Camille Paglia and Christina Hoff Sommers Demolish Modern Feminism

Interesting video:

YouTube video

Source:

https://heatst.com/culture-wars/camille-paglia-and-christina-hoff-sommers-demolish-modern-feminism-part-i/

CHS: .... I was criticizing the feminist theories at the American Philosophical Association, and what they were writing at the time was just warmed-over Marxism, with so much animist to American society, to men, to art, to beauty. And it seemed to me that it wouldn’t take long for it to correct itself. But it was never corrected. And what happened is you and I, we did, I believe won the argument: the journalists agreed with us and the court of public opinion was on our side. THEY won all the assistant professorships, they just quietly worked. They didn’t care about criticism because all criticism is by definition backlash.

...

CHS: Absolutely! And in our interviews 21 years ago, you mentioned, this sort of Kremlin-esque feeling in feminism; this Kremlin-like environment with so much censorship, ex-communication and so forth. Students today don’t realize that there had been this purge of anyone who was a dissident. I happened to have tenure when I started criticizing it, but it would be career-diminishing or career-annihilating to criticize feminism. Even more so today.

American SJW doublespeak is not modern feminism.

Originally posted by krisblaze
American SJW doublespeak is not modern feminism.

Eh, a lot of popular feminists do pull stuff like this. Or well I guess you are correct, but I would also add that there are a whole lot of popular feminists that actually aren't true feminists. Since obviously you can't truly believe we live in a rape culture, etc. and be a true feminist.

Originally posted by Stigma
Interesting video:

YouTube video

Source:

https://heatst.com/culture-wars/camille-paglia-and-christina-hoff-sommers-demolish-modern-feminism-part-i/

Great post.

Originally posted by Surtur
Eh, a lot of popular feminists do pull stuff like this. Or well I guess you are correct, but I would also add that there are a whole lot of popular feminists that actually aren't true feminists. Since obviously you can't truly believe we live in a rape culture, etc. and be a true feminist.

Sommers is in academia, so you would assume that her arguments should be aimed at modern feminism as it is understood in academia, i.e. butler or ueno.

Granted, this SJW-madness might be more pronounced at certain universities than I am accustomed to, but stuff like rape culture seems to be more of a campus myth than something which has an academic canon.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Sommers is in academia, so you would assume that her arguments should be aimed at modern feminism as it is understood in academia, i.e. butler or ueno.

Granted, this SJW-madness might be more pronounced at certain universities than I am accustomed to, but stuff like rape culture seems to be more of a campus myth than something which has an academic canon.

Dude, even Obama cited false statistics hinting at a rape culture. Still think it's just campus myth when the president opens his mouth and spews the same shit? He did the same for the wage gap lol.

Originally posted by Surtur
Dude, even Obama cited false statistics hinting at a rape culture. Still think it's just campus myth when the president opens his mouth and spews the same shit? He did the same for the wage gap lol.

Yeah....might be worse than I assumed.

I don't have much first hand experience outside a dozen or so american students I know.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Yeah....might be worse than I assumed.

I don't have much first hand experience outside a dozen or so american students I know.

For example he cited the "1 in 5" statistic, that 1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted. The problem is..the study counted things like an unwanted kiss, groping, and drunken sex as "sexual assault". No I don't mean "someone is black out drunk" kind of sex, because that would make sense. No, it was just any sex that took place if the woman was drunk.

The wage gap is the same. Men *earn* more. There is a difference between earnings and wages, but this is never specified when people cite it.

The earning myth is perpetuated by politicians here as well.

Completely void of context.

Well the name of this person says it all lol.

Originally posted by Surtur
For example he cited the "1 in 5" statistic, that 1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted. The problem is..the study counted things like an unwanted kiss, groping, and drunken sex as "sexual assault". No I don't mean "someone is black out drunk" kind of sex, because that would make sense. No, it was just any sex that took place if the woman was drunk.

The wage gap is the same. Men *earn* more. There is a difference between earnings and wages, but this is never specified when people cite it.

One in five sounds a bit low imo

Originally posted by Sin I AM
One in five sounds a bit low imo

Maybe. Depends..I consider any unwanted sexual act an assault. I think statistics in the Army was like one in 3 which made sense considering the culture. I don't see college as being that far off

Lol except college is that far off. Way far off. Christina Hoff Sommers herself used data to figure out the number for women on college campuses? Know what it is? Like..1 in 45 lol. That is for RAPE though.

Just to note: you're less likely to be raped on a college campus.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Maybe. Depends..I consider any unwanted sexual act an assault. I think statistics in the Army was like one in 3 which made sense considering the culture. I don't see college as being that far off

This would mean you'd consider a dude slapping your ass sexual assault. Not to say that is right, but sexual assault?

Originally posted by Surtur
Lol except college is that far off. Way far off. Christina Hoff Sommers herself used data to figure out the number for women on college campuses? Know what it is? Like..1 in 45 lol. That is for RAPE though.

Just to note: you're less likely to be raped on a college campus.

I've been thru college sporadically. Classes here and there. Plus I was an adult (over 24) so I didn't experience the culture like I did the military where sleeping with a drunk chick was considered cool. The little I did experience of college was a post adolescent drunk fest so I can see sone stats being high. Besides alot of rapes aren't reported so there's that.

Originally posted by Surtur
This would mean you'd consider a dude slapping your ass sexual assault. Not to say that is right, but sexual assault?

Yea if it was unwanted. Would you consider a dude grabbing your dick sexuAL assault? What about if someone slipped a finger in your ass, I mean it's just a finger. Not sure if serious.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
I've been thru college sporadically. Classes here and there. Plus I was an adult (over 24) so I didn't experience the culture like I did the military where sleeping with a drunk chick was considered cool. The little I did experience of college was a post adolescent drunk fest so I can see sone stats being high. Besides alot of rapes aren't reported so there's that.

Ok, but out of the reported rape, it's not anywhere near the numbers people claim, including the president.

Yea if it was unwanted. Would you consider a dude grabbing your dick sexuAL assault? What about if someone slipped a finger in your ass, I mean it's just a finger. Not sure if serious.

Jeez lady you sure like to take things up a notch. We went from ass slapping, which can be done quickly in passing..to shoving a finger up someone's ass. Which would involve the removal of clothing, etc.

By your definition, an unwanted hug would be sexual assault to.

Originally posted by Surtur
Ok, but out of the reported rape, it's not anywhere near the numbers people claim, including the president.

Jeez lady you sure like to take things up a notch. We went from ass slapping, which can be done quickly in passing..to shoving a finger up someone's ass. Which would involve the removal of clothing, etc.

By your definition, an unwanted hug would be sexual assault to.

Stats aren't an exact science. I personally know of two separate occasions of rape that didn't get reported. Shit happens ALOT.

I really didn't though. U asked if I considered a slap on the ass assault. ..which is equivalent to someone grabbing a guys dick. A finger up the ass is equivalent to someone grabbing a thigh and accidentally slipping one in. It's a violation period. But let's switch this up

So u said a hug right? So your walking down the street. Heading to the store. You come across a guy you vaguely remember. He says your name..you say hey and out of nowhere he hugs you. Not too long not too short but he's hugging you. Scratch that sceneraio..Ok let's say you're in a job interview doing pretry good I mean you're nailing it. But before you leave you're new boss gives u a hug. U tense up a bit but he assures you by placing his hand in the small of your back and saying good game.

Scratch that let's try this...you're a kid. And you're minding your own business plating mind craft on your portable gaming device. Some person walks up and tries to hug you...you don't want the hug never asked for the hug but they do.

All those instances are assault luv.

Originally posted by Surtur
Eh, a lot of popular feminists do pull stuff like this. Or well I guess you are correct, but I would also add that there are a whole lot of popular feminists that actually aren't true feminists. Since obviously you can't truly believe we live in a rape culture, etc. and be a true feminist.

Is that the same as you can't be a true Muslim unless you're cutting off infidels heads?

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Stats aren't an exact science. I personally know of two separate occasions of rape that didn't get reported. Shit happens ALOT.

I really didn't though. U asked if I considered a slap on the ass assault. ..which is equivalent to someone grabbing a guys dick. A finger up the ass is equivalent to someone grabbing a thigh and accidentally slipping one in. It's a violation period. But let's switch this up

So u said a hug right? So your walking down the street. Heading to the store. You come across a guy you vaguely remember. He says your name..you say hey and out of nowhere he hugs you. Not too long not too short but he's hugging you. Scratch that sceneraio..Ok let's say you're in a job interview doing pretry good I mean you're nailing it. But before you leave you're new boss gives u a hug. U tense up a bit but he assures you by placing his hand in the small of your back and saying good game.

Scratch that let's try this...you're a kid. And you're minding your own business plating mind craft on your portable gaming device. Some person walks up and tries to hug you...you don't want the hug never asked for the hug but they do.

All those instances are assault luv.