They weren't decoys themselves, but they weren't "the best of the best" because they were guarding a look-alike.
Victory through stamina is still victory, and I imagine a tired Krayt's defenses are something Obi can get through. Remember, he is one of the top Ataru masters of the time and can use his defense for offense.
Originally posted by MythLordHow do you figure? The point of a decoy is to make everything look real, otherwise the enemies see through the ruse easily. There is nothing to suggest the imperial knights were random knights as opposed to the personal guard.
They weren't decoys themselves, but they weren't "the best of the best" because they were guarding a look-alike.
Victory through stamina is still victory, and I imagine a tired Krayt's defenses are something Obi can get through. Remember, he is one of the top Ataru masters of the time and can use his defense for offense.While this may be true, i would still give the edge to someone who has an extra decade to achieve mastery.
Originally posted by MythLordNo but if youre using a decoy you're more likely to use the personal guards because at best, they can take down krayt and at worst, they and the decoy die.
1. Like they knew the very specific guards that guarded the Emperor? They were just Knights, placed to guard a decoy. The best of the best would've likely been guarding the real Fel.
2. That mastery so far not being presented as on Kenobi's level.that's incredibly speculative. Losing to kenobi after a hard battle and then having over a century of mastering various aspects indicate these to be more than sufficient conditions to take out kenobi.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
No but if youre using a decoy you're more likely to use the personal guards because at best, they can take down krayt and at worst, they and the decoy die.
Not really. The best of the best would've been reserved for the actual Emperor. So Krayt is essentially blitzing Jedi Knight, perhaps somewhat above, level combatants... Really, nothing outside Anakin's capabilities, and Kenobi's performed pretty damn well.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
that's incredibly speculative. Losing to kenobi after a hard battle and then having over a century of mastering various aspects indicate these to be more than sufficient conditions to take out kenobi.
The fight was hard only because Kenobi started going all-out towards the end, where he stomped him, and Hett having a terrain advantage; as well cheapshotting Obi at one point.
Not really. The best of the best would've been reserved for the actual Emperor. So Krayt is essentially blitzing Jedi Knight, perhaps somewhat above, level combatants... Really, nothing outside Anakin's capabilities, and Kenobi's performed pretty damn well.
The fight was hard only because Kenobi started going all-out towards the end, where he stomped him, and Hett having a terrain advantage; as well cheapshotting Obi at one point.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
You're not understanding. They're not going to put the Emperor in jeapardy. The next best plan is to attach his personal guard to a decoy to make everything look official, and either kill Krayt or die trying while the Emperor lives.
That hardly means they'd use the legitimate guard of the Emperor, however. If it's a simple decoy or look-a-like, they'll just place moderately decent guys to guard him, take down Krayt if they're lucky, or die if they're unlucky and either way the Emperor is safe.
But the Emperor's best is still reserved to guard him.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
He didn't stomp him, from the scans the fight appeared difficult the entire time. But again if you want to use that kind of context then I'll use the context to excuse Anakin's loss to Obiwan. The point remains if he can defeat Hett with moderate difficulty, then Hett would have the advantage of 100+ more years of experience and mastery.
I'm referring to the description of the fight in: Life and Legend of Obi-Wan Kenobi where Kenobi engages Hett and is holding back until the very end, by then he remembers Luke and dismembers Hett.
Taking into account more favourable circumstances for A'Sharad and Kenobi besting him with "moderate difficulty", plus him going on to kill fodder and learn new Dark Side tricks, doesn't spell victory for him, in any way, tbh.
"I completed training as both Jedi and Sith. I honed my skills in the Clone Wars and I've killed thousands of opponents since then."
"Krayt perfected his combat techniques over many decades and his skills with telekinesis and Sith lightning far outstripped those of any Sith of his era."
--Star Wars Insider #113
Originally posted by cs_zoltan
"I completed training as both Jedi and Sith. I honed my skills in the Clone Wars and I've killed thousands of opponents since then.""Krayt perfected his combat techniques over many decades and his skills with telekinesis and Sith lightning far outstripped those of any Sith of his era."
--Star Wars Insider #113
Perfect, I was looking for that. It's nice that most of you have these insider quotes still.. Definitely makes the argument in favor of Krayt here.
That hardly means they'd use the legitimate guard of the Emperor, however. If it's a simple decoy or look-a-like, they'll just place moderately decent guys to guard him, take down Krayt if they're lucky, or die if they're unlucky and either way the Emperor is safe.
I'm referring to the description of the fight in: Life and Legend of Obi-Wan Kenobi where Kenobi engages Hett and is holding back until the very end, by then he remembers Luke and dismembers Hett.
Taking into account more favourable circumstances for A'Sharad and Kenobi besting him with "moderate difficulty", plus him going on to kill fodder and learn new Dark Side tricks, doesn't spell victory for him, in any way, tbh.
Originally posted by cs_zoltan
He spent most of that 100+ years in stasis tho.
I don't think most of the time but yea a good portion of the time. I didn't mean to insinuate that he studied those 100+ years, just that he had 100+ years to study. Even you lowball it to 20 years, which still feels low, it should be enough time.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
I'll need to find the scans to see if there's anything in there.See the insider quote above. 100+ years to hone his skills is MORE than enough time to take down Obiwan, if not most proficient saber combatants.
Alright.
And I saw the quote. He had 100+ years to hone his skills, only he honed said skills against fodder and was napping most of said time... So the skill disparity between Hett and Vong Krayt shouldn't be vast.
Originally posted by MythLord
Alright.And I saw the quote. He had 100+ years to hone his skills, only he honed said skills against fodder and was napping most of said time... So the skill disparity between Hett and Vong Krayt shouldn't be vast.
There's nothing to indicate that he was napping most of the time, nor that he fought fodder. Even if I were to grant you both of these conditions, and I'm not, a decade, two, or three increases the disparity, not to mention the increase in his force abilities are bound to help his lightsaber skills. He's got too much time and opportunity going for him to even be on the same level as Obiwan anymore.
Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Skill progression is not linear though. That's why it's called a learning curve. After a certain level you can't really get much more skilled.Kenobi is at such level. Dooku for example has 45 years on him, yet is barely more skilled. Same with Mace and Yoda.
It's not linear obviously, it has diminishing returns. But a younger Hett having an extra 20-40 years would more than likely grant him superior saber abilities. And again, saber abilities do increase with the increase in force abilities so while you have diminishing returns, it's very unclear as to what point you're back at 0.
On the other hand, why should skill progression differ greatly from force progression? Someone can become infinitely more power with more and more force knowledge stretching lifetimes (Vitiate). The diminishing returns are hard to reconcile there, if there are any at all.
Originally posted by MS Warehouse
There's nothing to indicate that he was napping most of the time, nor that he fought fodder. Even if I were to grant you both of these conditions, and I'm not, a decade, two, or three increases the disparity, not to mention the increase in his force abilities are bound to help his lightsaber skills. He's got too much time and opportunity going for him to even be on the same level as Obiwan anymore.
Yeah, he was. Most of the time was in Stasis. And who of note -- besides Abeloth, which wasn't even a lightsaber duel, but more a Force fight -- did Krayt actually beat, of note, in a lightsaber duel during this period of time?
Nobody. Just fodder Vong and such mooks. Hardly of any worth. And skill progression, like Zoltan noted, is not linear. You reach a certain level of technical skill and mastery and that's your ceiling, after that you just work your Force powers and physicals to try and expand upon further as a combatant.
Krayt's mastery of the lightsaber was clearly not even rivalling a post-prime Kenobi's while he was a Jedi. So him learning new Dark Side tricks, dwelling into Sith lore, then killing fodder doesn't suggest a vast enough increase to go from losing pretty damn considerably to winning.
Yeah, he was. Most of the time was in Stasis. And who of note -- besides Abeloth, which wasn't even a lightsaber duel, but more a Force fight -- did Krayt actually beat, of note, in a lightsaber duel during this period of time?
Nobody. Just fodder Vong and such mooks. Hardly of any worth. And skill progression, like Zoltan noted, is not linear. You reach a certain level of technical skill and mastery and that's your ceiling, after that you just work your Force powers and physicals to try and expand upon further as a combatant.
Krayt's mastery of the lightsaber was clearly not even rivalling a post-prime Kenobi's while he was a Jedi. So him learning new Dark Side tricks, dwelling into Sith lore, then killing fodder doesn't suggest a vast enough increase to go from losing pretty damn considerably to winning.