I don't have a problem with Obama because this is a list of the most honest, righteous, etc.
It isn't about people who are honest or righteous, merely the most honest people in a group where everyone is dishonest.
So when you think about it like that, I suppose it might make sense. If we're just talking overall about honesty and integrity then yes he belongs nowhere near that convo, but if we're talking about it in terms of which politicians come the closest to being decent? Eh.
Well, he certainly is not among the "most moral politicians in history" , that's for sure LOL.
But yeah, Obama might be one of those "honest believers" in truly terrible ideologies that the Left cherishes. That I can see.
Speaking of which, I'd say Sanders is possibly very honest in his belief in that deplorable socialism. I guess he earns some brownie points here.
Originally posted by Stigma
Well, he certainly is not among the "most moral politicians in history" , that's for sure LOL.But yeah, Obama might be one of those "honest believers" in truly terrible ideologies that the Left cherishes. That I can see.
Speaking of which, I'd say Sanders is possibly very honest in his belief in that deplorable socialism. I guess he earns some brownie points here.
Obama is on the left?
News to me.
When it comes to Obama, I cant help but see anything other than a poster boy. In a way that Bush was or possibly Nixon when he was VP, but even moreso. The major Democratic powers found him, dusted him up, said to him, "youre going to run the country, do as we say"
Obama thinks for a moment, agrees, but silently plans to have his own ideas in as well. But whenever he tries the GOP dont show up to work and the dems say to him "we told you to do as we say!"
Obamas really lost his smile over the years too.
Originally posted by Its2016
When it comes to Obama, I cant help but see anything other than a poster boy. In a way that Bush was or possibly Nixon when he was VP, but even moreso. The major Democratic powers found him, dusted him up, said to him, "youre going to run the country, do as we say"Obama thinks for a moment, agrees, but silently plans to have his own ideas in as well. But whenever he tries the GOP dont show up to work and the dems say to him "we told you to do as we say!"
Obamas really lost his smile over the years too.
Originally posted by Stigma
Disqualify every major politician from more than, say, two decades ago for their views on social issues like gay marriage; disqualify basically every politician not in the first world; disqualify every social conservative; disqualify everyone else who's ever been involved in a real political scandal; disqualify those with serious criminal records, etc. - yeah, Obama's percentile relative to the set of all politicians is very good.
Originally posted by The Ellimist
Disqualify every major politician from more than, say, two decades ago
But it’s nice that you scaled it way down and now make it sound a tiny bit more reasonable with this turn. Kudos 👆
Originally posted by The Ellimist
for their views on social issues like gay marriage; … disqualify every social conservative;
So someone cannot be moral because he is a social conservative? Talk about being biased and closed minded. Good job stating your partisan worldview.
Spoiler:👆
We already knew that, though.
Originally posted by The Ellimist
disqualify everyone else who's ever been involved in a real political scandal; disqualify those with serious criminal records,
Originally posted by The Ellimist
etc. - yeah, Obama's percentile relative to the set of all politicians is very good.
However, I guess you may be thinking about his record being relative to the presidents of the last two decades. Still, hardly a success for Obama to be perceived as perhaps a better person than Bill the Rapist and George the Stupid.
[quoteYou said Obama was “one of the most moral politicians in history” which is LOL-worthy.
But it’s nice that you scaled it way down and now make it sound a tiny bit more reasonable with this turn. Kudos
[/quote]
Do you have to try to be as linguistically inept as humanly possible, or does it just come naturally to you? Here, "disqualify" doesn't mean take out of the population under study, it means take out of those who could reasonably be more ethically agreeable than Obama. They're two entirely separate operations, and it's embarrassing that you conflated them so casually.
LOL wut?So someone cannot be moral because he is a social conservative? Talk about being biased and closed minded. Good job stating your partisan worldview. [SPOILER - highlight to read]: We already knew that, though.
Oh I'm sorry, did I trigger your feeling or something? Appeals to the golden mean aside, history does take sides. It has taken sides on:
- Criminalizing marital rape
- Legalizing homosexuality
- Civil Rights
- Not persecuting Jews
- Not persecuting left-handed people
- Not owning slaves
- Letting women vote
And yes, the social conservatives, by both the literal definition of the term (.i.e. tending against social change) and any sort of attempt to guess their mapping to current ideologies via demographics, argumentative style, geographic location, etc., stood on the wrong side of history on all these issues. Churchill claimed that allowing women to vote would open the doors for "any liberal issue under the sun" - and he was right, but not in the way he thought he was.
So Hillary is out, then.
Are you the type of person who is incapable of parsing people's arguments from one another, to the point where you literally repeat someone's statement back to them and claim that you're telling them something new?
No, it’s not.However, I guess you may be thinking about his record being relative to the presidents of the last two decades. Still, hardly a success for Obama to be perceived as perhaps a better person than Bill the Rapist and George the Stupid.
You didn't actually respond to my analysis, probably because it far exceeded your abilities, so let me spell it out for you in a more succinct manner. Obama's percentile, which is what we're dealing with here, is represented as:
Politicinas more ethical than him / All politicians
How many times smaller is the numerator than the denominator? Well, since the numerator excludes virtually all politicians before the mid-late 20th century, and almost certainly every, say, Roman senator who held like fifty slaves, I'd say a lot. Given that the vast majority of people in the course of human history lived before the major social changes of the past century, even if the number of politicians is weakly linked, you're going to have Obama being one of the most ethical of all time. It's simple math.
If you want to compare his morality normalized by era, that's another question, which I was obviously not addressing (my use of "technically" made it clear that I was making a very unique statistical point). But you weren't capable of actually responding to anything, a cognitive performance measure very strongly linked with your ideological bent.
Speaking of righteous politicians, what do people think of how Obama kinda recently dicked over some Cubans? By getting rid of the "wet foot, dry foot" policy. Which said that if you're Cuban and you set foot on US soil you can stay. If you're caught by us in the water? F*ck off. But now that is gone. Meaning water or land it doesn't matter. Some were apparently a few feet away from land when this order went into place.
I can sympathize, but I do not object. Though I figured some on the left will.
Originally posted by Surtur
Speaking of righteous politicians, what do people think of how Obama kinda recently dicked over some Cubans? By getting rid of the "wet foot, dry foot" policy. Which said that if you're Cuban and you set foot on US soil you can stay. If you're caught by us in the water? F*ck off. But now that is gone. Meaning water or land it doesn't matter. Some were apparently a few feet away from land when this order went into place.I can sympathize, but I do not object. Though I figured some on the left will.
I personally believe Obama is a project of positive publicity. He's done terrible things that, for some strange reason, nobody seems to care about. For example, his position on immigration wasn't exactly vastly superior to Trump's, as at least 3m were deported.
He wasn't the great and fantastic president everyone seems to think he was, imho.