Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Agree. 👆One drawback about using LoSH characters (and scans) are the reboots.
Still, like someone posted, rule of thumb is they dont lose/gain anything version to version unless specifically shown to (like White to Black Witch definitely gained).
That would be like using Pre-FLASHPOINT and Post-FLASHPOINT Superman interchangeably.
Originally posted by Pillow Biter
In theory, Ultra Boy could win using speed. He's faster than Orion.In practice, he loses consistently.
What're that Ultra Boy's speed feats? Although Orion hardly uses his speed, him and Darkseid were fighting at super speed in Orion's series, and Darkseid had moved too fast for Byrne-era Superman to see.
Originally posted by Stoic
Orion has UB's ticket when it comes to straight battle which is why he'd win, but KK did train him. IMHO, anyone that thinks Orion would come out without taking some sort of heavy damage aren't taking that into consideration.
Where'd that happen? Only thing I've seen for any Ultra Boy training was Pre-CRISIS using pressure points and TIMBER WOLF citing he taught him them.
That would be like using Pre-FLASHPOINT and Post-FLASHPOINT Superman interchangeably.
Originally posted by Stoic
Orion would take his licks right up until he realized that UB was shifting his powers, and then he'd begin pushing him back. UB could wiin though, so this isn't going to be a stomp. I'd give Orion 7/10 for the win, but he's going to work for it.
KK was showing him how to fine tune his powers. He showed him an example of how to apply pressure by simply smacking the base of a mountain which caused an avalanche. I think that it was a couple of months back that me and Zack had a chat about the feat, which included UB undergoing training from KK. Like I said, he'd still lose, but Orion would take quite a bi of heat before putting him down. UB's super speed rivals Superman, as does his strength, and durability not to mention his Legion ring would allow him to last for a while. What I'm saying is that at optimal condition UB isn't exactly a weakling, not top tier, but pretty darn close. DC IMO failed at fleshing out UB, because he's a pretty decent character.
Originally posted by riv6672
If you say so.
I didnt make up what i told you, i'm just going by precedent here.The power switch argument is never really an issue. I refer you to the scan i posted. WW is superior to Orion, and he took two shots from her, caught a third, and gave her one in return, with no switch problems.
Yeah which was due to KK training him to use his power's without thinking but going with the flow. My thoughts on it, or how I took it, was that KK thought that UB would be much better at using his powers if he simply thought of combat as going with the flow. Sounds simplistic I know, but that was his main problem in combat, he took too long to switch the tools that he had on hand, which resulted in placing him in danger when things became extreme. I don't think Wonder Woman would take Orion for a majority though. Not when we take all of their abilities into consideration. Diana isn't a poor distance fighter, but even with her equipment she isn't as effective as Orion. At least on paper.
Originally posted by riv6672
If you say so.
I didnt make up what i told you, i'm just going by precedent here.
Well, that doesn't make it correct.
Originally posted by riv6672
The power switch argument is never really an issue. I refer you to the scan i posted. WW is superior to Orion, and he took two shots from her, caught a third, and gave her one in return, with no switch problems.
No, Orion is superior to Wonder Woman.
Originally posted by Stoic
KK was showing him how to fine tune his powers. He showed him an example of how to apply pressure by simply smacking the base of a mountain which caused an avalanche. I think that it was a couple of months back that me and Zack had a chat about the feat, which included UB undergoing training from KK. Like I said, he'd still lose, but Orion would take quite a bi of heat before putting him down. UB's super speed rivals Superman, as does his strength, and durability not to mention his Legion ring would allow him to last for a while. What I'm saying is that at optimal condition UB isn't exactly a weakling, not top tier, but pretty darn close. DC IMO failed at fleshing out UB, because he's a pretty decent character.
Are you talking about Threeboot Ultra Boy and Karate Kid? That wouldn't apply to Post-ZERO HOUR Ultra Boy(or Pre-CRISIS/Post-IC).
Originally posted by Zack M
3Boot Ultra Boy is weak.
Originally posted by riv6672
-gasp-
Compared to the other two, I'd have to agree. What I've read, I felt the Threeboot LofSH was the weakest incarnation overall.
Well, that doesn't make it correct.
Compared to the other two, I'd have to agree. What I've read, I felt the Threeboot LofSH was the weakest incarnation overall.