Originally posted by Galan007
Majestic is at a strength disadvantage. Thor is at a speed disadvantage... mmm
Yep and the difference in their strengths isn't huge, while the difference in speed is vast. Though is Thor really physically stronger then someone who can easily move around planets? I realize his hammer adds some oomph to his hits, but if we're talking pure physical strength...
You can't really say "I don't want to engage in a flame war" after you've already engaged in a flame war.
It's like those couple of bash-fueled responses you always get after a mod comes in and tells people to stop bashing. They always pretend like they didn't see the mod's post, instead of just manning up and saying "I needed to have the last word, so I totally ignored your request!!" Lol.
Originally posted by Surtur
Yep and the difference in their strengths isn't huge, while the difference in speed is vast. Though is Thor really physically stronger then someone who can easily move around planets? I realize his hammer adds some oomph to his hits, but if we're talking pure physical strength...
Originally posted by SurturIn this thread, Thor is in full Warrior Madness(a 10x amp), AND has the Belt of Strength(and additional 2x amp.) IOW, his strength is amped by a factor of 20x, while Majestic's abilities aren't amped at all--he's just packing the Kusar Blades here, which are standard equipment anyway. Lol.
Yep and the difference in their strengths isn't huge, while the difference in speed is vast. Though is Thor really physically stronger then someone who can easily move around planets? I realize his hammer adds some oomph to his hits, but if we're talking pure physical strength...
Originally posted by Horrificus
Thor was able to keep up with Mongoose for years and he is a confirmed "super speedster", even if he was kept at Spiderman level. His speed was a large part of his powerset.
But you realize Majestic is far far faster then someone who merely has speed to rival Spiderman? There have also been occasions where Thor flat out was too slow to even tag Mongoose.
Originally posted by Surturi understand that. Im just saying that Thor is a character that will always be classified, with others, that can be as fast, or as strong as he, (or the writers), decides to be.
But you realize Majestic is far far faster then someone who merely has speed to rival Spiderman? There have also been occasions where Thor flat out was too slow to even tag Mongoose.
Is that a pain in the a$$ in a debate? For people debating FOR him and AGAINST. Hell yes!! But, this is the way it is.
Slow showings should be no more damning for Thor, than they are for any other character. All characters with "super speed" have showings where they where tagged by slower characters, or were engaged in slugfests with slower characters, where their uber-speed was not in play.
If it has ever been stated by narration, a writer, the character, or shown throw on-panel feats, it's not exactly logical to simply erase it. Unless there is equal evidencen printed SPECIFICALLY to negate previous depictions.
The only way out of this dilema would seem to be either some formula that weighs all this information and pumps out an agreed upon statistic, or, an enforced board rule that simply states that character X is hereby classified as one or the other.
But, as things r now, it gets boring watching as members argue over which information can, or cannot be used.
And, tbh, in reality, anything with a mind and a personality will sometimes use all available abilities and characteristics, and sometimes ignore them. Especially if ego and confidence are involved.
Personally, i never saw any problem believing that characters as powerful as Hulk, Superman, Thor, etc, might largely ignore their own super-enhanced speed abilities, since they r so confident in their durability, strength and special attacks.
That is, unless they see that there is a specific need to use that speed.
Just my big, smart, handsome opinion. 😄
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Thor has absolutely top end showings that make him look like a speedster. It's the reason top end opponents that are considered speedsters themselves will never overwhelm him. He just doesn't go around speed blitzing everyone. That's not his thing.
Like when? The speedsters don't use their full speed on him.
When they do like the alternate Gladiator did, they can contend with him even if he is amped nearly Infinitely in speed.
By your reasoning Captain America is a Speedster as well since he doesn't gets overwhelmed by speedsters and has actually been said to be nearly as fast as Quicksilver.
Imagine Thor with all his powers all of a sudden using superspeed on a more regular basis. It would be a boring book.
For that he needs to have superspeed.
I'd rather have him the way he is anytime speed is concerned. I don't mind the occasional spidey or wolvie showings, because in the end they have absolutely no chance to beat him.
Majestros isn't spidey.
You talk as if a speed vs speed bz is time consuming. Heck it's not even a battle bz where you have to plan and set up strategies. It's as easy as posting feats. Well the ball's in your court.
Like I said earlier I'm not interested. It's a waste of time.
Just to say that for this thread, I gave Thor the warrior madness and BOS to give him a fighting chance for this battle, to me Maj's strenght alone was already so far above a regular Thor that I felt this would put Thor in range of his strength class, not guaranteed that a Thor 20x stronger than usual is still going to make him stronger than Maj, if so than at least not by much.
Originally posted by lawest9**** this post
Just to say that for this thread, I gave Thor the warrior madness and BOS to give him a fighting chance for this battle, to me Maj's strenght alone was already so far above a regular Thor that I felt this would put Thor in range of his strength class, not guaranteed that a Thor 20x stronger than usual is still going to make him stronger than Maj, if so than at least not by much.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Like when? The speedsters don't use their full speed on him.When they do like the alternate Gladiator did, they can contend with him even if he is amped nearly Infinitely in speed.
By your reasoning Captain America is a Speedster as well since he doesn't gets overwhelmed by speedsters and has actually been said to be nearly as fast as Quicksilver.
For that he needs to have superspeed.
Majestros isn't spidey.
Like I said earlier I'm not interested. It's a waste of time.
Originally posted by lawest9
Just to say that for this thread, I gave Thor the warrior madness and BOS to give him a fighting chance for this battle, to me Maj's strenght alone was already so far above a regular Thor that I felt this would put Thor in range of his strength class, not guaranteed that a Thor 20x stronger than usual is still going to make him stronger than Maj, if so than at least not by much.
Originally posted by Horrificus
i understand that. Im just saying that Thor is a character that will always be classified, with others, that can be as fast, or as strong as he, (or the writers), decides to be.Is that a pain in the a$$ in a debate? For people debating FOR him and AGAINST. Hell yes!! But, this is the way it is.
Slow showings should be no more damning for Thor, than they are for any other character. All characters with "super speed" have showings where they where tagged by slower characters, or were engaged in slugfests with slower characters, where their uber-speed was not in play.
You are correct a lot of characters with super speed have low showings. But with Thor and Mongoose their confrontation was specifically commenting on their speed. Superman and Flash have been tagged a lot, but then they also have a huge amount of speed feats to fall back on.
If it has ever been stated by narration, a writer, the character, or shown throw on-panel feats, it's not exactly logical to simply erase it. Unless there is equal evidencen printed SPECIFICALLY to negate previous depictions.
Nothing is being erased. Thor just needs speed on a consistent level as opposed to a handful of feats stretched out over several decades.
The only way out of this dilema would seem to be either some formula that weighs all this information and pumps out an agreed upon statistic, or, an enforced board rule that simply states that character X is hereby classified as one or the other.
Or characters just use the powers they have repeatedly displayed.
And, tbh, in reality, anything with a mind and a personality will sometimes use all available abilities and characteristics, and sometimes ignore them. Especially if ego and confidence are involved.Personally, i never saw any problem believing that characters as powerful as Hulk, Superman, Thor, etc, might largely ignore their own super-enhanced speed abilities, since they r so confident in their durability, strength and special attacks.
But this kind of logic can only take us so far. Yes, characters can be arrogant, etc. They have egos and all that stuff. But very few characters have such an ego that they would willingly allow themselves to be beaten unconscious(or beaten to death) when they have a way to prevent it.
It's like if you have super speed and you go to fight me and you don't use it because you are arrogant. If I begin repeatedly punching you and inflicting damage to you...well, wouldn't you then think "maybe it's a good idea to use my speed" ? Or would you just allow me to beat you unconscious even though you have a way to easily prevent it? I assume there would come a point where you do not want to keep getting hit and eventually you'd use your speed to avoid the things that are hurting you.
When you remove all reasons for not using a power like the plot you are left with either this person is genuinely not smart enough to use their powers or they for some reason enjoy getting physically beat.
Majestic never seemed like the type who would enjoy getting wailed on with a magical hammer and we certainly know he's not stupid.
Originally posted by Surtur
You are correct a lot of characters with super speed have low showings. But with Thor and Mongoose their confrontation was specifically commenting on their speed. Superman and Flash have been tagged a lot, but then they also have a huge amount of speed feats to fall back on.Nothing is being erased. Thor just needs speed on a consistent level as opposed to a handful of feats stretched out over several decades.
Or characters just use the powers they have repeatedly displayed.
But this kind of logic can only take us so far. Yes, characters can be arrogant, etc. They have egos and all that stuff. But very few characters have such an ego that they would willingly allow themselves to be beaten unconscious(or beaten to death) when they have a way to prevent it.
It's like if you have super speed and you go to fight me and you don't use it because you are arrogant. If I begin repeatedly punching you and inflicting damage to you...well, wouldn't you then think "maybe it's a good idea to use my speed" ? Or would you just allow me to beat you unconscious even though you have a way to easily prevent it? I assume there would come a point where you do not want to keep getting hit and eventually you'd use your speed to avoid the things that are hurting you.
When you remove all reasons for not using a power like the plot you are left with either this person is genuinely not smart enough to use their powers or they for some reason enjoy getting physically beat.
Majestic never seemed like the type who would enjoy getting wailed on with a magical hammer and we certainly know he's not stupid.
Originally posted by Surtur
You are correct a lot of characters with super speed have low showings. But with Thor and Mongoose their confrontation was specifically commenting on their speed. Superman and Flash have been tagged a lot, but then they also have a huge amount of speed feats to fall back on.
Thor also has a ton of feats to fall back on and much more statements about his great speed than instances of low showings. For every one of those, he probably has a dozen good.
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Thor was holding back vs Mongoose in their first encounter and pretty much owned him when he stopped messing around..
Uh, that's just plain out of context. Thor wasn't holding back his speed there.
Even Spidey danced around Mongoose in the very same issue.
In their second encounter, he was deep into his weakened state due to Loki. Mongoose also had attacked him with gasses that made him dazed and disoriented. So....
How about Spider-Man blitzing the shit out of Masterson who had the power and body of Thor? Under the same writer.
Thor also has a ton of feats to fall back on and much more statements about his great speed than instances of low showings. For every one of those, he probably has a dozen good.
Like? Show me a showing where he is faster than Captain America.
Much less Spider-Man.
vin
Originally posted by abhilegend
Uh, that's just plain out of context. Thor wasn't holding back his speed there.Even Spidey danced around Mongoose in the very same issue.
How about Spider-Man blitzing the shit out of Masterson who had the power and body of Thor? Under the same writer.
Like? Show me a showing where he is faster than Captain America.
Much less Spider-Man.
vin
Yes. Spidey dodged him once and got gassed pelleted.
He doesn't need to have a showing vs Cap to be considered fast.
He has dealt with characters on a regular basis far faster and more powerful than Cap. You have to be smarter than this bro.
And Spidey's speed is really nothing to him when he gets serious.
All this talk and yet you refuse to back it up.