High Skilled Immigrants

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Really? They must lack higher education. Ive rarely encountered Americans who are willing to do that sort of menial labor. Especially if they are educated. The work to income ratio is too vast.

There are plenty of people who don't have college educations that are willing to do hard work. My father had no problem working in freezing conditions every day of his life doing physical labor. He had to wear a special suit just to work, that is how cold it was(he worked in freezers in terms of food storage, etc.)

Let me tell you something, the pay isn't great, the hours aren't great, but he did it.

I know others who literally shovel shit for a living. Why? Because it pays at least a minimum wage as opposed to being able to pay someone under the table.

Not everyone is highly educated, but I have rarely met an individual just deem a job unworthy of them. It's because they have to compete with others who work illegally and thus have no choice but to take below minimum wage.

I won't say it never happens, but I cannot imagine where this myth came from. Well I guess I do know, it was from people trying to make up excuses for why illegal immigrants are good.

Originally posted by Surtur
There are plenty of people who don't have college educations that are willing to do hard work. My father had no problem working in freezing conditions every day of his life doing physical labor. He had to wear a special suit just to work, that is how cold it was(he worked in freezers in terms of food storage, etc.)

Let me tell you something, the pay isn't great, the hours aren't great, but he did it.

I know others who literally shovel shit for a living. Why? Because it pays at least a minimum wage as opposed to being able to pay someone under the table.

Not everyone is highly educated, but I have rarely met an individual just deem a job unworthy of them. It's because they have to compete with others who work illegally and thus have no choice but to take below minimum wage.

I won't say it never happens, but I cannot imagine where this myth came from. Well I guess I do know, it was from people trying to make up excuses for why illegal immigrants are good.

I get that. But y not go after the employers? If they're the ones required to pay fair wages yet choose not to do so wouldn't attacking the source of the problem make more progress

Originally posted by Sin I AM
I get that. But y not go after the employers? If they're the ones required to pay fair wages yet choose not to do so wouldn't attacking the source of the problem make more progress

They need to get both, but the employer definitely needs to pay.

Originally posted by krisblaze
They need to get both, but the employer definitely needs to pay.

True. I feel like both are at fault. Moreso on the employers who hire illegal immigrants. If businesses were shuttered and fines imposed then that would solve that problem although it wouldnt insure citizens get those jobs

Originally posted by Sin I AM
True. I feel like both are at fault. Moreso on the employers who hire illegal immigrants. If businesses were shuttered and fines imposed then that would solve that problem although it wouldnt insure citizens get those jobs

They do get fines, but probably minor ones...

Isn't that always the case with white collar criminals? They get a fine equal to a fraction of the sum they made off with.....

Originally posted by Sin I AM
I get that. But y not go after the employers? If they're the ones required to pay fair wages yet choose not to do so wouldn't attacking the source of the problem make more progress

I agree completely, we do need to go after the employers. We need to make it so it isn't beneficial to hire illegal labor. I'll gladly pay a bit more for some items.

But my point is..this person was saying all Trump supporters complain about these immigrants hurting the economy, but I was simply saying most of the time they aren't shaking their fists at software engineers and stuff like that.

But just reading the OP again it seems like this was more or less a bait thread that we both have been drawn into.

99 percent of threads in the gdf are bait so that goes without saying. Honestly im not so sure Americans know what they want. If we nixed all migrant workers and forced employers to pay higher wages then prices for services will skyrocket. We dont want tp be dependent on foreign oil yet cringe at using our own reserves. All cannot be pleased

Originally posted by Sin I AM
99 percent of threads in the gdf are bait so that goes without saying. Honestly im not so sure Americans know what they want. If we nixed all migrant workers and forced employers to pay higher wages then prices for services will skyrocket. We dont want tp be dependent on foreign oil yet cringe at using our own reserves. All cannot be pleased

Well yeah we would have to take a hit, but we did this to ourselves. We should have never relied on illegal labor. The penalties should be harsh. Fines are just part of the punishment, give these employers actual jail time for this.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
1. Being "highly skilled" =/= having a higher degree; there are plenty of the former who do not fall under the latter. Indeed, I know people who fall under the former (as in, taking shots at the IMO) but have to do the latter, even though it provides little direct value to their particular profession, just so they can have a shot at a green card.

You're incorrect. It literally says, right here that they are equivalent:

H-1B: Person in Specialty Occupation:

To work in a specialty occupation. Requires a higher education degree or its equivalent. Includes fashion models of distinguished merit and ability and government-to-government research and development, or co-production projects administered by the Department of Defense.

https://travel.state.gov/content/visas/en/employment/temporary.html

Emphasis mine, of course.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
2. I would love to see evidence for your claim that it's "extremely easy" to get a green card with a higher degree. Relative to someone else? Sure. But in absolute terms, every single person I know in that category has taken at least five years to receive one, even if they obtained a national interest waiver.

Evidence? Okay, I will provide some very solid evidence for you in a bit. But first, let's talk about your lack of evidence: the same applies to you. I would like to see your evidence that it is extremely difficult to get a visa on the categories you're concerned about.

Since I literally came from over a decade working in the government sector, I have hundreds of examples, some of them my direct employees (and a couple actually got their citizenships while in my direct employ). Your evidence seems to be an anecdote so my hundreds of anecdotes seem to prove how very easy it is for highly educated/highly skilled workers to get a visa and work in the US. Those numbers would be in the thousands if you include the temporary contracts (many British and Scottish experts would work for us in short 6-12 month contracts...great people, miss some of them). Still further than that, my direct experience in dozens of cases trying to get talent filled into contracts is about 2 months wait time and as fast as 6 weeks. But we were told that 6 weeks is for the frequent fliers who still had active security clearances (yeah...my situation may be worse than normal because they had to get federal security clearances before they started working on the contracts).

But here is your evidence:

http://faq.visapro.com/h1b-visa-faq6.asp

"The H1B processing time varies because all cases are different. Generally it takes between three to six months to process an H-1B visa. You must wait at least two weeks after you send in your application for a receipt from the USCIS and another two weeks before you call the USCIS to check the status."

Again, emphasis mine.

And the student visas get processed even faster especially if the student is good and stayed out of trouble in their home country. It took a few weeks for my GFs and her brother's to get through, for example.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
3. It takes several more years to get citizenship, which is necessary to work for various federal agencies.

We don't disagree, here. I agree that it takes too long. I don't see a justification for the extreme waiting periods.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Yes, this is true; but once you graduate, it's not guaranteed that your visa will be extended, even if you are, say, a high-profile engineer at a very prominent company. You know, to speak for some members of my social circle.

You are definitely correct. But any decent university will already have someone assigned to get your a student worker status a year or two before you are done and they will also place you into employers who know how to work with highly skilled and/or educated students so that if they choose to apply for a greencard, it is easier on all parties involved.

Also, extending a student visa after you graduate and are working is literally the wrong thing to do. It should definitely get denied. You're no longer a student. They would need to submit a change in status form and apply for the H1B status and/or have their employer sponsor them for their greencard.

If you think about this, it should be logical. If you graduate college and you're now working in your field of study...you are no longer a student: you are a worker. If your visa was approved to be a student, it should be obvious that it is not appropriate to now overstay your reason for approval. There are clear timeframes you communicate to USCIS when you get the student visa and approval is dependent upon the reasons and timeframes communicated.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
How long did it take them to get their green cards?

That depends on what kind of greencard that was applied for. Between 4-6 months, usually. The marriage greencard is different than the worker greencard which is also different from a refugee greencard.

https://www.uscis.gov/green-card/green-card-through-refugee-or-asylee-status/green-card-refugee

And processing times for each category can be different from each other.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
But then you're actually agreeing with me...

I'm not. Go back and read your OP to see what I'm disagreeing with.

the high skilled ones are generally here legally

How did the usa get to the point where poor mexicans could jump the border and work shitty wages and no one bats an eyelid? How did mexico get so shit? This genuinely confuses me.

I believe Mexico is shit because a lot of people would rather work in the US than rebuild their own country. The high skilled immigrants really hurt their native countries because they're sorely needed.

On the other hand you have to understand why they would rater emigrate than remain put. It's not just a matter of salary but also safety.

Immigrants from India are the exception, however, as the country barely has the infrastructure to support 1/3rd of its population and many people are locked out of the workforce due to nepotism, regardless of their education.

Okay, that sounds intelligent.

How involved are the drug cartels in Mexico? I hear theyre involved a lot.

Originally posted by Its2016
How did the usa get to the point where poor mexicans could jump the border and work shitty wages and no one bats an eyelid? How did mexico get so shit? This genuinely confuses me.

The most hilarious thing of all is Mexico's own laws about illegals and legal immigrants, which are actually much more harsh than our own.

We're basically expected to be the worlds daycare center.

Our own system is a joke. This one sheriff who is sheriff of a town very near the border has had the same illegals in his jails..sometimes 20-30 times lol. They just keep coming back.

Build wal. Where mah country gown?

Mexico has a wall on its southern border because central america is ****ed. Honduras especially.

I love peoples reactions when i say Trumps going to build a wall with a ****ing train on it.
"What? A train? Thats actually pretty clever"

Yes it is. Build a ****ing wall!

CNN has reported that walls just help terrorists though. So I guess that settles that.

CNN has taught me so much about the world. Most of it wrong, but still..quantity over quality I guess.

Originally posted by Surtur
CNN has reported that walls just help terrorists though. So I guess that settles that.

CNN has taught me so much about the world. Most of it wrong, but still..quantity over quality I guess.

And will literally report trump having no chance while trump supporters chant "lock her up" with trump signs in the background. Theyre actually helping trump.

I immensely enjoyed the CNN series that focused on the 1960's and then 70's, and in the latest season the 80's. It's very well done. It's almost like they have an excellent grip on the past, but a poor grasp of the present.

But then, that show had a lot of people normally not involved with CNN, and was also produced by Tom Hanks. Hanks is great with history.