sense chi (life-force) it would not be in Guts' best interest to do so.And if Guts does not use the Berserker Armor then his head is exposed in which case it comes down to speed.
Berserker Armor makes him stronger AND MUCH faster.
ON TOP OF THAT, Guts' Dragonslayer exists on an Astral plain due to all the blood it has bathed in.
Originally posted by Jmanghan
I have a hard time believing that Kenshin can even significantly hurt Guts.
Originally posted by Jmanghan
Berserker Armor makes him stronger AND MUCH faster.
Originally posted by Jmanghan
ON TOP OF THAT, Guts' Dragonslayer exists on an Astral plain due to all the blood it has bathed in.
Originally posted by AstnerWounding him and putting him down are two different things.
Then you're an idiot. Even regular crossbow bolts have wounded him.As far as the evidence is concerned, not even in the Berserker Armor does Guts have speed feats that compare to Kenshin's.
That's the explanation for why it can harm ethereal creatures like faeries and dragons. But it's a useless augmentation against a mortal like Kenshin.
Significantly hurting him to me, is borderline putting him down.
Guts, after being shot by a crossbow, and falling off a high cliff into water, forced to swim in heavy armor while carrying someone else, getting punched.
Forced to go into battle, he uses no effort in destroying the third best that Doldrey could offer, and then killing 100 men, by himself.
Not to mention, he was already in the middle of a war earlier, and still had to look after Casca.
PLUS, you forget that Guts is pronse to letting himself get injured just to get an advantage on his opponent. He nearly died trying to get a hit on Bazuso.
The Scenario, lets say Kenshin sees an opening on Guts, slashes him. Guts sees an opening, but realizes he'd have to get stabbed by Kenshin for it to work. Guts doesn't think twice about going through with it. Once Kenshin stabs Guts, all Guts really needs to do is *****-slap him, grab his sword, and break it in half (which he is more then capable of doing, btw).
Then, the only chance Kenshin has is running away, or getting beat senseless by Guts.
This is a guy who cut off his own arm to kill someone, even though that someone was infinitely more powerful then him.
Plus, you aren't even bringing up his arm cannon.
One more scenario.
Kenshin slashes Guts, or stabs him. All Guts needs to do is grab his arm, and shoot him in the face, and he's dead.
You could argue that Kenshin's stab or slash will be fatal, but Guts is not going to die from one slash/stab, its just not going to happen.
I will note that it was specifically said any of the juppongatana, even the weakest, can take 100 foes.
The Scenario, lets say Kenshin sees an opening on Guts, slashes him. Guts sees an opening, but realizes he'd have to get stabbed by Kenshin for it to work. Guts doesn't think twice about going through with it. Once Kenshin stabs Guts, all Guts really needs to do is *****-slap him, grab his sword, and break it in half (which he is more then capable of doing, btw).
That's assuming Kenshin is hit by the counterattack (he *can* tell if someone is looking to a counterattack), or even harder, grabbing his *sword*. Grabbing someone's arm or sword in combat is really, really hard. Just because Kenshin strikes doesn't mean Guts has anything like that kind of opening, Kenshin's not known for overextending himself.
And Kenshin's sword has stood up to a heck of a lot for that matter, but it's very very unlikely to come up.
Originally posted by Q99Guts sword will instantly break Kenshin's sword if he makes contact.
I will note that it was specifically said any of the juppongatana, even the weakest, can take 100 foes.That's assuming Kenshin is hit by the counterattack (he *can* tell if someone is looking to a counterattack), or even harder, grabbing his *sword*. Grabbing someone's arm or sword in combat is really, really hard. Just because Kenshin strikes doesn't mean Guts has anything like that kind of opening, Kenshin's not known for overextending himself.
And Kenshin's sword has stood up to a heck of a lot for that matter, but it's very very unlikely to come up.
Even Swords of equal strength gets broken against Guts' sword, a good example would be Zodd.
No one using a sword has ever had their weapon intact after fighting Guts.
It can destroy giant steel flails and axes like nothing.
Originally posted by Q99Thats because not many people have tried it.
I will note that it was specifically said any of the juppongatana, even the weakest, can take 100 foes.That's assuming Kenshin is hit by the counterattack (he *can* tell if someone is looking to a counterattack), or even harder, grabbing his *sword*. Grabbing someone's arm or sword in combat is really, really hard. Just because Kenshin strikes doesn't mean Guts has anything like that kind of opening, Kenshin's not known for overextending himself.
And Kenshin's sword has stood up to a heck of a lot for that matter, but it's very very unlikely to come up.
After stabbing him, he will have to remove his sword from Guts' body, there is NO way Guts won't take advantage of that moment.
Originally posted by Q99
Aside from speed, Kenshin is also extremely skilled at reading foe's intentions and movements.Strength wise, he's broken through metal armor, and his best move creates a small vacuum where it hits.
It's a tough call because they're two very different combatants.
Soujiro proves Kenshin's precog is emotion/intent based, though.
Could he read a mindless, feral animal in berserker armor?
Originally posted by cdtm
Yeah, but is an aggressive animal angry, in a way a ki sensor can read on?Guts Berserker armor acts more like a feral, bloodthirsty wolf then a man.
Yep. Detecting killing intent is the whole thing, feral and bloodthirsty is just more of it.
Emotionless is the way to hide, not broadcasting a ton.
He created a vortex capeable of pulling in a man strong enough to laugh off a shot to the head with the same force that shattered thick stone walls.
He did that in one slash, hes also so fast guys who can slash so fast they create blades of wind cant follow his movements.
He also ran through the hail of bullets from a gattling gun
Originally posted by Henry_Pym
He created a vortex capeable of pulling in a man strong enough to laugh off a shot to the head with the same force that shattered thick stone walls.He did that in one slash, hes also so fast guys who can slash so fast they create blades of wind cant follow his movements.
He also ran through the hail of bullets from a gattling gun
To be fair about the gattling gun, the older guns had terrible aim.
Plus, the operator wasn't a soldier, but a merchant, and Ken was keeping ahead of his aim (Vs was Kasumi Kenshiro did, clearly moving out of a bullets path mid flight.)
