Originally posted by cs_zoltan
"Shown"? Probably. But Cade is vastly superior to Nihl and Talon who repeatedly KO'd or OHK'd High Council level Jedi before their prime, so I doubt he couldn't replicate it.
Playing the scaling game with Kyp Durron isn't exactly a smart thing to do. We're talking about someone who was "vastly" more powerful than guys who can one-shot AT-ST's with via Force pushes with moderate difficulty, or summon hurricane force winds. I really don't see a way for one to argue for Cade being more powerful, or even share adjacent parity with Durron.
Originally posted by cs_zoltan
I don't dismiss them, but potential is as irrelevant as it comes if he didn't achieve it. Kyp didn't.
No, the argument is that it's reasonable to predict that he did achieve it because of his demonstrated learning speed and years of experience. It's just powerscaling, which is a perfectly justifiable manner of analyzing a combatant. We do it all the time.
It doesn't hurt that this powerscaling just happens to justify Kyp Durron's black hole feat as being the work of a titanic Force wielder (rather than just the product of "concentration"😉 and his other monstrous telekinetic demonstrations.
It matters, because Kyp clearly can't actualize that power in a combative scenario. It might be news to you, but force users can't always bring their full power to bear in a duel. Kyp never demonstrated he could.That's why he's < Jaina.
Kyp could win a "who can lift the bigger rock" contest, but that's not what we are discussing.
Dude, lots of his most notable Force shenanigans in the NJO series were done in the middle of combat. His freighter manipulation was done while he was dogfighting in his starfighter.
First of all I was talking about air pressure, you could've guessed from the context, but it seems you rather just attack my intelligence. Good for you.Anyhow everything you just said is a big pile of crap 👆
And yes gravity matters, it's a force which against you have to act when you TK something.
And as I was twice saying, if Kyp accelerated the ship at more than 1 g, he would have applied more force than someone just lifting it steadily on Earth's surface would anyway.
Air resistance matters, it slows things down in case you didn't know that.
At the speeds Cade was tossing the shuttle, air resistance is negligible relative to the force Kyp was exerting on the freighter.
It's even noted in the text how it was easier:
Now he reached out with the Force and took hold of the dead freighter.It shot forward with astonishing ease, moving steadily through the vacuum of space toward the shielded coral-skipper.
Or it means Kyp's Force reserves were deeper than he had guessed. 👆
And as for your fanon on how much Kyp accelerated it to hit coralskipper I'd like you to prove it, since he actually needed help from a squad of x-wings to herd the ship so he can hit it:The lieutenant spun off in a tight turn, his two surviving pilots following closely. They darted around the big coralskipper, cutting off its retreat, taking and returning fire from the other enemy skips. Their daring maneuvers soon exacted a price-lan's ship got caught in a Yuuzhan Vong crossfire. The double blast of plasma proved too much for his shields, and the ship dissolved in a bright splatter of plasma and superheated metal.
The pilots Lan had commanded doggedly held the course he'd plotted. The XJs continued to harry the big skip, forcing it to keep up its stuttering shields as the dead freighter closed in. At the last moment, the surviving X-wings shot away toward safety.
The freighter never got close.
Because the, like < 0.5 m/s^2 acceleration we'd need for Kyp's feat to require less force than moving a far smaller shuttle in a 1 g gravitational field would be about as sensible or plausible of a projectile weapon as someone trying to shoot down fighter jets with slingshots. At that point it would have less momentum than the proton torpedos mounted on the X-wings anyway, let alone their actual payloads.
Luke wasn't part of the Order, nice try tho.
It was a nice try indeed, since it succeeded; Luke had already rejoined the Order. 😆
1. Irrelevant.
2. All of them with concentration and in space.
3. Actually every feat other than the Black Hole one Cade exceeds. By quite a bit.
2. So show me all the Cade+ tier people who have done something on that scale "with concentration". Or do you think a feat requiring concentration automatically negates it, no matter how impressive it is? Is Yoda taking on Sidious not an impressive feat because he had to concentrate to do so? Concentration is a factor, but, as I pointed out, it isn't grounds to dismiss everything you don't like.
3. No, tossing a shuttle is not the same thing as tossing a freighter.