Originally posted by dadudemon
No, the black author she quoted is saying what I say: the liberal coddling is - at least sometimes - not helpful, it is racist, and the actual way to improve their situation is through determination and self-improvement.
Originally posted by Bardock42
You also happen to be racist though.
Translation: "dadudemon, you're racist because you think it is racist to view black people as weak and helpless and that black people need the help of white people to be able to do anything."*
Excellent logic. Where do I sign up for the "bardock42 newsletter of logic"? Also, how frequent is this serialization? Once a week? Once a month?
*I can simplify this. It is racist to view any ethnicity as being helpless unless another ethnicity steps in: in whole or in part from either side.
Originally posted by Newjak
Which has always been represented in the minds of people who disagree as black people being told they are lazy.Regardless of what side you fall on the debate that has always been true for people that disagree. So it is a far cry from what the title of this thread presents as people's problems with her quote. It's not that she is quoting a black author that people are calling her racists for. It is the viewpoint of the author she is pushing.
So yes I believe people are not out of line to call her a potential racists for her quotes nor should be this much of an outrage that people are upset with her viewpoints.
Honestly, after rereading that post, you did state, "possible racist comments." That I can definitely agree with.
No matter how you slice it, your statement is logically correct: my apologies for contradicting you. They are possibly racist comments. She contends it wasn't racist and not intended as racist.
Originally posted by dadudemon
*I can simplify this. It is racist to view any ethnicity as being helpless unless another ethnicity steps in: in whole or in part from either side.
That's ridiculously blanketed. US Black slaves had no feasible way of freeing themselves, since they couldn't change legislature and physical force would have just ended with their deaths, so are we to call the slavery abolitionist of old "racist" because they saw this and forced a change? No, we are not
Originally posted by Robtard
That's ridiculously blanketed. US Black slaves had no feasible way of freeing themselves, since they couldn't change legislature and physical force would have just ended with their deaths, so are we to call the slavery abolitionist of old "racist" because they saw this and forced a change? No, we are not
You've Just Been McGill'd
Originally posted by Robtard
That's ridiculously blanketed. US Black slaves had no feasible way of freeing themselves, since they couldn't change legislature and physical force would have just ended with their deaths, so are we to call the slavery abolitionist of old "racist" because they saw this and forced a change? No, we are not
I'm pretty sure I didn't say, "enslaved ethnicity."
edit - just double checked my post. I didn't say that.
What are you talking about, again?
Originally posted by dadudemon
I'm pretty sure I didn't say, "enslaved ethnicity."edit - just double checked my post. I didn't say that.
What are you talking about, again?
The slavery example was well, an example. An ethnicity doesn't have to be enslaved to not be in a position of power, especially when their combined voice is in the minority. That.
*Or to simplify it: Black people's status as second class citizens in Jim Crow era USofA didn't end simply because black people wanted it, they were(are) the minority and needed part of the greater majority to make change happen.
Do we now assume that those people that saw this and helped were racist? No, we do not.
Originally posted by Robtard
The slavery example was well, an example. An ethnicity doesn't have to be enslaved to not be in a position of power, especially when their combined voice is in the minority. That.*Or to simplify it: Black people's status as second class citizens in Jim Crow era USofA didn't end simply because black people wanted it, they were(are) the minority and needed part of the greater majority to make change happen.
Do we now assume that those people that saw this and helped were racist? No, we do not.
Hey...you decided to inject an idea into my words that wasn't there. Not my fault. That's your fault. If you want to talk about an enslaved ethnicity, start a thread and talk about it there.
But that's not what we are talking about in here.
Originally posted by Robtard
*Or to simplify it: Black people's status as second class citizens in Jim Crow era USofA didn't end simply because black people wanted it, they were(are) the minority and needed part of the greater majority to make change happen.
Pretty sure a majority did not want that to go away at the time it went away.
What is exactly is your point, again? Because you have yet to actually discuss my actual point, much less contradict it with one of your made up points of debate. 🙂
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
It ok good buddy, Rob likes to interject imaginary words into other peoples posts to make himself feel better.
That's what people do in political debates: move the goalposts, inject red herrings, or use strawman arguments.
I'm just a little surprised Rob would do something like that.
I used an example to show that some people simply can't help themselves and affect change alone, especially when they're in a position of no or even little power, that's not doing what you're claiming
Pretty sure I said "needed part of the greater majority" and not 'needed the majority'. Yep, I did.
You're being rather defensive and trollish again and I didn't even point out your racism, I simply addressed the silliness of your blanket statement. Oh well.
Originally posted by Omega Vision
It's like quoting a self-hating Jew to confirm anti-Semitic beliefs.
Just clear one thing up: you feel saying this is like a self hating jew being quoted by an anti-semite? You genuinely feel such a comparison is apt? That the black guy is a self hating black man, you think that, right? You think he is that Dave Chappelle skit come to life, except this time he knows full well he is black?
Or were you just bringing up some kind of example of a self hater, even though this instance really doesn't seem to be like a black guy who hates blacks and got quoted by an evil white racist. Or again, do you legitimately feel this guy is a self hater?
Originally posted by SurturHis post is the latter.
Just clear one thing up: you feel saying this is like a self hating jew being quoted by an anti-semite? You genuinely feel such a comparison is apt? That the black guy is a self hating black man, you think that, right? You think he is that Dave Chappelle skit come to life, except this time he knows full well he is black?Or were you just bringing up some kind of example of a self hater, even though this instance really doesn't seem to be like a black guy who hates blacks and got quoted by an evil white racist. Or again, do you legitimately feel this guy is a self hater?
What he believes about the author is different and I can not speak on.
Still I think the general saying that black people need to stop being lazy and do something is way too simplistic a view on this topic. I also see it used more as a catalyst to dismiss any real discussion on this complex topic.
For instance if someone say that there is more to the issues than black people shaping up and handling there business and people automatically come at you with "Obviously you're racist because you believe black people need help and are inept without the white man." And this leads to very circular arguments that get us no where.
I've already started to see this surface in this thread.
But for moment let's be serious.
There needs to be an effort by everyone involved in this topic because it is incredibly complex and we need to have serious talks about what is going on here.
For instance we see that black neighborhoods tend to be poorer. In the justice system we see that a black suspect is more likely to be shot by the cops than any other race. They are more likely to receive stricter punishments or jail time than their white counterparts for similar crimes. A study was done showing that having a black sounding name on your resume can hut your chances of even getting an interview.
This stuff at least points to the possibility of racial issues in our culture.
And it's something we have to look at in a manner that is actually helpful. For instance based on history we know there can be huge issues stemming from minorities being abused by majority groups that can span decades of recovery. We know that idea of being treated as a second class citizens can have enormous impacts on the average self image for a minority group. We've seen in it Native Americans and other slave groups throughout history.
We've seen how majority groups can vastly effect minorities even indirectly at times. So when stuff like these types of arguments do come off as racists to me because it tries to pass of any potential blame for yourself by painting another group in a bad light in a simplistic view.
It doesn't seem like anyone was passing any blame, rather just saying there is blood on everyone's hands and white racism isn't the only problem.
I don't see what she did and go "she must hate blacks". Nobody calls anybody lazy, or puts 100% of the blame on anyone. Nor did it say racism isn't a problem.
Originally posted by Robtard
I used an example to show that some people simply can't help themselves and affect change alone, especially when they're in a position of no or even little power, that's not doing what you're claiming
Originally posted by dadudemon
But that's not what we are talking about in here.
Originally posted by Robtard
Pretty sure I said "needed part of the greater majority" and not 'needed the majority'. Yep, I did.
K. So you missed the point. Your idea just does't work. It will take a small minority that just has the power to affect change like you're discussing. If you knew this, you'd not say "greater majority", instead, you'd say "very small but powerful minority."
Originally posted by Robtard
You're being rather defensive and trollish again and I didn't even point out your racism, I simply addressed the silliness of your blanket statement. Oh well.
It wasn't even close to silly. You're taking a shit on all the efforts black heroes have made to liberate and help the black community rise to where they are today (and, don't kid yourself, it wasn't white people that helped them reach that state, it was white people reacting to the efforts, please, begging, and hard work of those black people: black people helped black people become free and become liberated, for the most part. It wasn't a "white only" effort). Sure, more work needs to be done but don't pretend that black people need white people to change their current position for the better. They really don't. And it is racist to think they do.
Originally posted by Raisen
Everything is racist. We should all just wear robes covering our entire body so we can distinguish one from another.
I heard some guys tried that with white robes back in the day but it didn't turn out so well
lol
We should only interact with faceless, genderless, avatars. And all speech is handled by the computer and everyone gets a gender-neutral sounding voice from the program.
And we all look like a cube and all cubes are the same size.
I wonder how the world would be able to handle that? 99% of all the things people b*tch about would disappear. We'd be left with silly things to argue about such as grammar.
Originally posted by dadudemon
lolWe should only interact with faceless, genderless, avatars. And all speech is handled by the computer and everyone gets a gender-neutral sounding voice from the program.
And we all look like a cube and all cubes are the same size.
I wonder how the world would be able to handle that? 99% of all the things people b*tch about would disappear. We'd be left with silly things to argue about such as grammar.
Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Who the hell are you to tell someone if they are racist or not? Last time I checked you are one of the biggest racists, and anti-women people here.You basically think women can't do anything on their own and have to be coddled like children.
Bardock is the complete opposite. He's like the biggest SJW Feminazi in this board.