Originally posted by RealityWarper
Too much ways for Kenshiro to one-shot Vector and none for him.Vector can't touch Kenshiro using Muso Tensei by the way.
No limit fallacy when Vectors abilities have worked against things that are not tangible.
No way for Kenshiro to get past his highly specialized telekinesis.
Well unless you are one of those types who thinks Kenshiro can defeat Luke Cage, Spiderman, Iron Fist, Thing, Ares with his axe, Hercules, the Savage Hulk, WW Hulk, the Flash, and Superman at the same time.
Originally posted by random letters
It seems to be the consensus that Kenshiro would absolutely stomp on Wolverine. So how would he do against other hand-to-hand fighters in Marvel?Kenshiro is fully healed after each fight
1. Luke Cage
2. Spiderman
3. Iron Fist
4. Thing
5. Ares with axe
6. Immortal Hercules
7. Savage HulkFeel free to change the order.
Originally posted by random letters
After looking at some FotNS manga again, I realize that I completely forgot how ridiculously powerful Kenshiro gets by about halfway through the series.So adding:
8. WW Hulk
9. Flash
10. Superman (no flight or heat vision)
Originally posted by RealityWarper
Kenshiro can take everyone in this gauntlet at the same time from 1 to 10 and still win with ease.
Ah yes.
Fan-fiction.
Originally posted by Sharivan
[B]No limit fallacy when Vectors abilities have worked against things that are not tangible.
That's not a "no limit fallacy".
The point of the Muso Tensei is to become "one with nothing".
There is no correlation with "intangibility" like you are trying to undermine it.
Kenshiro can just use Muso Tensei and go through Vector's TK power.
That's how it works.
No way for Kenshiro to get past his highly specialized telekinesis.
Kenshiro's own aura is more powerful than Vector's telekinesis which is limited to 10 times his own weight
Well unless you are one of those types who thinks Kenshiro can defeat Luke Cage, Spiderman, Iron Fist, Thing, Ares with his axe, Hercules, the Savage Hulk, WW Hulk, the Flash, and Superman at the same time.
Unrelated to the topic and makes you looks like a bozo.
Ah yes.Fan-fiction.
Rofl.
Don't worry, I will reply in the other thread asap.
You will learn a lot of things. 😉
Originally posted by RealityWarper
That's not a "no limit fallacy".
The point of the Muso Tensei is to become "one with nothing".
There is no correlation with "intangibility" like you are trying to undermine it.
Kenshiro can just use Muso Tensei and go through Vector's TK power.
That's how it works.
Prove that Musou Tensei has worked against something such as Vector's telekinesis, and that it can't be countered by something that can influence intangibles. I want you to prove that it can work against every kind of thing in fiction. I want you to prove this no limit fallacy with actual instances instead of any empty claims.
Which you can't.
Kenshiro's own aura is more powerful than Vector's telekinesis which is limited to 10 times his own weight
We're talking about the same Vector that could give the Hulk trouble, and rip the skin off of his body? The same Vector who could potentially push a planet out of its orbit? The same Vector who has fought way worse than Kenshiro?
Unrelated to the topic and makes you looks like a bozo.
I wasn't the one who claimed Kenshiro can defeat Luke Cage, Spiderman, Iron Fist, Thing, Ares with his axe, Hercules, the Savage Hulk, WW Hulk, the Flash, and Superman at the same time with ease.
That's you.
So, you're the bozo there.
Rofl.Don't worry, I will reply in the other thread asap.
You will learn a lot of things. 😉
It's better off if you don't.
I have better things to be dealing with than the inanity of someone's husbando worship. If you seriously reply with thirty posts of keyboard vomit I am not going to waste my time.
Though I might just reply back with a hundred posts in order to ruin your day. You really want a hundred posts of scans and context it will take you months to not form a proper counter argument against?
Originally posted by Sharivan
Prove that Musou Tensei has worked against something such as Vector's telekinesis, and that it can't be countered by something that can influence intangibles.
1)
The point of the Muso Tensei is that there is "nothing" to affect.
That's not intangibility as you believe it is.
Your first premise is false.
2)
Vector doesn't have the ability to affect intangible as his power is to repel matter which by definition is tangible and comes in 3 forms: solid, liquid or gazeous.
I'm certain at this point that you don't even have basic scientific notions.
Your second premise is false.
I want you to prove that it can work against every kind of thing in fiction.
I don't have to prove it as that's not my claim in the first place.
I don't need to defend myself against a claim I've never made.
I want you to prove this no limit fallacy with actual instances instead of any empty claims.
Go away with your strawman.
Which you can't.
Because I don't have to.
We're talking about the same Vector that could give the Hulk trouble, and rip the skin off of his body?
It doesn't change the fact that his power to repel the matter is limited to affect (throw) the equivalent of Vector's ten times own weight which is extremely weak compared to Kenshiro's own telekinesis.
Kenshiro was able to push upward a waterfall and to throw giant boulders of severals tons during his fight against Han.
That several magnitudes above Vector's weak telekinesis.
The same Vector who could potentially push a planet out of its orbit?
Scan of Vector repeling a planet out of it's orbit or that's just another empty hyperbolic figure of speech that you are using as a proof.
The same Vector who has fought way worse than Kenshiro?
Stop with your loaded question.
You wasn't able to post a single valuable argument so far.
I wasn't the one who claimed Kenshiro can defeat Luke Cage, Spiderman, Iron Fist, Thing, Ares with his axe, Hercules, the Savage Hulk, WW Hulk, the Flash, and Superman at the same time with ease.
Out-of-topic.
You are trying to discredit me in this thread for a claim I did in another thread which is completely useless.
It doesn't make your arguments in this thread stronger.
Well, in fact your arguments are completely unsound.
That's you.So, you're the bozo there.
Yeah sure.
You are using hyperbolic statements as arguments in threads rofl.
It's better off if you don't.
I will answer, no problem.
You will love my answer 😉
I have better things to be dealing with than the inanity of someone's husbando worship.
That sounds like the answer coming from a little kid so I guess that the "better things" you have to do is to go to school.
If you seriously reply with thirty posts of keyboard vomit I am not going to waste my time.
Yeah yeah.
I mean, who needs to read your empty posts full of unsupported claims after all.
Though I might just reply back with a hundred posts in order to ruin your day.
Yeah. Waste your time this way.
I don't need one hundred posts to tear your claims aparts.
There is no obligation for me to make more replies to have better arguments.
You really want a hundred posts of scans and context it will take you months to not form a proper counter argument against?
You prove everytime that you don't understand the context.
Post one hundred times. No problem.
I don't even have to post against your pseudo-argumentory as 100 % of your out-of-context claims are worth ignoring.
Originally posted by RealityWarper
1)
The point of the Muso Tensei is that there is "nothing" to affect.That's not intangibility as you believe it is.
Your first premise is false.
That's no different than in the case of ghosts. There is "nothing" to hit there either but there are characters that can anyway.
It's intangibility and nothing more. A state of mind that allows him to pass through objects, and disrupt them.
That's it.
2)
Vector doesn't have the ability to affect intangible as his power is to repel matter which by definition is tangible and comes in 3 forms: solid, liquid or gazeous.
It has worked against various energies, and even freaking sorcery. You're making up things again, and trying to establish limitations that aren't actually there in the story.
I'm certain at this point that you don't even have basic scientific notions.Your second premise is false.
This coming from the guy who thinks an average man's palm is 0.5 square feet, and can't even use online calculators properly?
I don't have to prove it as that's not my claim in the first place.I don't need to defend myself against a claim I've never made.
In the last thread you literally claimed that only Musou Tensei can defeat Musou Tensei, and nothing else in any fictional media can do it.
Don't try to back-peddle out of your egregious claims.
Go away with your strawman.[?QUOTE]It's not a straw man.
Show me Musou Tensei working against anything that's as powerful as Vector's telekinesis.
[QUOTE]Because I don't have to.
Yes, you have to. You're making claims, and it's your job to back them up.
It doesn't change the fact that his power to repel the matter is limited to affect (throw) the equivalent of Vector's ten times own weight which is extremely weak compared to Kenshiro's own telekinesis.
No, it's not. As I already noted unless you can explain how only ten times Vector's body weight is enough to grievously hurt the Hulk, and tear the skin off of his body?
You're seriously not understanding how powerful Vector's telekinesis is.
Kenshiro was able to push upward a waterfall and to throw giant boulders of severals tons during his fight against Han.That several magnitudes above Vector's weak telekinesis.
Show me Kenshiro contending with someone that can lift billions of tons, and being able to push them back so hard that all their skin tears off.
This is some weaksauce right here. It's positively nothing compared to what Vector has done.
Scan of Vector repeling a planet out of it's orbit or that's just another empty hyperbolic figure of speech that you are using as a proof.
You mean just like how you're claiming Kenshiro's musou tensei makes him completely resistant to any form of anti-intangibility?
It's not an empty figure of speech when we see what Vector has done to the Hulk and individuals like him.
Stop with your loaded question.
How is that a loaded question? You're apparently some sort of omniscient deity when it it comes to comic books. You should have known about those instances anyway.
You wasn't able to post a single valuable argument so far.
You can't even speak proper english now? Well, I should have expected that already...
Out-of-topic.
No, it isn't.
It happened recently, and it shows that you have a bias in regards to Kenshiro. Which is important. As we're arguing about him right now.
You are trying to discredit me in this thread for a claim I did in another thread which is completely useless.
No, it isn't.
That thread shows A) your apparent bias for Kenshiro B) your willingness to dismiss showings in lieu of databooks and C) your double standards when that's involved.
It doesn't make your arguments in this thread stronger.
Neither does it make any of your positively ridiculous claims that Vector can only push ten times his own body weight any more sensible.
Nor your subjective opinion that Daniel Rand is only peak human, and only when he uses chi at that.
Well, in fact your arguments are completely unsound.
You're getting this backwards again. You're the one without any sound arguments here. That don't involve your obsession with Kenshiro.
Yeah sure.You are using hyperbolic statements as arguments in threads rofl.
Microsecond, and 0.03 seconds are not hyperbolic. They're specific timeframes. Just as a hundred megatons is a specific yield.
I will answer, no problem.You will love my answer 😉
No, it will be the same keyboard vomit as usual.
The same confirmation bias, and the same trite.
That sounds like the answer coming from a little kid so I guess that the "better things" you have to do is to go to school.
No, it's answer coming from somebody who has better things to do than spending an entire day replying to someone who keeps on churning out the same rhetoric ad nauseam.
Yeah yeah.I mean, who needs to read your empty posts full of unsupported claims after all.
That's funny, and ignoring all the scans and context I provided which you explicitly ignored in our previous arguments.
Yeah. Waste your time this way.I don't need one hundred posts to tear your claims aparts.
There is no obligation for me to make more replies to have better arguments.
You have an obligation to actually address my points instead of ignoring them or simply conceding. Instead of picking up an argument days later because you just hate it when you "lose." As if these arguments were about "winning" to begin with,
You prove everytime that you don't understand the context.
Nope, I don't do that. I understand it I just don't try to nitpick every insignificant detail. Nor do I rely on out of context confirmation biases. That's what you do with databooks.
Post one hundred times. No problem.
If I find the time, and I feel like taking apart your arguments again. When they already carry no weight.
I don't even have to post against your pseudo-argumentory as 100 % of your out-of-context claims are worth ignoring.
Those would be your claims that ignore part of the context, and fixate on one part instead of building a whole picture out of all of the context.
Originally posted by Sharivan
[B]That's no different than in the case of ghosts.
Wrong.
If you are refering to Vapor, she is an human whom can change into a Gazeous state which is MATTER in a gazeous state, so once again your claim is empty.
There is "nothing" to hit there either but there are characters that can anyway.
Where is your argument exactly ?
It's intangibility and nothing more.
Nope.
It's being one with nothingness.
A state of mind that allows him to pass through objects, and disrupt them.
That's a very gross summary as an atempt to lowball the character.
There is no matter disruption as some misinformed people are pretending in the internet.
It has worked against various energies, and even freaking sorcery.
I'm still searching for your argument here again.
You're making up things again, and trying to establish limitations that aren't actually there in the story.
I don't give limitations.
They exist.
This coming from the guy who thinks an average man's palm is 0.5 square feet, and can't even use online calculators properly?
Another worthless attempt at discrediting me instead of attacking my claim just because you are incapable to back-up anything.
I will answer to that in the proper thread anyway, as diverting from the topic at hand seems to be one of your common "debating tactics".
In the last thread you literally claimed that only Musou Tensei can defeat Musou Tensei,
That's the entire point in Hokuto No Ken and in the "Kenshiro Gauntlet" he was involved in.
and nothing else in any fictional media can do it.
I've NEVER made this claim so go away with your strawman.
Don't try to back-peddle out of your egregious claims.
Rofl.
Please show the post where I said that "nothing in media can do it". ROFL
You are so desperate that you are making a strawman once more because you have like zero arguments opposing my claims.
Yes, you have to. You're making claims, and it's your job to back them up.
Vector can just exert a TK-force on matter, and if there is nothing to affect his power is completely useless.
No, it's not. As I already noted unless you can explain how only ten times
It's in the OHOTMU which is an official source of information for Marvel as used by the writers, authors and editors.
Vector's body weight is enough to grievously hurt the Hulk, and tear the skin off of his body?
You're seriously not understanding how powerful Vector's telekinesis is.
He is taking out several layers of skin in long seconds as showed by the long text in the bubbles.
Once more you are not understanding what you are reading.
Show me Kenshiro contending with someone that can lift billions of tons, and being able to push them back so hard that all their skin tears off.
Your reasoning is ludicrous.
A) In order to lift some stuff, Hulk need to physically exert the force of his limbs on it and he needs stay grounded to do it.
B) In the scan that you used without understanding it (one more time XD), Hulk advance is only slowed down, not stopped.
C) The pain and the damage resulting to his skin slowed his advance.
D) Vector's feats in telekinesis are weak.
This is some weaksauce right here. It's positively nothing compared to what Vector has done.
If you had actually read and understood the stories involving Vector you should that your statement is, once more, pulled out-of-your ass.
You mean just like how you're claiming Kenshiro's musou tensei makes him completely resistant to any form of anti-intangibility?
You are paraphrasing and you are attacking a strawman once again as I've never said anything this way.
You are self-debating your own fan-made claims at this point, amusing.
It's not an empty figure of speech when we see what Vector has done to the Hulk and individuals like him.
Vector has no feats on par with Kenshiro in terms of telekinesis.
How is that a loaded question? You're apparently some sort of omniscient deity when it it comes to comic books. You should have known about those instances anyway.
I'm still waiting for you to back-up your claims which you never did so far.
You can't even speak proper english now? Well, I should have expected that already...
Coming from a guy incapable to understand two lines of speech in a comic book.
Hilarious.
No, it isn't.It happened recently, and it shows that you have a bias in regards to Kenshiro. Which is important. As we're arguing about him right now.
No, it isn't.
That thread shows A) your apparent bias for Kenshiro B) your willingness to dismiss showings in lieu of databooks and C) your double standards when that's involved.
Neither does it make any of your positively ridiculous claims that Vector can only push ten times his own body weight any more sensible.
Nor your subjective opinion that Daniel Rand is only peak human, and only when he uses chi at that.
So, instead of responding to all of your bullshit I will educate you and yes I skipped the last part of your worthless post.
The OHOTMU is a canon and official source of information for the Marvel Universe that the writers and editors use.
Vector and the U-Foes made several appearances in the Hulk's comics including the 400:
The story was written by Peter David and edited by Bobbie chase:
The editor, Bobbie Chase, answered to the question of the readers in the Hulk #400:
In the second page, Bobbie mention the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe as a canon source of information:
Here we go with the post in close-up:
"Brian, THE OFFICIAL HANDBOOK OF THE MARVEL UNIVERSE says the Hulk is Superhuman Class 100+. Which means he can lift at least 100 tons."
Hilariously, Kenshiro lifted easily a 300 tons rock which would put him in the Superhuman Class 300+ at the very least...
I meant that at that point you are literally handwaving MARVEL'S FREAKING POINT OF VIEW ABOUT HIS OWN CHARACTERS.
Here we go with Vector's profile:
Vector's power is to telekinetically propel MATTER away from himself.
He is limited at ten times the weight he can lift and he has a normal strenght for his age...
And Danny Rand is a frggin' peak human only when he summons his Chi.
Have a good day. XD