Darth Nyriss vs. Galen Marek

Ah, thanks for the correction then.

Tbh now that I think of it, while Galen did get more powerful as each fight went against the Jedi. Kota's the only one who actually had 0 help in fighting him and only lost due to fatigue.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
You misunderstand my point. I never said the Council was end, be all in power --- I'm only using them as the measuring tool, because Vader did.

Secondly, where is the evidence Kota improved to where it would render Vader opinion would be absolutely moot? He was a rather pathetic drunk in the first game, if anything, that would have actually stifled his abilities rather than prove.

There's no evidence that he improved since The Clone Wars other than the fact it's blatantly obvious, since Kota never appeared in that era. Vader's last accurate measuring stick of his abilities is TCW, so his opinion is outdated.

The thing is, you're comparing Vader's analysis to the Clone Wars council, as if it is an accurate "measuring tool" to determine Kota's current abilities. Hell, even then, Vader's pretty much right, since a Council Member who underwent the same 18 year growth period shows herself to be Kota's blatant superior...

I'm sure spending months of attacking Imperial targets, which is what Kota said to lure out Vader, had some growth on him too.

Originally posted by Selenial
Again, since when does that make feats invalid.

Like I said, no one claims Vitiate can't dominate people with TP just because that was only brought in as a huge plot point. No one claims Sidious isn't a good duelist just because he was designed to appear unbeatable in the films.

Intention is irrelevant.

With what grunts did Marek struggle? I recall one Shadow Guard giving him a problem on Bespin, but that's about it.

Doesn't help that TFU's novels suck ass, so I only read it once.

Out of interest where exactly does Vader say Kota is nothing compared to the Council? Because Zoltan is right in saying that Vader deliberately talks shit quite a lot in the novel.

I recall Vader mentioning that Kota is an old man or some shit compared to Shaak Ti.

I may have to scan through that cancer that is TFU again, to verify - but I believe it was after Galen defeated him, and he scolded Marek for being cocky. By telling him Kota isn't anything special compared to a Council member bit.

Yeah, he says something like "All you've done is take out an old man and an outcast. Now it's time for a true challenge, a member of the Jedi Council..." or some such.

Yeah he calls him a tired old man, but he also downplays Paratus in the same sentence, who he previously said was "far more powerful" than Marek and that he didn't expect him to survive. In the game and novel he's constantly downplaying Marek's abilities and achievements by twisting the truth, which is why I question his reliability as a source.

And for the record, the exact text:

"Master, I am ready now."

"You have defeated a tired old man and an outcast." Anger cracked like a whip in Darth Vader's vocoderized voice. "You will not be ready to face the Emperor until you have faced a true Jedi Master."

The apprentice squared his jaw, thinking of the pathetic imitations he had faced in the junk Temple. "Who?"

"Master Shaak Ti-one of the last of the Jedi Council." Then was a grudging respect in his Master's voice, mixed with naked contempt.

Yeah, I think it's pretty obvious that Vader is trying to poke holes in his apprentice's confidence.

Yeah, though again I'm puzzled by this double standard of treating some aspects of the novel as accurate, but others as not.

It's akin to claiming the New Testament is all made up because there's this part in the Bible where some guy says Jesus is a fraud. 😬

Hmm..I can concede on the Kota part then. As I said, it's been 4 years since I've read the book, so my memory on it isn't excatly 100%.

I still don't think TFU feats shoukd be taken at face-value, however.