When does an ability not become standard and when is it?

Ok so example, Precog is standard among Force Users. Every Force User has it, so it's a general ability.

Ok so then take...let's say..ok Battle Meditation, that's not a standard ability to every Force User.

So now...when does a Force Ability not become a standard one and when is it a standard?

Like Force Barrier, this has been shown doable by Force Users of varying degrees, so would this then be a standard ability for all Force Users to do?

We have named characters as Padawans perform feats and do abilities, but would these abilities be able to be performed by fully trained standard Jedi Knights and Masters...provided said ability isn't noted as exclusive to them or isn't so far out there that it would be logically impossible?

So where is the cut off when abilities stop being standard to every Force User and when is it logically doable?

I hope I put this question right.

If its a basic ability commonly taught to everyone then its standard. If its something only specialised Jedi/Sith get taught or you need to seek other sources to learn then it isn't.

Originally posted by Nephthys
If its a basic ability commonly taught to everyone then its standard. If its something only specialised Jedi/Sith get taught or you need to seek other sources to learn then it isn't.

Right, but how would you know if it's commonly taught or not? If it's not said or written?

Normal abilities are usually outlined in sourcebooks and other supplementary materials.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Normal abilities are usually outlined in sourcebooks and other supplementary materials.

Outlined in what way?

What is usually showed in named characters, and randoms alike.

TK, basic TP, precog, etc are all basic capabilities, that can be found in every single Jedi/Sith to a certain extent.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
What is usually showed in named characters, and randoms alike.

TK, basic TP, precog, etc are all basic capabilities, that can be found in every single Jedi/Sith to a certain extent.

So would then Force Lighting be a standard one, seeing as there's showings of pretty much every Dark Force User using Lighting to some extent?

I guess you can say that, yeah. Though, they are quite a few advanced dark siders (Ventress, Maul) who haven't exhibited the power, despite knowing other esoteric abilities.

In new canon, Force Lightning is reserved for the Sithiest of Sith

Ventress knows how to raise the dead but not force lightning. Stupid :/

George Lucas cheapened Force Lightning by granting Count Dooku this ability in Episode II. This power should have been reserved for greatest among the Sith. However, Episode II made this power mainstream.

Palpatine's Force Lightning had a genuine shock-value. It was a representation of the magnitude of his immersion in the Dark Side. It also brought Luke Skywalker to his knees. We had an Emperor who was a master of esoteric powers of the Dark Side, powers that would catch Jedi off-guard. Even the guy who beat Darth Vader, had no counter for such powers. Perfect.

Dooku's canonically one of the most powerful Force users in history. This whole "Dooku's Lightning is weak" or just "Dooku is weak" propaganda is utterly laughable. He's supposed to be one of the most powerful, learned and masterful Force users ever. That's why Lucas gave him Lightning.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Dooku's canonically one of the most powerful Force users in history. This whole "Dooku's Lightning is weak" or just "Dooku is weak" propaganda is utterly laughable. He's supposed to be one of the most powerful, learned and masterful Force users ever. That's why Lucas gave him Lightning.

This is what you said.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
George Lucas cheapened Force Lightning by granting Count Dooku this ability in Episode II. This power should have been reserved for greatest among the Sith. However, Episode II made this power mainstream.

Palpatine's Force Lightning had a genuine shock-value. It was a representation of the magnitude of his immersion in the Dark Side. Luke Skywalker's lack of answer for it was terrifying as well. We had an Emperor who was a master of esoteric powers of the Dark Side, powers that made Jedi helpless.

And it's wrong. Dooku's "one of the greatest among the Sith", and his Lightning had "genuine shock value". Maul didn't use it in Episode 1. He was intended as a formidable martial artist, not a master of the arcane arts of the dark side. Dooku was to be different from him - and the Lightning showed that. Anakin's lack of answer for it was reminiscent of Luke's lack of an answer for it in RotJ. By the same token, Yoda's ability to repel it was a symbol of his own Force mastery.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Dooku's canonically one of the most powerful Force users in history. This whole "Dooku's Lightning is weak" or just "Dooku is weak" propaganda is utterly laughable. He's supposed to be one of the most powerful, learned and masterful Force users ever. That's why Lucas gave him Lightning.

Yes, but only if being the "greatest" or "most powerful" of a Galaxy-wide 20,000 year old organisation is far too undefined to really mean anything. With the numbers we're talking about, there are literally hundreds that could be mentioned in such a fashion. I mean... you could even wank Coleman Trebor based off such accolades.

It doesn't matter what your interpretation of the quote is. Of all characters shown in history, Dooku's probably in the top two dozen.

That, and various other attributions and displays of his Force mastery, qualifies as sufficient to learn the likes of Force Lightning.

Originally posted by SunRazer
And it's wrong. Dooku's "one of the greatest among the Sith", and his Lightning had "genuine shock value". Maul didn't use it in Episode 1. He was intended as a formidable martial artist, not a master of the arcane arts of the dark side. Dooku was to be different from him - and the Lightning showed that. Anakin's lack of answer for it was reminiscent of Luke's lack of an answer for it in RotJ.

Obi-Wan Kenobi effortlessly blocked it with a Lightsaber by the way. When I saw this for the first time, I was like rolling my eyes.

Two characters:

1. Count Dooku
2. Obi-Wan

- cheapened Force Lightning. And George Lucas is responsible for this shit.

Episode 6 promoted Force Lightning as a terrifying power, something that was reserved for the likes of Emperor. Episode 2 cheapened it and made it mainstream.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Count Dooku being "one of the greatest among the Sith" is supposed to impress me now? As another member pointed out, you can wank a large number of characters in this manner.

Obi-Wan Kenobi effortlessly blocked it with a Lightsaber.

Two characters:

1. Count Dooku
2. Obi-Wan

- cheapened Force Lightning.

The lightsaber thing is actually a decent point, but your first point is an utter double standard. You just said that only "one of the greatest among the Sith" can use Lightning. I said that Dooku fits that criteria. And your reply is "how is that supposed to impress me?" By fitting the criteria that you set?

Originally posted by SunRazer
The lightsaber thing is actually a decent point, but your first point is an utter double standard. You just said that only "one of the greatest among the Sith" can use Lightning. I said that Dooku fits that criteria. And your reply is "how is that supposed to impress me?" By fitting the criteria that you set?

My point is that Count Dooku was not in the league of the Emperor. He shouldn't be able to do what the Emperor could. Force Lightning would have been a decent differentiating factor among the two.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Please stop accusing me of double-standards. Keep this discussion free from petty insults and taunts.

Exposing a logical fallacy is a petty insult or a taunt now? Do you even know what a double-standard is?

My point is that Count Dooku was not in the league of the Emperor. He shouldn't be able to do what the Emperor could. Force Lightning would have been a decent differentiating factor among the two.

No, your point was that only the best of the Sith should be able to use Lightning (you just attempted to change the goal posts again). And Dooku is among the best of the Sith. Hence, he should be able to use Lightning.

That's all there is to it. I don't know why you're trying to cry over split milk - I already accepted your lightsaber point as a valid one. This one's been debunked. Just move on.